* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting. CHARGING. [00:00:01] THERE IT IS. GOOD [Call to Order] EVENING. AND EVERYONE THANK YOU TO THANK YOU FOR ATTENDING THE WARREN COUNTY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WORK SESSION DATED APRIL 11TH, 2023. THANK YOU. UM, BEFORE WE BEGIN OUR, OUR DISCUSSIONS, UM, MR. MABE WOULD LIKE TO ADDRESS OUR COMMUNITY. SO, MR. MABE, THANK YOU. GOOD EVENING TO ALL OF YOU. UM, ESPECIALLY THESE GREAT PEOPLE THAT ARE SITTING IN FRONT OF US. THAT'S, UH, IT'S THE LIGHT OF MY DAY TO SEE Y'ALL FOLKS IN PERSON. I SAW, UH, A PICTURE OF YOU AND IT'S JUST NOT THE SAME TO SEE YOUR FACES. SO I, I DO LIKE THAT, BUT I'M NOT A, I'M NOT AN ELOQUENT SPEAKER. SORRY, I WROTE IT ALL DOWN. . UM, I WANT TO TAKE YOU ON A, JUST A STORY THAT I HAVE FOR YOU ABOUT A DAY LAST WEEK. UM, MOST OF OUR MEETINGS AS, AS WE HAVE THEM GO, IT'S A, IT'S A, IT'S A RUDIMENTARY THING. WE JUST GO AND DO OUR JOBS EVERY DAY AND WE DON'T THINK ABOUT WHAT WE DO. WE JUST DO IT. AND THAT'S A CALMING THING FOR ME. IT, IT ALWAYS HAS BEEN. I DON'T LIKE A WHOLE BUNCH OF STRIFE AND, BUT I DON'T MIND GETTING THE JOB DONE. AND I KNOW THAT I STRIVE TODAY EVERY AND EVERY DAY TO DO WHAT'S RIGHT FOR OUR COUNTY. UM, AND TONIGHT, TONIGHT WE HAVE DEPARTMENT MANAGERS HERE. WE HAVE FIRE PEOPLE HERE, WE HAVE SOME CITIZENS, AND SOMETIMES WE HAVE A WHOLE BUNCH OF CITIZENS. AND FRANKLY, I LOVE IT WHEN WE CAN FILL THIS ROOM UP. IT'S JUST, UH, MAKES ME FEEL THAT PEOPLE ARE GETTING INVOLVED. TONIGHT, I'D LIKE TO START IT OFF JUST A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. THIS PAST WEEK WAS UNIQUE FOR ME AND THOSE AROUND ME IN MY SMALL PATCH OF MY NEIGHBORHOOD, WHICH IS WHERE Y'ALL WERE. Y'ALL WERE IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. MY WIFE AND I LIVE IN THE TOWN AND IN THE SANTOR DISTRICT AS MOST COUNTRY, UH, MOST COUNTY AND TOWNS, UH, CONSTITUENTS DO. I LIVE IT DAILY AND HAVE MY ROUTINE DOWN FAIRLY WELL. IT'S A HARD, IT'S HARD SOMETIMES, BUT MOSTLY CONSISTENT. AS MANY WORK, AS MUCH, MUCH OF MY WORK GOES DAYS, DAYS ON END WITHOUT INCIDENT. I GET UP, I HAVE MY CUP OF COFFEE, I START CHECKING MY PHONE CALLS, MY CHECK, MY EMAILS. I MAKE A CALL OR TWO IN ABOUT EIGHT OR NINE. AND I FINISHED GETTING DRESSED AND STARTING MY DAY, I VISIT WHERE I NEED TO GO AND JUST DO WHAT'S ASKED OF ME. GOOD OR BAD. I THINK ABOUT THE JOB A LOT. I STUDY AND LEARN HOW THINGS CONTINUE TO WORK, BUT I NEVER THINK MUCH ABOUT HOW IT DOES IT. BUT I JUST THINK ABOUT MY JOB. I ENJOY IT AND I ENJOY IT A LOT. HONESTLY, IT'S NOT ABOUT A DAY OF, OF WALT. IT'S NOT. ON APRIL 6TH, WHICH WAS LAST THURSDAY, I OPENED MY DOOR FOR THE FIRST TIME TO LOOK AT MY DAY. I WANTED TO KNOW WHETHER IT WAS WET OR SNOWING OR RAINING OR SUN SHINING OR WINDY. I, I WANTED TO KNOW, CUZ THAT'S ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I DO EVERY DAY. WHAT I SAW WAS A FIRETRUCK, TWO AMBULANCES, AND PEOPLE AROUND RUSHING WITH DOORS OPENED ON THE AMBULANCE. WHAT'S GOING ON? IN A FEW MINUTES, IT ALL SETTLED DOWN AND AMBULANCE DOORS WERE BEGINNING TO CLOSE. I LOOKED AND ASKED MYLA ASKED MY WIFE, WHAT DID YOU DO? SHE OF COURSE LAUGHED AND GAVE ME THAT DAGGER STARE. AND WE WENT ON ABOUT OUR DAY. I LATER WAS TOLD WHAT WAS GOING ON. WHEN I SPOKE TO GARY, UH, AS THE ASSISTANT FIRE CHIEF. HERE'S WHAT WAS RELEASED ON FACEBOOK. WARREN COUNTY FIRE. WARREN COUNTY FRONT ROYAL CRUISE DELIVER BABY. [00:05:02] JUST AFTER NINE 30 THIS MORNING, WARREN COUNTY FIRE AND FRONT ROYAL UNITS WERE DISPATCHED FOR A LABOR AND DELIVERY. A CALL INVOLVING A 23 YEAR OLD FEMALE. THE FEMALE WAS NOTED TO BE 35 WEEKS INTO THE PREGNANCY AND WAS IN ACTIVE LABOR WITH A BABY CROWNING UPON THE, THE ARRIVAL OF THE EMS. EMS CREWS FROM MEDIC ONE AND MEDIC TWO PERFORMED CHILDBIRTH ASSESSMENT AND TREATMENT. A BABY GIRL WAS DELIVERED BY EMS. PROVIDERS ON THE SCENE WITHOUT INCIDENT, THE MOTHER AND BABY WERE TREATED AND TRANSPORTED TO WINCHESTER, UH, MEDICAL CENTER WITHOUT INCIDENT. FIRE CHIEF BEZA EXPRESSED HIS DEEPEST APPRECIATION FOR THE ADDITIONS, UH, OR THE ACTIONS OF THE EMS PROVIDERS AND OFFERED TO THEM A JOB. WELL DONE. MR. MANCUSO GAVE ME A PICTURE. THAT'S ALL I HAD. I DIDN'T, I DON'T KNOW YOUR FACES, BUT I HOPE WHEN I SEE YOU AGAIN, I'LL KNOW WHO YOU ARE. FIREFIGHTER KENNY, WOULD YOU STAND UP FOR ME? FIREFIGHTER CHRIS, CHRIS. I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SAY THE LAST NAME. I'M SORRY. SAY IT FOR ME. KREY. GOOD. THANK YOU. FIREFIGHTER BRONSON, CHIEF BONNO, FIRE CHIEF HOME FIREFIGHTER HUNT, AND LIEUTENANT OLIVER. I WAS DES I WAS SURPRISED TO SAY THE LEAST. IT STARTED ME THINKING THESE SIX PEOPLE DE DELIVERED A BABY IN MY NEIGHBORHOOD. THEY MADE A DECISION THAT UNDER CIRCUMSTANCES OF THE EMS, THEY COULD DO THE DELIVERY. RIGHT THEN. THERE WAS NO HESITATION, NO DELIVERY, NO DELAYS. JUST DO IT. THESE LADIES AND GENTS WERE TRAINED TO DO SOMETHING THAT I AM JUST NOT SURE I COULD DO. NOR DO I EVER WANT TO FIND OUT . THIS IS WHAT WE TAKE FOR GRANTED SOMETIMES. I KNOW THAT I DO. THEY ARE THE TOOLS OF OUR TRADE IN PROTECTING OUR COUNTY. THEY KEEP THE COMMUNITY IN OUR COUNTY. THEY ARE TRAINED TO DO THEIR JOBS THANKS TO OUR LEADERS AND THE DESIRE TO BE AND THE DESIRE THAT THEY BE CALLED THE BEST OF THE BEST YOU ARE. THEY MAY SAY, THEY MAY SAY IT ALL DAY IN THE DAY'S WORK, BUT IT'S NOT. IT'S A GIFT. THEY SHARE AND GIVE FREELY. AND THEY OFTEN SAY LIFE MATTERS. AND THIS BEAUTIFUL LITTLE LIFE THAT THEY BROUGHT INTO THE WORLD UNDER THESE CIRCUMSTANCES HAS A STORY. FROM THIS DAY FORWARD, HE'LL ALWAYS BE REMEMBERED. SHE WILL ALWAYS REMEMBER THE DAY THAT SHE WAS BORN, NOT BECAUSE IT'S HER BIRTHDAY, BUT BECAUSE PEOPLE LIKE YOU TOOK CARE OF HER AND MADE SURE THAT SHE WAS BROUGHT INTO THIS WORLD. OUR COUNTY IS BETTER, BETTER BECAUSE OF THE PEOPLE LIKE YOU. THE BEST OF THE BEST IN EVERY AREA. THERE'S SO MUCH THAT I COULD SAY ABOUT IT, BUT I COULD JUST TALK ON FOR A LONG TIME AND I DON'T BELIEVE Y'ALL WANT TO HEAR THAT. I JUST WANT TO SAY FROM THE BO FROM THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND FROM THE COUNTY, THANK YOU FOR WHAT YOU DO AND WHAT YOU CHOSE TO DO. YOU MAKE A DIFFERENCE EVERY TIME YOU DO YOUR JOB EVERY DAY. IT IS OUR COUNTY AND I'M GLAD YOU'RE PART OF IT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU MR. MAID. GOOD JOB. BE SAFE EVERYONE. VERY WELL. SO WE'LL MOVE ON TO OUR, OH, NOW I'M GONNA CALL THE MEETING TO ORDER . [00:10:02] SO, UH, [A. Discussion - 2023-2024 United Healthcare Insurance Renewal - Jane Meadows, Human Resources Director] THE FIRST TOPIC ON OUR WORK SE WORK SESSION AGENDA IS THE 20 23 20 24 UNITED HEALTHCARE INSURANCE RENEWAL. MS. MEADOWS. OH, THERE YOU GO, MARK. HI, HOW ARE YOU? HOW ARE YOU? SO WE HAVE RE DECIDED TO REMAIN WITH UNITEDHEALTHCARE THIS YEAR AGAIN. SO THIS WILL BE OUR THIRD YEAR WITH UNITED. UM, THE TEAM IS GETTING ACCUSTOMED TO THE NEW PLAN, HOW TO USE IT, THE INS AND OUTS. UM, WHEN WE INITIALLY SAW THE RENEWAL RATE, UM, IT WAS A 13% INCREASE FOR MEDICAL COVERAGE, UM, WHICH WAS SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER THAN THE INDUSTRY AVERAGE OF A LITTLE OVER 7%. UM, WE WENT THROUGH OUR CLAIMS INFORMATION WITH UNITED. THIS WAS THE FIRST YEAR THAT WE HAD A FULL 12 MONTH LOOK BACK FOR THEM TO LOOK AT OUR RATINGS. UM, AND THEY WERE ABLE TO LOWER OUR INCREASE TO AN 8% INCREASE. UM, AND THEN WE ALSO HAD THEM LOOK AT OUR DENTAL RATES CUZ THAT INITIALLY CAME AT A 10% INCREASE AND THEY'VE LOWERED THAT. SO IT'S FLAT, SO THERE'S NO INCREASE. AND WITH VISION, WE ACTUALLY HAD A REDUCTION. UM, I JOKINGLY TOLD ALYSSA, THEY GAVE US QUARTERBACK, UM, EVERY LITTLE BIT HELPS. UM, BUT WITH WHAT WE HAVE, WE FEEL THAT IT'S IMPORTANT TO REMAIN WITH THAT. WE THINK THAT THE COUNTY SHOULD ABSORB THE 8% INCREASE RATHER THAN PASSING IT ALONG TO OUR EMPLOYEES. UM, WE DO HAVE A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER OF EMPLOYEES IN OUR PLAN, BUT WE DO HAVE A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER THAT ARE NOT IN OUR PLAN BECAUSE OF THE COST. SO WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE REALLY ARE CONTROLLING THOSE COSTS. IN YOUR PACKETS, YOU HAVE THE MEDICAL, THE DENTAL, AND THE VISION RENEWALS. UM, AND I WILL HAVE THE FINALIZED RATES IN THE APPROVAL PACKET FOR THE NEXT MEETING. ANY QUESTIONS ON OUR DECISION TO STAY WITH UNITED OR THE INCREASES THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING THIS YEAR? I, I HAVE A QUESTION. IF SO, WITH UNITED HEALTHCARE, SO HOW, WHAT IS THE RHYTHM OR HOW FREQUENTLY DOES THE COUNTY GO OUT AND, AND BASICALLY BID THE HEALTHCARE COVERAGE TO SEE IF THERE'RE OR IF SOMEBODY ELSE WILL COME IN WITH A LOWER RATE? SO WE OPTED NOT TO, WELL, IT'S BEEN THREE YEARS SINCE WE WENT OUT TO BED. UM, IT'S NOT VERY FREQUENT THAT YOU DO GO OUT TO BED BECAUSE OF THAT EXPERIENCE RATING. SINCE WE JUST SWITCHED, UM, WE WOULDN'T HAVE A LOT OF BASIC DATA TO PROVIDE TO CARRIERS. UM, THE CARRIER THAT WE LEFT FROM, THEY WOULD BASE THEIR DATA ON OUR HISTORICAL DATA AND PART OF WHY WE SWITCHED WAS, UH, 20%, UM, PROPOSED INCREASE FROM THEM. UM, SO THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WE'RE LIKE, WE'RE NOT GOING TO GO THERE AGAIN. UM, AND SOME OF THE OTHER PROVIDERS, UM, WE'VE LOOKED AT NEIGHBORING THE SCHOOLS, KIND OF WHAT THEY'VE DONE AND THEY'VE SWITCHED AWAY FROM THEM JUST BECAUSE OF BASICALLY DISSATISFACTION WITH THE PROVIDERS. SO WE ELECTED NOT TO GO OUT TO BED THIS YEAR, UM, AND TO BASICALLY REMAIN STABLE BECAUSE IF WE GO OUT TO BED AND SWITCH PROVIDERS, BASICALLY EVERYTHING THAT SOMEBODY PRE-APPROVALS FOR DOCTORS, MEDICATIONS, ALL OF THAT, WE'D GO BACK TO SQUARE ONE, EVEN IF WE SWITCHED BACK TO BLUE CROSS, UM, BECAUSE WE CAN BE CONSIDERED NEW. SO WE WANTED TO MAINTAIN WHAT WE'RE AT SINCE THE TEAM IS STARTING TO UTILIZE THE FULL ASPECTS OF THE PLAN. FOR THE FIRST YEAR, THEY WEREN'T REALLY UTILIZING THE INS AND OUTS OF THE PLAN. WE FEEL LIKE EDUCATION WAS NECESSARY. SO NOW THEY'RE STARTING TO UNDERSTAND THE PLANS. UM, WE'RE HAVING FEWER INSTANCES OF CONFUSION WITH HOW TO ACTUALLY UTILIZE THE PLAN. UM, SO THAT'S WHY WE DIDN'T GO OUT TO BED. MR. BUTLER, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION? YEAH, UM, UH, I JUST WANTED TO FIND OUT, UH, WHAT TYPE OF FEEDBACK HAVE YOU GOTTEN FROM THE, FROM THE COUNTY EMPLOYEES? UH, LIKE ON THE AVAILABILITY OF DOCTORS, THE, UH, YOU KNOW, THE, CUZ I KNOW THAT SOME OF THE PLANS, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE A LITTLE BIT CHEAPER MM-HMM. , UH, YOU MAY NOT HAVE THE, THE SAME SELECTION OF MM-HMM. OF DOCTORS AND THEN YOU'VE GOT OTHER PLANS THAT, UM, ARE CHEAPER AND THEY'VE GOT A WIDE RANGE OF DOCTORS MM-HMM. THAT YOU CAN GO TO. SO WITH UNITEDHEALTHCARE, IT HAS A VERY ROBUST, UM, NETWORK. THE GREAT THING IS IT'S NOT JUST CENTRALIZED TO THE VALLEY. WE HAVE A LOT OF EMPLOYEES THAT LIVE IN DIFFERENT AREAS. AND SO IF THEY LIVE IN PAGE COUNTY, THEY'RE ABLE TO UTILIZE CENTARA HEALTHCARE AS WELL. UM, SOME OF THE OTHER INSURANCE PROVIDERS ARE STILL HAVING ISSUES WITH VALLEY HEALTH. UM, AND SO LUCKILY UNITED AND VALLEY ARE WORKING VERY [00:15:01] WELL TOGETHER. SO THE MAJORITY OF OUR EMPLOYEES THAT LIVE IN THIS AREA HAVE HAD NO ISSUES UTILIZING IT. WITH VALLEY HEALTH. WE DO HAVE A PROVIDER ISSUE, BUT THAT'S ACROSS THE BOARD. WE DON'T HAVE A LOT OF MEDICAL PROVIDERS IN THE REGION. UM, AND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WILL CONTINUE TO HAVE A CHALLENGE WITH. UM, WE ACTUALLY DISCUSSED THE EXPLORATION OF US. I KEEP CALLING IT A DOC IN A BOX, BUT BASICALLY A COUNTY FUNDED MEDICAL PROVIDER, UM, THAT WOULD SEE OUR EMPLOYEES AS A PRIORITY. UM, AND AND HOW ABOUT THE FEEDBACK THAT YOU GET ON THE VISION AND THE DENTAL? UH, WITH THE VISION, A LOT OF TIMES PEOPLE WEREN'T SURE HOW TO USE IT. UM, AFTER WE'VE TALKED ABOUT HOW TO USE IT, NO PROBLEM WITH DENTAL. THEY CAN GO TO ANY PROVIDER THEY WANT AND IT'S NOT A PROBLEM. UM, A LOT OF IT IS KNOWING HOW TO USE THE PLAN, EVERYTHING FROM THE REIMBURSEMENT CARD, THE CARE CASH CARD, AND THEN OUR, WE HAVE A BUILT-IN CALLED BENEFIT ALLY. SO IF YOU HAVE ANY CATASTROPHIC, WHETHER IT'S YOU HAVE STITCHES OR YOU HAVE A HEART ATTACK, A CHECK WILL BE SENT TO YOU STRICTLY FROM THE BILLING IN ORDER TO HELP MANAGE THOSE MEDICAL COSTS. AND EMPLOYEES HAVE BEEN VERY POSITIVE ABOUT THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT HAVING TO COME OUT OF POCKET AND IT REALLY COVERS ALL OF THEIR COPAYS AND THEIR PREMIUM. SO THEY'VE BEEN VERY PLEASED WITH THAT. WHAT IS THAT CALLED AGAIN, JANE? IT IS BENEFIT ALLY. OKAY. HMM. AND IT'S BASED OFF OF THE BILLING. SO HOWEVER THE DOCTOR'S OFFICE SUBMITS THAT EMERGENCY CARE, A CHECK WILL BE CUT DIRECTLY TO THE EMPLOYEE BASED OFF OF THAT. SO I HAVE PEOPLE WHO ARE LIKE, HEY, I JUST GOT A CHECK, IS IT OKAY TO CASH IT? ABSOLUTELY. AND IS THERE AN HSA COMPONENT OF THE, THERE'S A REIMBURSEMENT COM COMPONENT, IT'S CALLED CARE CASH, AND YOU CAN USE THAT FOR COPAYS AND THEN FOR CERTAIN QUALIFYING QUALIFIED DOCTORS. SO THERE ARE CERTAIN PARAMETERS AS TO WHAT YOU CAN USE IT. UM, DEPENDING ON THE ENROLLMENT, IT'S EITHER 200 OR $500 TOWARDS THE PLAN COST. ONE MORE QUESTION. MM-HMM. , WHAT IS THE EIGHT? HOW MUCH IS THE 8% THAT THE COUNTY IS GONNA ABSORB? DO YOU HAVE THAT IN A, IN A REAL HARD NUMBER? ? I DO. UM, SO THE RATES ARE GOING UP, BASICALLY IT'S CLOSE TO $300,000 THAT WE'RE OKAY. INCREASING. AND IF YOU THE ACTUAL HEALTHCARE RENEWAL, IT'S THE VERY LIKE, LAST LINE OF IT. OKAY. SO IT HAS THE EXACT DOLLARS AND CENTS. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? MINE'S MORE OF A COMMENT. I'VE HAD QUITE A FEW, UM, STAFF PEOPLE THROUGHOUT THE COUNTY SAY, YOU KNOW, THEY'RE, THEY'RE NOT HAPPY BECAUSE THE PROVIDERS ARE NOT THERE. AND SO WHERE IF YOU'RE IN NETWORK, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY THAT DIFFERENCE. THEY'RE PAYING MORE OUT OF POCKET BECAUSE THEY HAVE TO PAY THE DIFFERENCE OF, WITH THE NORMAL USUAL CHARGE, THEY'RE PAYING THE EXTRA. AND WITH THE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S THE ONLY COMPLAINT I HAVE HEARD SO FAR. YEAH. WITH THE LOCAL CHOICE. SO WITH BLUE CROSS, YOU COULD BASICALLY GO TO ANY PROVIDER. IT DIDN'T MATTER WHETHER THEY WERE IN NETWORK OR OUT OF NETWORK, THEY WERE ALL CONSIDERED AN IN-NETWORK DOCTOR. UM, AND IF WE WERE TO SWITCH TO THAT, WE WOULD HAVE A SIGNIFICANT INCREASE. IT'D BE 20% ABOVE WHERE WE'RE AT RIGHT NOW. DO WE KNOW IF UNITED IS MAKING ANY EFFORTS TO GET MORE PROVIDERS ON BOARD? THERE ARE, AND THERE ARE THINGS THAT EMPLOYEES CAN DO. SO IF YOU'RE GOING TO A DOCTOR THAT'S OUT OF NETWORK AND YOU CAN ASK THE DOCTOR, ARE YOU INTERESTED IN BECOMING PART OF THE NETWORK? AND THEY CAN ACTUALLY REACH OUT TO UNITED AND IF THERE'S A DOCTOR THAT WE KNOW IS INTERESTED, WE CAN HAVE UNITED ACTUALLY REACH OUT TO THEM. OKAY. THANK YOU. MM-HMM. , ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NOPE. THANK YOU. WELL, THANK YOU. NEXT ITEM ON [B. Discussion - CY 2023 Tax Rate Equalization - Sherry Sours, Commissioner of the Revenue] THE AGENDA IS THE CALENDAR YEAR 2023. TAX RATE EQUALIZATION MS. SELLERS. I MADE COPIES OF THE SHEETS OF THE EQUALIZATION. I SEE THIS ONE HERE. YES. YES. UM, THE VERY TOP FIGURE IS THE PREVIOUS TAX YEAR, 22 TAX DOLLARS. YOU TAKE THAT TAX DOLLAR TOTAL MULTIPLY BY THE 101% AND THEN YOU GET THE 32 MILLION FIGURE. AND THEN THE 23 TAXABLE ASSESSMENT. WE RUN EDITS ON THE BOOK. OF COURSE, WE'RE CONSTANTLY CHANGING, SO THIS COULD CHANGE A LITTLE BIT. SO THIS VALUE FOR 23, YOU TAKE THAT AND YOU SUBTRACT [00:20:01] OFF THE LAND USE, YOU SUBTRACT OFF THE NEW CONSTRUCTION, AND THEN YOU HAVE A BALANCE. AND THAT'S YOUR NEUTRAL REVENUE CALCULATION. SO YOU COME ON DOWN HERE TO THE MIDDLE WAYS OF THE SHEET WHERE YOUR 32 MILLION FIGURE IS AT, AND YOU DIVIDE THAT BY THAT REVENUE NEUTRAL CALCULATION VALUE ASSESSED VALUE. AND THEN, UM, THE ALLOWABLE TAX RATE WITHOUT PUBLIC HEARING IS THE 49 CENTS. AND THEN BELOW IT, I'VE SHOWED DIFFERENT RATES THAT YOU COULD PICK. UM, THE 48 CENTS, WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF A LOSS. THE 49 CENTS, THERE'S A LOSS OF $41,000. AND THEN IF YOU GO UP 49 AND A HALF CENTS, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE A GAIN OF 284,747. IF IT WAS 50 CENTS, WHICH IS THE NEXT FULL CENT RATE INCREASE UPWARDS, THEN YOU WOULD HAVE A GAIN OF $611,271. SO THAT JUST KIND OF GIVE YOU AN IDEA OF WHAT, WHAT THE RATES COULD BE AND WHAT THE MONEY WOULD BE OR LOSS DEPENDING ON WHAT YOU SET. SO WHEN YOU SAY LOSS, IS THAT FROM THE, THE TAXES THAT WE ARE COLLECTING NOW FOR THIS YEAR? RIGHT. IT WOULD BE THE TAXES YOU WOULD NOT BE COLLECTING. COLLECTING HERE FOR THIS YEAR. OKAY. YEAH. AND THEN THE GAIN OF COURSE WOULD BE THE OPPOSITE. SO YES. OKAY. YES. SO IT KIND OF GIVES YOU AN IDEA OF, SO THESE FOUR RATES, ARE THESE RATES THAT WE NEED TO DISCUSS OR TO UNDERSTAND A LITTLE BIT FURTHER? OR IS THIS A DECISION THE BOARD WILL BE MAKING IN THE FUTURE? IN THE IMMINENT FUTURE? MA'AM? UM, YOU NEED TO UNDERSTAND THIS, WHAT THIS SHEET MEANS. NOW, UH, WE'RE GONNA COME BACK AND SHOW YOU THE BILLING SCHEDULE AFTER BIT WHEN YOU GET TO THE BUDGET. BUT IT'S, UH, IT'S AN IMMINENT DECISION ON YOUR PART TO DECIDE WHICH WAY YOU WANT TO GO. BUT YOU NEED TO, FIRST THING IS TO UNDERSTAND THE SHEET MM-HMM. . SO YOU KNOW WHAT THE 48, 49 AND THE 50 AND ANY OTHER NUMBER YOU WANT TO PICK REPRESENT. SO WHEN DO YOU ANTICIPATE THE CHANGES TO STOP MOVE, UM, COMING IN, WE WILL MAKE CHANGES CLEAN ON UP UNTIL WE PRINT THE BOOK. AND THAT'S THE END OF THIS MONTH. SO THE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION IS GOING TO MEET NEXT MONTH. NEXT MONTH, OKAY. AND THEY WILL BE MEETING THROUGH AUGUST, APPROXIMATELY TO THE END OF AUGUST. SO THEY'LL BE MEETING THROUGH AUGUST. SO SOMEBODY MAY HAVE THEIR TAX BILL CHANGED MID-JULY AFTER MEETING WITH THE BOARD. AND THEN THERE'S A PROCESS FOR THAT. BUT THIS WILL BE A CONTINUOUS PROCESS FOR THE NEXT, UH, FOUR OR FIVE MONTHS. SO USUALLY IF WE DIDN'T HAVE AN EXTENSION ON THE REASSESSMENT, WE WOULD HAVE THAT B O E HEARING STUFF ALL OVER WITH BEFORE WE DID THE BOOK. MM-HMM. , BUT NOT THIS YEAR BECAUSE OF THE EXTENSION. SO WHEN DO WE ANTICIPATE IF US APPROVING THE FISCAL YEAR 24 BUDGET? IS THAT, I MEAN, IF IN MAY. IN MAY, RIGHT? MM-HMM. , DEPENDING UPON HOW YOU DECIDE TO APPROACH THE, UH, THE FRIENDLY STATE OF THE, UH, HOW THE, THE RUMORS ARE, UH, THAT THEY WILL NOT COME TO A CONCLUSION WE MADE. THE RUMORS MAY BE WRONG, CAN VERY WELL BE SURPRISED. EXCUSE ME. BUT THEY'RE EXPECTED TO NOT, THEY'RE EXPECTED TO AGREE TO DISAGREE, WHICH MEANS WE WILL NOT HAVE A STATE BUDGET OTHER THAN THE ONE THAT'S ALREADY THERE. WE HAVE A STATE BUDGET, BUT WE WOULD REVERT TO THE BUDGET ORIGINALLY APPROVED LAST YEAR. AND THAT AGAIN, WE'RE GONNA DISCUSS AND IT BECOMES PARTICULARLY IMPORTANT WHEN YOU MEET THE SCHOOLS ON THURSDAY. CAUSE IT'S A KEY FACTOR IN THEIR BUDGET AND DELIBERATIONS. IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FROM THE BOARD? YEAH, I'VE GOT ONE. IF WE CAN THEORETICALLY TO COVER WHAT WE NEED TO [00:25:01] COVER. I MEAN, WE'VE GOT A BUDGET THAT WE'RE TRYING TO DEAL WITH. YES, SIR. AND I DO NOT, I PERSONALLY DON'T WANT TO GO INTO IT KNOWING THAT I HAVE THE POTENTIAL OF LOSING $700,000, BUT I ALSO DON'T WANT TO GO INTO IT KNOWING THAT I COULD MAKE $600,000. SO THERE'S A HAPPY MEDIUM SOMEPLACE THAT WE, I THINK NEED TO DISCUSS AMONGST OURSELVES AND ANYBODY ELSE THAT WANTS TO BE INVOLVED IN IT TO BE ABLE TO SAY, THESE ARE THE THINGS THAT WE WOULD LIKE TO DO AND WE NEED TO PLAN FOR THOSE. BECAUSE IF WE DON'T PLAN FOR THEM, WE WON'T GET 'EM AT ALL. UH, WE ANTICIPATE YOU'LL BE TALKING AMONGST YOURSELVES AS YOU SUGGEST, AND PARTICULARLY AFTER YOU MEET THE SCHOOLS AND SEE WHAT THEY'RE PROPOSING. AND THEN YOU'LL BE TALKING AGAIN, SELMAN, TO DECIDE WHERE YOU WANT TO GO. AND WE'RE GONNA GIVE YOU SOME NUMBERS TO PLAY AROUND WITH AFTER BID HERE. THANK YOU. I HAVE A, SO MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT, UM, CAN WE START AT THE TOP? SURE. SO THE, THE PREVIOUS YEAR REAL ESTATE TAX LEVY WAS BASED ON 31 MILLION. YES. THE 101% IS, YOU CANNOT RAISE TAXES MORE THAN 1% BY STATE CODE. RIGHT. OKAY. SO THAT'S HOW WE GET TO THIS NUMBER OF 32 MILLION. YES. UH, YES. $41,076. AND SO THAT GIVES US A SIX. SO THE 2023 TAXABLE ASSESSMENT IS 6 MILLION. HOW DO YOU GET THAT NUMBER? THAT'S THE VALUE OF A PENNY. ONE PENNY ONE, ONE MILL. WHAT YOU ASK THEM TO. OKAY. OKAY. THANK YOU. SO THAT'S THE ONE PENNY. ALRIGHT. DIFFERENCE. AND THEN, UM, AND THEN WE HAVE THE LAND USE DEFERMENTS, WHICH ARE FARMERS AND THE, THE ONES THAT HAVE BEEN PUT BACK IN AS TAXABLE, UM, NEW CONSTRUCTION. AND THEN YOU HAVE THE 2023 NET TAXABLE ASSESSMENT FOR REVENUE NEUTRAL CALCULATION, WHICH IS 6,530,000. WHERE DID THAT NUMBER COME FROM? THAT'S THE VALUE. THE VALUE OF THAT'S THE VAL, THAT'S THE ASSESSED VALUE ON THE 23 BOOK. OKAY. THAT'S ESTIMATED. YES. SO IS IS THAT THE DIFFERENCE? THAT IS YOUR 23 TAXABLE ASSESSMENT TO 6.9 MINUS THE LAND USE, DEFERRED ADDING ONLY TAXABLE, SUBTRACTING THE CONSTRUCTION. AND THEN YOU HAVE COME UP WITH 6.5 MILLION. OKAY. SO WE TAKE THE 6.9 MILLION AND WE'RE SUBTRACTING ALL THESE NUMBERS AND WE COME UP WITH THE 6.5. YES, THANK YOU . I'M TRYING TO MAKE ALL THIS WORK. SO, ALRIGHT. AND SO THEN IN ORDER OF THESE, THESE NUMBERS DOWN HERE, TO DO A REVENUE NEUTRAL, IT SAYS THAT WE'D HAVE TO TAX AT 0.4 49 CENTS WITH SIX 100 S BASICALLY. MM-HMM. OF A PENNY. WE COULD, WE WOULD GO, WE WOULD RECOMMEND 49. OKAY. UM, SO 49 IS A LOSS OF $41,000 TO THE CURRENT BUDGET OF THE CURRENT NEW REVENUE. YES. SO ANYTHING BEYOND 49 THOUGH, WHAT YOU SAID, I THINK WHAT I HEARD YOU SAY IS THAT WILL IN 49 AND A HALF OR 50 WOULD REQUIRE PUBLIC HEARING. YES. OKAY. ALRIGHT. I GOT IT CLEARS MUD , I GOT IT. NINE. YOU COULD GO POINTS OH SIX. BUT IN REALITY, YOU REALLY WANT TO HAVE A, A NUMBER THAT'S EASY FOR EVERYONE TO KNOW AND UNDERSTAND. SO IT REALLY SHOULD BE 49, 49 AND A HALF OR 50. OKAY. ANYTHING ABOVE THAT 49 IS REQUIRED PUBLIC CARE. OKAY. SO, SO I, I GET THIS AND, AND IT'S 6,530 MILLION. UH, FIGURE THERE, WOULD IT BE, WOULD IT BE WISE, YOU KNOW, PROPITIOUS FOR US TO TAKE A LOOK AT THIS AND GO, WELL, WE KNOW THAT WE'VE GOT THE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION COMING UP. WE ALSO WANT TO, TO, YOU KNOW, UM, GIVE, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, UH, TAX BREAKS TO THE ELDERLY, TO THE, TO THE FOLKS LIKE THAT. UM, WOULD IT BE, YOU KNOW, SMART FORCE TO TAKE A LOOK AT THIS AND GO, OKAY, WELL THAT, THAT WILL PROBABLY GO DOWN BECAUSE YOU KNOW, THE, WHEN, WHEN YOU TAKE, YOU WALK DOWN A LITTLE BIT, GO DOWN, DOWN A LITTLE BIT, SLOW DOWN A LITTLE BIT. SO THEN, UH, YOU COULD SAY THAT YEAH, THAT BREAKEVEN POINT WOULD PROBABLY BE AROUND 49 OR MAYBE JUST A LITTLE BIT BELOW THAT. IF IT'S 40.9 THEN TWICE. OKAY. IF YOU GO DOWN BELOW THE 49. OKAY. THEN YOU LOSE [00:30:01] WHEN YOUR PRINCIPLE IS REDUCED. EXAMPLE BEING AT THE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION. RIGHT. SO THAT MEANS YOU'RE TAKING 0, 0 4, 9 TIMES A SMALLER NUMBER. WELL, NOW WHAT I WAS WONDERING WAS, UH, JUST, JUST TAKING A LOOK AT, EXCUSE ME, THAT, UH, 6,000,530 MILLION AND SAYING, WELL, IT MAY BE LIKE 6.5 MM-HMM. INSTEAD OF, AND AND SAYING THAT IT'LL BE 30 MILLION LESS. UH, AND FOR US TO PLAN THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, WHEN, WHEN THE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION COMES THROUGH AND THEY, THEY START TO, TO, YOU KNOW, YEAH, THAT'S 6 MILLION. OH, THAT'S 6 MILLION. HE TALKING ABOUT THE 30 30. HE WAS SAYING IT WAS JUST 6.5. OKAY. HE DROPPED BY 30 MILLION. YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. I'M GOOD. AND HE'LL BE COMING BACK TO THIS RIGHT. AMONGST THE SELL ONCE YOU JUST KNOW HOW THE SHEET WORKS. I HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION. SO THE, THE 49 CENTS, THE 49 AND A HALF, THE 50 CENTS, HOW DOES THAT IMPACT BOTH INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL? THERE'S ONE TAX RATE FOR EVERYTHING. CORRECT. AND SO WHAT IS THE REVENUE THAT WE WILL SEE ON INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL? IS, IS THAT'S REVENUE NEUTRAL OR NO, THAT SHOULD GO UP, RIGHT? NO, EVERYBODY'S, IF YOU PUT 50 RATHER THAN 49 AND EVERYBODY COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL, RESIDENTIAL, EVERYTHING GOES UP BASICALLY 2% ON A 49 TOTAL BASE. OKAY. UH, SO RESIDENTIAL AND INDUSTRIAL GO UP SAME AS EVERYBODY ELSE. CORRECT. BUT MY UNDERSTANDING FROM PREVIOUS MEETINGS IS THAT WHILE FOR EVERY YEAR INDUSTRIAL TIERS DOWN A PERCENTAGE, SO THEY WILL GO TO THEIR FULL 100% OF THEIR, UH, VALUE IN THIS YEAR. CORRECT. SO THAT SHOULD BE AN INCREASE OVER LAST YEAR. IS THAT RIGHT? IS THAT MY UNDERSTANDING OR AM I ROLE THE RATIO? I'M TALKING ABOUT THE RATIOS, THE RATIO BETWEEN LAST, THE LAST ASSESSMENT AND THIS ONE. YES. SO WHATEVER THE DIFFERENCE WAS BETWEEN 19 AND 23, BE IT 40% AT SOME RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES, BE IT 20% FOR SOME OTHER PROPERTIES, BE IT 35%, WHATEVER THAT NUMBER IS, THAT'S IN THIS BASE. OKAY. SO WHEN YOU MULTIPLY TIMES 4 0 4 9 OR 0.00 50, IT'S, THEY'RE ALL GONNA GO UP THE SAME PROPORTION. OKAY. ALRIGHT. I'M UNDERSTANDING. THANK YOU. ANY MORE QUESTIONS? NOPE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. YOU'RE WELCOME. NO, THERE, HERE . WE GOT A LOT MORE WORK TO DO. I KNOW. [C. Presentation - Tax Relief for the Elderly - Sherry Sours, Commissioner of the Revenue] OKAY, NEXT ITEM IS THE TAX RELIEF FOR THE ELDERLY. OKAY. I DID A SURVEY, UM, OF SOME OF THE SURROUNDING LOCALITIES, CITY OF WINCHESTER, CLARK, CULP, PEPPER, FREDERICK, SHENANDOAH, AND A LOT OF THE LOCALITIES BECAUSE, UH, INFLATION, THEY DECIDED TO INCREASE THEIR INCOME LEVELS SO THEY WOULD BE GIVING THE TAX RELIEF FOR THE ELDERLY AND DISABLED MORE OF A BREAK. SO WE HAVE NOT HAD OUR FIGURES UPDATED SINCE 2015. SO I DECIDED, I THOUGHT, WELL, WE'D COME BACK AND ASK AND SEE IF WE COULD GET THOSE FIGURES FOR WARREN COUNTY ADJUSTED. IF YOU NOTICE, THE CITY OF WINCHESTER, THEY HAVE THE HIGHEST TOP INCOME IS 58,000 AND THOSE PEOPLE GET 25% NOW UP TO 29,004 NINE. THEY GET A HUNDRED PERCENT. CLARK THEY ALLOW A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 20,000, BUT THEIR HIGHEST INCOME IS 55,000. THEY GET 10%. AND YOU CAN LOOK DOWN THROUGH THE CHART HERE, CULP PEPPER, THEY GET A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 24,000. FREDERICK'S A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 20,000. BUT THEIR HIGHEST INCOME IS, IS MUCH HIGHER THAN WHAT WE HAVE NOW. IT'S 50 60, 50 5,000. SHENDO COUNTY, THEY'RE GIVEN A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 30,000. [00:35:03] NOW OUR CURRENT, UM, SCHEDULE THAT WE HAVE INCOME BRACKETS, WE ARE ALLOWING A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 20,000. SO WE'RE LOWER THAN SOME OF THESE PEOPLE. AND OUR HIGHEST BRACKET IS 35,000. THOSE PEOPLE GET 25%. SO WE NEED TO, UM, LOOK AT INCREASING THOSE BRACKETS. AND ANOTHER THING THAT WAS BROUGHT UP WAS, UM, THE FINANCIAL NETWORK THAT WE HAD A PERSON THAT WAS KIND OF CLOSE TO QUALIFYING THAT COULD QUALIFY ON THE INCOME, BUT THEY COULD NOT ON THE FINANCIAL WORTH. SO IF YOU LOOK AT SOME OF THESE OTHER LOCALITIES, SOME ARE LOWER THAN 150,000 AND SOME ARE HIGHER. SO NOW THAT'S STRICTLY UP TO YOU WHAT YOU ALL DECIDE TO DO. UM, ED COME UP WITH THESE COUPLE SCENARIOS AT THE BOTTOM, WARREN ONE AND WARREN TWO, AND THE FIRST ONE IS, UH, INCREASING THE A HUNDRED PERCENT UP TO 30,000. THE NEXT BRACKET WOULD BE 30,001 TO 35,000. THEY WOULD GET 75%, 35,001 TO 40,000, THEY WOULD GET 50%, 40,000, ONE TO 45,000. THEY WOULD GET 25% AND THAT WOULD INCREASE THE FINANCIAL WORTH OF THE 200,000. THE BOTTOM BRACKET IS SIMILAR EXCEPT, UM, IT GOES, UM, THE FIRST BRACKET UP TO A HUNDRED PERCENT IS 30,000. 30,001 TO 40,000 IS 75, 40,001 TO 50,000 IS 50%, 50,001 TO 60,000 IS 25%. AND THEN THE FINANCIAL WORTH IS UP TO 300,000. ANOTHER THING THAT COULD BE INCREASED, IT COULD BE LOOKED AT, WOULD BE THE, UM, EXCLUSION OF THE MONEY FOR THE PEOPLE LIVING IN THE HOME. UM, OURS IS AT 5,000. SOME OF THESE OTHER LOCALITIES DO HAVE THEIRS UP HIGHER. CHANS HAS 7,000. FREDERICK IS 8,500. COPA IS 6,500. CLARK IS 8,000. SO SOME OF THEM ARE HIGHER THAN WHAT WE HAVE. SO THIS COULD BE A, A DEPENDENT CHILD PERHAPS OR GRANDCHILD OR IT'S RELATIVE. A RELATIVE OKAY. OR NON-RELATIVE LIVING IN THE HOUSE WHO LIVES THERE. WE WOULD HAVE TO COUNT ALL THEIR INCOME. DOES THAT INCLUDE SOCIAL SECURITY? EVERYTHING. EVERYTHING. EVERYTHING. WE'VE HAD ISSUES WITH, UM, FAMILIES LIVING WITH THE MOTHER AND THE MOTHER HAS LIMITED INCOME AND IS THE PROPERTY IS IN HER NAME, BUT THE FAMILY HAS SUBSTANTIAL INCOME THAT IS IN THE PAST YEARS AGO, WAS NOT COUNTED AND NEEDED TO BE COUNTED BECAUSE IT'S PART OF THE FAMILY TOTAL. IT'S ALL IS THIS TAX RELIEF A CREDIT OR IS THIS TAX RELIEF DEFERRED? IT'S NOT DEFERRED. OKAY. SO NOBODY'S GONNA HAVE TO PAY IT IF SOMEBODY DIES AND AMEN. HUH? YOU DO. IF YOU PUT, IF THIS COSTS THE COUNTY, WHAT DID WE SAY IT WAS GONNA BE BRINGING THESE FIGURES THAT HAD THE ESTIMATED COST. UM, I DIDN'T BRING THAT ONE. OKAY. IT'S OUT SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 300 AND $400,000. SO IF YOU TAKE THREE TO $400,000 OUT OF THE POOL, THEN SOMEBODY ELSE IS MAKING IT UP. RIGHT? YEAH. SO IF THEY DON'T HAVE TO REPAY IT, BUT YOU DO, UH, THE REST DO PAY A LITTLE BIT MORE QUESTION WITH THIS TAX RELIEF, THE TWO OPTIONS HERE, ARE THEY PART OF THIS NUMBER HERE? TH THIS SPREADSHEET, THEY'RE SEPARATE. THEY'RE GONNA BE SEPARATE. THEY'RE GONNA BE SEPARATE. SO, SO IF WE, SO IF WE CHOOSE TO CHOOSE ONE OF THESE OPTIONS, THEN WE WILL TAKE THAT TOTAL AND DEDUCT THAT THE AMOUNT THAT YOU PUT INTO THE HOMEOWNER MM-HMM. DO, DO WE HAVE A, AN ESTIMATE ON THE IMPACT OF, OF EACH ONE OF THESE? [00:40:01] THERE IS AN IMPACT AND IT'S JUST AN ESTIMATE RIGHT NOW BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW HOW MANY NEW PEOPLE ARE GOING TO QUALIFY. AND WHAT WAS THIS LAST YEAR? THAT NUMBER? IT'S FOUR 400. SO THAT WAS 400 IN SOMETHING OR THE EXISTING PROGRAM? 400,000. SO THIS NEW ONE WE ESTIMATE WILL ADD AN ADDITIONAL 200 TO 300,000. DO WE KNOW WHAT THE OTHER COUNTIES IT PROBABLY NOT THAT I'M GONNA ASK, BUT WITH THE OTHER COUNTIES, LET ME SEE. CLARK FREDERICK, OF COURSE US. WHEN WAS THE LAST TIME THAT THEY REASSESSED? DO WE KNOW THAT? WELL, THEY'VE ALL REASSESSED SINCE WE DID. YEAH. WELL I SEE THAT CITY OF WINCHESTER INCREASED, RIGHT? WAS REASSESSMENT. YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. AND THE CITY OF WINCHESTER JUST YEAH, INCREASED WINCHESTER WENT UP, SIMULTANEOUS COLD PEPPER WENT UP, COAL SHEAD WENT UP. ANNUAL REASSESSMENTS. MM-HMM. , FREDERICK DOES ANNUAL REASSESSMENTS. SHE, I THINK IT WAS IN 22 THE DAY HAD THEIR REASSESSMENT. 22. MM-HMM. FASTER. YEAH, THAT'S RIGHT. SO OUR ACTION HERE IS TO LOOK AT THESE NUMBERS AND DECIDE IF WE WANNA GO AHEAD AND APPROVE THE ADJUSTMENT. TALK AMONGST YOURSELVES. MM-HMM. , IT'LL BE, IT'LL BE COMING SOON. MM-HMM. , IS THERE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS THAT WE ANYBODY HAS IN MAKING OUR, OUR DECISION IF WE WANT TO GO FORWARD WITH THESE OPTIONS OR NOT? OR NO CALL WITH SOMETHING ELSE MM-HMM. THAT YOU THINK OF, BUT DO WE KNOW, KNOW HOW MANY, HOW MANY PEOPLE THAT WE HAVE IN THE COUNTY THAT, UH, ARE, YOU KNOW, QUALIFIED FOR 65 AND OLDER? WE CAN GET A NUMBER FOR THE 65 AND OLDER PORTION OF THE POPULATION. YEAH. WE'RE NOT GOING TO KNOW WHO, HOW MANY WOULD QUALIFY UNTIL THEY FILE BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW THE INCOMES BY AGE CATEGORY. SO I CAN'T TELL YOU HOW MANY PEOPLE OF A LOWER INCOME ARE IN EACH AGE GROUP. I CAN TELL YOU HOW AT THE LOWER INCOME CATEGORY, APPROXIMATELY THE PORTION. OKAY. AND MR. MARKS HAS SOME NUMBERS THERE ON POP PERCENTAGES OF THE POPULATION, BUT WE DON'T HAVE IT BROKEN DOWN TO BE ABLE TO TELL YOU EXACTLY HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE GONNA WELL, AND HIS NUMBERS MAY NOT ACCURATELY PORTRAY WHAT WE HAVE BECAUSE MANY OF THEM ARE NOT HOMEOWNERS. CORRECT. RIGHT. THEY'RE GONNA RENT OR THEY'RE YEAH. SO IT YOU THERE'S NO WAY TO TELL UNTIL THEY YEAH. IT'S GONNA BE YOUR BEST DESTINY. BUT GO AHEAD. PROBLEM. BUT, UM, BUT SOME OF THEIR CURRENT SENIORS WOULD MOVE UP A STEP. THAT'S RIGHT. THEY'LL MOVE UP. THEY'LL MOVE UP A STEPS. SO INSTEAD OF, YOU KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, IF THEY COULD, IF RIGHT NOW THEY'RE LOOKING AT 75%, IT CAN JUMP UP TO A HUNDRED PERCENT. CORRECT. SO THERE WILL BE A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF THOSE WHO ARE NOW IN THAT CATEGORY WHO WILL, RIGHT? YES. WE HAVE SOME PEOPLE THAT WE'VE HELD THEIR APPLICATIONS. USUALLY IF THEY DO NOT QUALIFY THEN WE DON'T KEEP THESE APPLICATIONS. BUT WE'VE GOT SOME NOW THAT ARE CLOSE TO QUALIFYING. YES. VERY CLOSE. SO SINCE NOTHING WAS PASSED LAST YEAR, WE'RE KIND OF WAITING ON THOSE MM-HMM. BEFORE WE DO THE BOOKS AND ALL. OF COURSE IT COULD BE JUSTED AFTER THE BOOKS. YEAH. BUT PREFERABLY WE LIKE TO GET ALL THOSE KEYED IN BEFORE THE BOOK. DO YOU HAVE AN IDEA HOW MANY OF THEM ARE PRETTY CLOSE? WE PROBABLY HAVE MAYBE FIVE. FIVE. YEAH. IT'S, WELL, I WANNA THANK YOU FOR THINKING ABOUT THE SENIORS. I MEAN, YOU KNOW, UH, THEY NEED US, I MEAN YEAH. YEAH. WE WOULDN'T BE HERE IF IT WASN'T FOR THEM. , E E EXACTLY. EXACTLY. YOU KNOW, AND IT LAST THAT WE LOOKED AT THIS IN 2015, AND THIS HAS A SUGGESTION, YOU KNOW, I KNOW AFTER WE'RE ALL DONE WITH ALL OF THIS, YOU KNOW, TO SOMEHOW INCORPORATE IT IN OUR POLICY THAT WHEN WE DO AN ASSESSMENT, WE DON'T FORGET ABOUT THE SENIORS WHEN WE ASSESS EVERY FOUR YEARS TO KIND OF TAKE A LOOK AND SEE, REVIEW THIS YES. TO SEE IF WE NEED TO MAKE ANY ADJUSTMENTS, YOU KNOW, OR LEAVE AS IS. BUT YOU KNOW, LIKE YOU SAID, JUST DON'T WANNA FORGET ABOUT 'EM AND LEAVE THEM OUT. THAT'S RIGHT. I HAVE [00:45:01] ONE MORE SUGGESTION THAT WE STOP DOING FOUR YEAR ASSESSMENTS AND WE DO TWO YEAR ASSESSMENTS BECAUSE I BELIEVE THAT THAT WILL BE A LESSER IMPACT ON OUR COMMUNITY IF WE DON'T DO THE FOUR YEAR CYCLE. BECAUSE THE FOUR YEAR CYCLE ALLOWS THE, THE ECONOMY TO EITHER SPIKE OR TO, YOU KNOW, YOU'VE, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE ALL SORTS OF FLUCTUATIONS. AND SO IF YOU HIT IT AT THE WRONG TIME, YOU'RE, YOU'RE MESSED UP FOR THE NEXT FOUR YEARS LIKE WE ARE CURRENTLY. RIGHT. SO, BUT IF WE DO IT EVERY TWO YEARS, THEN I THINK WE CAN MITIGATE SOME OF THE, THE SEVERE FLUCTUATIONS. MAYBE NOT ALL OF THEM, BUT AT LEAST SOME OF THEM. YES. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS OR DISCUSSIONS? NOPE. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. VERY GOOD. SO I FORGOT A PIECE OF PAPER MA'AM. I'M GOING TO MAKE COPIES OF IT. I'M GONNA ASK ALYSSA IF SHE'LL WALK YOU THROUGH THE ASSETS TO SHOW YOU THE BOTTOM NUMBER THAT'S IN THE BUDGET. AND KAREN HAS BEEN WALKING THROUGH THE CIP P TO SHOW YOU THAT NUMBER. VERY, OKAY. VERY GOOD. DOES EVERYONE HAVE A COPY OF THE ASSET REPLACEMENT? UH, IS THAT THIS? NO, THE ASSET REPLACEMENT. IT'S GOT A GRAY LINE DOWN THE MIDDLE OF IT. WELL, I DON'T HAVE THAT. DON'T HAVE THAT. NO. [D. Discussion - FY 2023-2024 Proposed Budget Update - Alisa Scott, Finance Director, Ed Daley, County Administrator] JUST SO EVERYONE KNOWS, THE NEXT TOPIC IS, UM, OUR FISCAL YEAR 2324 PROPOSED BUDGET UPDATE. YEAH, I DIDN'T GET THAT SWEETY. WHOA. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. SWEET. THANK YOU. SO THIS IS A FOLLOW UP TO OUR BUDGET HEARINGS. UH, WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT ASSET REPLACEMENT AND CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS IN THE SAME BUDGET HEARING THIS, UH, PROVIDES YOU WITH AN OVERALL VIEW OF THE OVERALL REQUEST FOR FISCAL YEAR 24 AND WHAT WE ESTIMATE TO REMAIN IN THE FUND FROM WHAT'S NOT BEEN SPENT FROM FISCAL YEAR 23. SO FISCAL YEAR 24 HAS BEEN HIGHLIGHTED AND THE BOTTOM NUMBER, THE 3 MILLION, UM, THAT NUMBER INCLUDES EVERYTHING THAT HAS BEEN PART OF EACH DEPARTMENT'S BUDGET AND WHAT THEY ARE QUESTING. AND THE 300,000 OFFSETTING REVENUE IS A POTENTIAL OFFSETTING REVENUE FROM THE SOUTH WARREN VOLUNTEER FIRE DEPARTMENT FOR THEIR TANKER PUMP. THE REMAINING FUNDS FOR FISCAL YEAR 23 IS AN ESTIMATED $2,974,671. AND SO THE TOTAL REQUEST FOR FISCAL YEAR 24 IS $2,707,200. NOW HAVE ANY OF THESE NUMBERS CHANGED FROM WHEN WE DID THE BUDGET REVIEW FOR THIS ACCOUNT? NO, NOT FOR THE FISCAL YEAR 24. OKAY. WE'VE SPENT SOME OF THE FISCAL YEAR 23, UM, CAPITAL ASSETS FUNDING AND DONE SOME REARRANGING WITH COMING OUT OF OPERATING AND WHAT SHOULD BE COMING OUT OF CAPITAL ASSETS. SO THOSE NUMBERS FOR THE REMAINING FUND BALANCE FROM FISCAL YEAR 23 HAS GONE DOWN A LITTLE BIT. DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS? YES. WHAT DOES IT MEAN? SO, I MEAN, I I'M NOT TRYING TO BE FLUID. NO, ABSOLUTELY. THE, WE BEGAN A PROGRAM JULY 1ST, 2022 AND WE OPENED UP A NEW FUND ESSENTIALLY FOR REPLACING ASSETS. MM-HMM. ANYTHING THAT'S OVER $10,000 IN ORDER TO PUT MONEY INTO THAT. SO YOU SEE THAT $6 MILLION AT THE BOTTOM OF FISCAL YEAR 23 THAT CAME FROM SPECIAL PROJECTS. THE MAJORITY OF THAT CAME FROM SPECIAL PROJECTS. OKAY. SO, SPECIAL PROJECTS USED TO BE, UM, A FUND THAT THE COUNTY WOULD USE WHEN ANY UNSPENT FUNDS FROM THE PRIOR FISCAL YEAR NEEDED TO GO TOWARDS, UM, CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS. THEY WOULD GO INTO THE SPECIAL FUND BALANCE. AND THAT WAS NOT A BUDGETED FUND, IT WAS NOT AN APPROPRIATED FUND, BUT IT WAS A COMMITTED FUND. SO EVERY YEAR IN YOUR AQUIFER YOU WOULD SEE THE SPECIAL NOTE FOR, I'M SORRY, YOU WOULD SEE THE NOTE [00:50:01] FOR SPECIAL PROJECTS THAT WOULD BREAK DOWN THE TOTAL AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT WAS IN THAT FUND AND ALL OF THE PROJECTS COMMITTED WITH THOSE FUNDS. SO IF WE WANT TO MEET THIS NUMBER OF 2,000,700, $7,000, WE'VE GOTTA COME UP WITH THE MONEY TO BE ABLE TO DO IT. WE DO HOW WE'RE GONNA DO IT. WE DO. OKAY. THAT'S, THAT'S THE BOTTOM LINE FOR ME. OKAY. THANK YOU. YOU'RE WELCOME. TONIGHT'S, TONIGHT'S SESSION IS A BUDGET IN A NUTSHELL. MM. SO WE'RE GONNA TAKE BACK, YOU SPENT SEVERAL HOURS WITH ALYSSA GOING THROUGH ALL THIS OR THAT. THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT 2 7 0 7. RIGHT. AND WE'RE GONNA SHOW YOU HOW THAT GETS IN THE PICTURE. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NOPE. WE'LL GO TO CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT. AND THE SPREADSHEET THAT I PASSED OUT ARE THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS THAT WE WENT OVER AT THE WORK AT OUR LAST BUDGET WORK SESSION. AND THESE, THESE DO NOT INCLUDE THE SCHOOLS. I'M, I'M ASSUMING THEY, THEY'RE GONNA GO OVER THEIR CAPITAL PROJECTS, UM, THURSDAY EVENING. BUT THESE ARE THE COUNTY, THESE ARE THE, UM, CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROJECTS THAT WERE SUBMITTED BY EACH OF OUR COUNTY DEPARTMENTS. AND I SHOWED WHAT WAS APPROVED, UM, FISCAL YEAR 2023 FOR EACH OF THESE PROJECTS. AND THEN THE CARRYOVER BALANCE, UM, AND WHAT WAS APPROVED AND THEN WHAT'S BEING REQUESTED FISCAL YEAR 2024. AND UM, THE GRANT PROJECTS, OF COURSE INDIAN HOLLOW BOAT LANDING IS A GRANT PROJECT, BUT THERE'S NOTHING BEING REQUESTED FOR THAT PROJECT THIS YEAR. THE ROCKLAND PARK ATHLETIC FIELDS, UM, IS A GRANT PROJECT. SO IF, IF WE DO NOT GET THE GRANT, THEN THAT PROJECT, UM, WOULD BE DELAYED. AND THEN THE HAPPY CREEK ACTUALLY FANTASY LAND REBUILD. UM, THERE IS DEFINITELY A POSSIBILITY FOR US TO GET GRANTS AND DONATIONS FOR THAT PROJECT, ALTHOUGH I DON'T HAVE GRANT BESIDE THAT. SORRY. BUT THAT IS INCLUDED IN THE TOTAL PROPOSED GRANT PROJECTS AT THE BOTTOM AS WELL AS THE ABEX TRAIL. THERE ARE OPPORTUNITIES FOR GRANTS. WHICH ONE IS THAT AGAIN? THE AVTEX TRAIL AND THEN THE ONE THAT YOU, WHICH HAPPY CREEK FANTASY LAND REBUILD. SO INCLUDE GRANT BESIDE THAT. I DON'T HAVE A SPECIFIC GRANT, UM, PLANNED OUT FOR THAT YET, BUT I KNOW THERE ARE ONES THAT WE CAN APPLY FOR POSSIBLY GET. SO, UM, ALL OF THESE, THESE PROJECTS, I MEAN IT, IT'LL BE UP TO THE, TO YOU ALL WHETHER YOU WANT TO, UM, FUND THEM THIS FISCAL YEAR OR IN, UM, UPCOMING FISCAL YEARS OR AT ALL. UM, BUT IF YOU DO, I HAVE THE TOTAL OF, OF WHAT WAS REQUESTED AND THEN THE TOTAL OF THE PROPOSED GRANT PROJECTS. UM, SO THE TOTAL WITHOUT THE GRANT PROJECTS IS THE 3,173,000. I HAVE A QUESTION ABOUT THIS. MAYBE YOU GUYS CAN HELP ME FIGURE IT OUT. SO UP ON FIRE AND RESCUE, UH, NEW STATION SIX, IT SAYS 3 MILLION FY 23 APPROVED BALANCE CARRYOVER IS 3 MILLION, THEN A REQUESTED 2 MILLION AM I TO ASSUME THE $3 MILLION STILL EXISTS SOMEWHERE? YES MA'AM. OKAY. SO THE AMOUNT, THE AMOUNT REQUEST WILL BE ANOTHER $2 MILLION AND THAT WILL GET ADDED TO THAT WHICH WILL BE A $5 MILLION FUND BALANCE. THAT'S RIGHT. OKAY. I'M TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW, BECAUSE THERE IS NO MAY FEEL THAT THAT, THAT IT'S GOING TO TAKE MORE THAN $3 MILLION TO BUILD THAT STATION. RIGHT. SO, BUT I WAS JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHAT, WHAT THE ROLLING BALANCES WERE. IT'S VERSUS IN THE BALANCE VERSUS JUST THE YEARLY REQUEST. AND SO HOW, HOW MUCH PROGRESS ARE WE MAKING TOWARD THE BALANCE? THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO FIGURE. WELL, WE HAVEN'T FIGURE OUT, HAVEN'T MADE A LOT OF PROJECT PROGRESS IN THAT PARTICULAR PROJECT YET, BUT OKAY. BUT ON THE BOTTOM OF THE FY 23 BALANCE, CARRYABLE 7 MILLION, YOU SEE 7 MILLION, ALMOST SEVEN POINT SEPARATE. RIGHT. THAT MONEY EXISTS STAY SOMEWHERE. AND THAT'S FOR THESE PROJECTS UNTIL THE BOARD MOVES IT. SO WHEN THE FIRE STATION IS AN EXAMPLE MOVES TO THIS NEXT YEAR, THE MONEY GOES WITH IT. OKAY. IT JUST IN THIS FORMAT, ED, YOU CAN'T SEE THE ROLLOVER. RIGHT. THE ROLLING OVER OF THE FUNDS. AND SO THAT'S WHY I WAS TRYING TO, [00:55:01] TO FIGURE IT OUT AND, AND I HAD THE SAME QUESTION, UM, WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THE INDIAN HOLLOW BOAT LANDING. SO THE MONEY AND THE BALANCE CARRYOVER WILL GO INTO THE BLUE BOX. WELL THE BLUE BOX IS REQUESTED. I MEAN IT'LL, THE CARRYOVER, THE SECOND COLUMN IS WHAT'S COMING FORWARD. MM-HMM. , THE BLUE COLUMN IS WHAT ADDITIONAL NEW MONEY BEING REQUESTED. SO THERE'S NO ADDITIONAL NEW MONEY BEING REQUESTED, BUT WE'LL STILL HAVE THE 2 97 FOR THE INDIAN HOLLOW BOAT LANDING. BUT WE HAVE, WE REQUESTED THAT ADDITIONAL A HUNDRED THOUSAND YET WE CAN'T UNTIL WE GET THE ENGINEER PLANS AND THEY SHOULD BE HERE WITHIN THE NEXT WEEK. OKAY. SO THAT PROJECT IS MOVING FORWARD. IT'S, SO WE SHOULD HAVE 200,000 TOWARDS THAT, YOU KNOW, THE BALANCE OF THAT. OKAY. AND THAT'S RIGHT. BUT I DIDN'T, BUT I REALLY DIDN'T INCLUDE THAT MUCH BECAUSE THAT'S NOT, THERE'S NO NEW MONEY BEING REQUESTED FOR THAT UNTIL WE PUT IN FOR THAT GRANT WHEN THE PLANS GET HERE. WELL, BUT THERE'S NO NEW MONEY FROM THE COUNTY, FROM YOU ALL. NO, I KNOW. SO, BUT I KNOW WE'RE GONNA REQUEST CUZ THEY TOLD US TO PUT IN AGAIN YEAH, WE'LL REQUEST FROM THEM. YEAH. YEAH. BUT THAT, THAT WILL GO TOWARDS OUR, THE THREE 14 THAT WAS THAT YOU ALL APPROVED LAST YEAR. OKAY. UM, I STILL INCLUDED THAT ON HERE BECAUSE IT'S AN ONGOING PROJECT, BUT, BUT THERE'S NO NEW MONEY FROM YOU ALL BEING REQUESTED TOWARDS THAT PROJECT. OKAY. THERE'S WHERE IT GETS CONFUSING BECAUSE WE MAY, UM, WE MAY DECIDE TO PULL ALL OUR GRANTS, PUT THEM IN THEIR OWN FONT, NOT TODAY OR TOMORROW. BUT WE MAY TO MAKE IT CLEARER FOR EVERYBODY. WE MAY DECIDE TO DO THAT, MAKE IT EASIER TO TRACK THEM NOW. NOW JUST TO BE CLEAR THAT THE GRANT, THAT'S, THAT MONEY IS FENCED OFF. I MEAN YOU CAN ONLY USE IT FOR THAT PARTICULAR PROJECT. OKAY. SO AT WHAT POINT, I SHOULDN'T SAY WHAT POINT, BUT WHERE WOULD WE, OR WHERE WOULD THE ACCOUNT FOR THE SCHOOL BOARD CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT B CUZ I DON'T SEE IT HERE. SO IS THAT, THAT WOULD BE A GOOD THING TO TALK ABOUT THURSDAY EXACTLY WHAT THEY'RE, WE'VE GOT A, WE'VE GOT A VERSION OF IT, BUT WE'RE NOT SURE THAT'S THE ONE YOU'RE USING RIGHT NOW MM-HMM. . AND SO WE WANT TO LET THEM PRESENT TO YOU AND THEN WE'LL GO WITH THAT. AND THEN THAT WOULD INCREASE THIS, THIS NUMBER HERE ON, IN THIS ACCOUNT. IF, UH, IF IF ANY, UPON WHAT YOU WERE FUNDING WITH WHAT MONEY DO YOU HAVE? SOME MONEY RESERVED FOR SCHOOLS CAPITAL PROJECTS. MM-HMM. UM, EXAMPLE BEING, WE STILL HAVE THE 2.2 MILLION MOREL FK CAUSE THEY HAVE NOT USED IT YET. CORRECT? CORRECT. WE HAVE ABOUT 600,000 56 50 LEFT. WE HAVE 6 56 IN IN ONE ACCOUNT. YEAH. AND THEN THERE'S, WE THINK THERE'S, THERE'S THE 1.2 MILLION THAT WAS SET ASIDE FROM LAST YEAR. LAST YEAR. THAT WAS FOR LF. K WELL THAT ONE WAS FOR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS. THE 2.2 WAS FOR LF K REMEMBER THAT WAS THE ONE THAT WAS NOT FOR LF. K MM-HMM . AND THEN YOU HAD 1 MILLION SEPARATE YOU SAID. YEAH. THEN THERE'S THE 1 MILLION CAPITAL THAT'S THERE ELIMINATING SPECIAL PROJECTS. THAT'S FOR YOU TO DESIGNATE WHERE IT GOES AND HOW IT'S USED. CAN WE GET A SPREADSHEET LIKE THAT? LIKE THIS? YES. WE'LL HAVE, OKAY. WE'LL BRING SCHOOLS. WERE ONE PRESENTATION ON WHAT THEY'RE REQUESTING AND THEY SAID THEY WOULD HAVE THE LINE ITEMS FOR YOU. GOOD DEAL. AND THEN WE'LL LEAVE YOU OUR VERSION OF THIS TYPE OF FORMAT SO YOU CAN LOOK AT IT. PREPARE, BECAUSE THIS IS RELATIVELY EASY ONCE YOU UNDERSTAND THE L THE LAYOUT OF IT. MM-HMM. . WELL, DR. DALEY, I WOULD LIKE TO ADD THAT IF THE TOWN APPROVES 400 NEW HOUSES, WE'RE GONNA NEED AN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL SOONER THAN LATER. CORRECT? WELL, AT LEAST WE'VE ALREADY TALKED ABOUT THAT. WITH THE FINANCIAL SUBCOMMITTEE. WE'LL HAVE TO BRING IT UP AGAIN. WELL I THINK THAT THE, I THINK THAT THE FUTURE NUMBER, YEAR NUMBER WAS GONNA BE SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT THAN WHAT IT'S GONNA BE IF THEY APPROVE 400 HOMES. MAYBE THAT LEADS TO [01:00:01] BE ONE OF YOUR TOPICS NEXT WEEK. MAYBE THAT'S, MAYBE WE SHOULD ASK THAT QUESTION. YOU KNOW, BECAUSE OF THE, THE NEW SUBDIVISIONS COMING UP CUZ I THINK THEY SAID IT WAS WHAT, 10 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD THAT THEY, 2028 WAS IT? 2028 WAS THE, WAS THE DATE THAT I THINK THAT WE SAW ON THE SPREADSHEET. YEAH. BUT YOU KNOW, TO BRING THAT UP AGAIN YEAH. IT'S IMPORTANT. YOU, YOU'VE MADE THAT YOU WANTED TO SEE HOW FULL THE SCHOOLS WERE BASED ON THE DATA WE HAVE CURRENTLY SO THAT WE COULD KIND OF TARGET WHEN A NEW SCHOOL MIGHT BE NEEDED. BUT IF WE GET 400 HOUSES APPROVED, WELL YEAH. YOU KNOW, EVEN IF YOU DO A HALF A KID A HOUSE AND SO YOU'RE TALKING 200 STUDENTS, THAT'S THAT'S A SCHOOL. YEP. THAT'S AN ELEMENT. KIDS. HUH? ELEMENTARY AVENUE. TWO KIDS. TWO. YEAH. SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A, AN ELEMENTARY SCHOOL AND YOU KNOW, OUR MIDDLE SCHOOL AND HIGH SCHOOLS ARE FINE FROM WHAT WE COULD TELL BY THE DATA, BUT THE ELEMENTARY SCHOOLS ARE NOT YEAH. BUILDING UP. YEAH. ESPECIALLY WHEN THEY'RE NOW USING PRE-K. RIGHT. SO GOOD QUESTION. IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NOPE. THANK YOU. THANK YOU VERY MUCH. I WAS YOUR ESTIMATE FOR IN-HOUSE ASSESSMENTS AND I HAD IT ALL DONE. I JUST FORGOT PRINT. IS THIS WHAT I JUST BROUGHT UP? YES. YAY. . WOW. WE'RE ON THE SAME. WE WORK FAST MAN. I WAS GONNA SAY THANK YOU. THE TOTAL PICTURE NOW. SO WE HAVE PRICING FOR OUR OWN IN-HOUSE ASSESSMENT OFFICE AND IT'S ALL BASED ON ESTIMATES. WE ANTICIPATE IF WE DID THIS, THAT THERE WOULD BE BETWEEN BUILDING REPAIRS AND SETTING UP AN OFFICE APPROXIMATELY $70,000 AND EXACTLY WHAT WE WOULD CALL BUILDING REPAIR AND WHAT WE WOULD CALL THE OFFICE SET UP REMAINS TO, TO BE SEEN A LITTLE BIT. UH, THEN THERE'S A SOFTWARE PACKAGE. IT'S ABOUT $160,000 AND THERE WOULD BE TWO VEHICLES, $80,000. UH, ONGOING EXPENSES WOULD BE THREE TO FOUR PEOPLE, ABOUT 350,000. THAT INCLUDES THE BENEFITS SOFTWARE ONGOING IS GOING TO BE 40,000 AND OPERATIONS WOULD BE 50. AND THIS WOULD BE ON THE BASIS OF A TWO YEAR ASSESSMENT CYCLE. IN RESPONSE, WE WOULD RECEIVE A SIGNIFICANT INCREASE IN OUR PUBLIC SERVICE REVENUES. CAUSE THE CLOSER WE KEEP THOSE TO A HUNDRED PERCENT VALUE, THE HIGHER THEY ARE ASSESSED. YOU KNOW, IF WE'RE AT 70% AND THEY START OUT AT 70%, THEY GO DOWN FROM THERE. THIS IS THE RATIOS THAT WE WERE SPEAKING OF BEFORE. CORRECT. AND THAT I THINK IS A VERY COMPLICATED TOPIC FOR THE CITIZENS IS HOW DO DO THE PUBLIC SERVICE CORPORATIONS AND THE RESIDENTIAL TAX RATES IMPACT ONE ANOTHER? AND I DON'T KNOW IF THERE'S A WAY TO WRITE SOMETHING THAT, THAT PROVIDES MORE CLARITY CUZ IT'S KIND OF DIFFICULT EVEN FOR ME. SO DO THE PUBLIC SERVICE CORPORATIONS PAY 100% OF THEIR ASSESSED VALUE IN THE FIRST YEAR OF A NEW ASSESSMENT? ASSESSMENT YEAR? IF WE ARE ASSESSED IN A HUNDRED PERCENT, THEN THE PUBLIC SERVICE COMMISSION IS SUPPOSED TO ASSESS 700%. OKAY. BUT WE ARE NOT RIGHT NOW WE'RE AT, WHAT, 92? NO, WE HAVE AT 70, 70%. I'M TALKING ABOUT OUR NEW, IN OUR NEW YEAR, IN OUR UPCOMING YEAR. IT SHOULD BE LIKE A 90, 90 TO A HUNDRED REAL, REAL CLOSE STUDIES RANGE. OKAY. SO THEY WILL BE PAYING THEN THE PUBLIC SERVICE CORPORATIONS WILL BE PAYING 100 CLOSER TO 100% OF THEIR ASSESSED VALUE. SO THAT'S THE REVENUE FOR THE FIRST YEAR. THEN THE SECOND YEAR IT'S REDUCED BY HOW MUCH? DEPENDS ON THE MARKET. OKAY. IS ON THE ASSESSMENT OKAY. LEVEL AND DOESN'T JUST SITS THERE. MM-HMM. . OKAY. THEN THEY'RE THE SAME RATE THEY WOULD WHAT IF THE MARKET GOES DOWN, THEN THEY, THEY DON'T GO ABOVE A HUNDRED. OKAY. SO IT STAY OKAY. ALL RIGHT. WHEW. DESIGNED FOR THEM TO GAIN MONEY, NOT FOR THEM TO HAVE TO PAY THEIR SHARE . WELL, IT NEEDS TO BE CORRECTED, BUT ANYWAY, [01:05:01] THAT'S JUST ANOTHER SITUATION. BUT YEAH. SO SO ARE YOU PROPOSING ESTIMATING THAT IF WE GO TO, UH, IN-HOUSE, THAT IT BASICALLY WILL PAY FOR ITSELF APPROXIMATELY THE SECOND YEAR? MA'AM? IT WILL NOT THE FIRST YEAR. RIGHT. THIS WILL BE AN INVESTMENT TO GET IT WHEN WE PRODUCE THE FIRST REASSESSMENT FROM THEN ON IT WILL BE PAYING FOR ACCEPT, BUT THIS IS A TWO YEAR CYCLE, SO THIS NUMBER WOULD BE DOUBLED FOR TWO YEARS. OKAY. AND THIS SOFTWARE COST, UM, IF IS THIS MRS. SOURS WHAT YOU WERE TELLING ME WE NEEDED TO GET ANYWAY, WHETHER WE DO IT IN-HOUSE OR NOT, I DO HAVE THAT IN MY BUDGET. YES. WE NEED IT REGARDLESS. OKAY. SOFTWARE AND WHAT, WHAT, WHAT ARE THE, UH, WHAT DO THE OPERATING EXPENSES, WHAT DOES THAT INCLUDE? THIS IS, THIS IS TOTALLY A PRELIMINARY ESTIMATE BY YOURS TRULY. AND I DID NOT FIGURE OUT ANY LINE ITEMS YET. WHEN WE COME BACK WITH AN ACTUAL BUDGET PROPOSAL, WE WILL BE CLOSE TO THAT, THAT WE WILL BE HIGHER OR LOWER. UH, AND THEN WE'LL HAVE SOME LINE ITEMS. THIS IS ALL THE MATERIALS AND SUPPLIES THAT THEY NEED TO RUN THE OFFICE. WE LOOKED AT ANOTHER OFFICE'S, UH, BUDGET TO SEE WHAT ALL THEY HAD. AND WELL, WE MIGHT NEED THIS, WE MIGHT NOT NEED THAT AND SO FORTH. AND, UH, THIS SEEMED LIKE A CONSERVATIVE NUMBER AS TO WHAT WE WOULD, THIS IS WHAT YOU SHOULD EXPECT. YOU NEED TO GET THE MICROPHONE. I THINK THEY'RE, THEY'RE QUEUING YOU TO GET BEHIND THE MICROPHONE BECAUSE THEY CANNOT HEAR YOU ONLINE. THERE YOU GO. SO WHAT DID, WITH LOOKING AT THESE NUMBERS, UM, WHAT DID OUR APPRAISAL COST US TO DO TO OUTSOURCE IT? ABOUT 420. APPROXIMATELY 420 MA'AM. OKAY, SO EVEN, SO THIS IS IN THE SAME RANGE? MM-HMM. AND I BELIEVE I, I CALLED THE, UM, ASSESSOR AND I ASKED WHAT WOULD IT COST. I DIDN'T GET TO TALK WITH HIM. I LEFT HIM A PHONE MESSAGE AND I WILL TRACK HIM DOWN AGAIN TO SEE WHAT HAVING A TWO YEAR CYCLE BUT HAVE THEM DO THE ASSESSMENTS WOULD COST TOO FOR COMPARISON TO THIS. BUT THIS IS TOTALLY AN ESTIMATE. THIS IS NOT, THERE'S NOTHING SCIENTIFIC ABOUT THIS YET. THE ONLY, THE ONLY NUMBER I WOULD STAND BEHIND ON HERE FOR SURE IS THE SOFTWARE AND THE BUILDING COSTS I GOT FROM UH, PUBLIC WORKS. LOOKING AT THE BUILDING. HAVE WE, HAVE WE GOT A BUILDING SELECTED OR THOUGHT OF POSSIBLY THE UH, ONE OF THE LITTLE MIDDLE HOUSE WHERE PUBLIC WORKS USED TO BE OVER ON THE STREET OVER THERE. IT NEEDS TO BE CLOSE TO THE COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE. UH, AND WE MAY TALK ABOUT MOVING SOMEBODY ELSE OVER THERE AND BRINGING THEM IN HERE CUZ THEY NEED TO BE CLOSE TO THE, UH, COMMISSIONER AND THAT'S AS FAR AWAY AS WE'D WANT THEM TO GO. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? OH, THAT'S JUST FOR YOUR FILE. MM-HMM. , THANK YOU. SO OF ALL THESE LITTLE BUDGETS THAT YOU LOOKED AT OVER THE LAST MONTH AND A HALF AND YOU HAD ALL THESE LINEUP IN EACH BUTTON YOU CAN COME BACK AND LOOK AT, OH, THANK YOU. THIS LOOKS FAMILIAR. THEN BE ABLE TO, YOU GO BACK AND LOOK AT ALL YOUR LITTLE BUDGETS. THANK YOU. FROM THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, PUBLIC WORKS, SOCIAL SERVICES, ET CETERA. YOU CAN TRACK IT BACK TO THE NUMBERS THAT ARE IN HERE. THANK YOU. [01:10:16] THIS IS IN ESSENCE WHAT WE CALL A BUDGET IN A BOX. SO THE REVENUE NUMBER COMES FROM THE ONE SIDE OF THOSE DOCUMENTS I GAVE YOU A FEW MINUTES AGO. AND THE EXPENDITURES COME FROM THE UP. WHAT'S NOT IN HERE IN THIS 90,000,055 ON THE EXPENDITURE SIDE, IT HAS THE 5% SALARY INCREASE. IT HAS THE HA 8% HEALTH INSURANCE DOES NOT HAVE ANY NEW POSITIONS WHICH YOU SEE MARKED DOWN HERE. IT DOES NOT HAVE ANY POSITIONS CHANGES. IT DOES NOT HAVE A MERIT POOL OF 1%. IT HAS SEVEN. DOES NOT HAVE 70% FOR PUBLIC SAFETY. THIS 96, IF YOU TAKE ALL SHERIFF'S OFFICE EMPLOYEES AND PUT THEM AT 7%, THAT'S THE 1 26 OVER HERE AND THAT WOULD CANCEL OUT THE 96. AND IF YOU GAVE THE 70% TO EVERYONE, IF YOU SAID, WELL, OKAY, WE'RE GONNA DO 7% FOR THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE BECAUSE THE STATE SAID SO AND SO, WELL, WHAT ARE YOU GONNA DO ACROSS THE HALL TO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, ET CETERA. THAT'S WHAT THE 7% FOR EVERYONE DOES. THAT'S THE FOUR 20 SCHOOLS INCREASE IS BLANK UNTIL AFTER YOU TALK WITH THEM THURSDAY. AND THEN YOU CAN THINK ABOUT WHERE YOU WANT TO GO WITH THAT. THE CAPITAL, WHICH TARYN TALKED TO YOU ABOUT. IF YOU DO ALL THOSE PROJECTS, IT NEEDS 3.2 MILLION. WHAT ALYSSA TALKED TO YOU ABOUT WITH THE ASSETS, IF YOU DO ALL OF THAT, THAT NEEDS $3,007,200. THAT BRINGS THE TOTAL TO 98 8 7 7 700 WITHOUT AN INCREASE IN SCHOOLS WITHOUT ANY INCREASE IN SCHOOLS. THAT'S CORRECT. OKAY. AND THAT, BUT IT DOES HAVE SCHOOLS MONEY. THE MONEY FOR SCHOOLS CAPITAL AS WHAT WE WERE SAYING OVER, THAT'S ALREADY IN THE, IN OUR RESERVES AND EARMARK FOR SCHOOLS CAPITAL. AND THAT WOULD BE A DEFICIT COMPARED TO HERE OF 99 52, 100. OKAY. BUT ON THE REVENUE SIDE, YOU JUST HAVE THE BASE BUDGET WITHOUT ALL OF THESE OTHER LINE ITEMS THAT YOU HAVE LISTED HERE? YES. NEW STATE DSS, SANITARY FEE INCREASES, BUILDING FEE INCREASES PLANNING AND ZONING FEE INCREASES. SO LET ME START AT THE BOTTOM. GROCERY SALES. YEAH. AND LET ME START AT THE BOTTOM HERE. THE LAST THREE ARE DEPENDENT UPON THE STATE BUDGET. RIGHT. AND AS I SAID, WE'RE GIVEN REASON TO BELIEVE THEY MAY NOT ADOPT ANYTHING BEFORE JULY, AND THEY MAY DECIDE TO ADOPT SOMETHING SOME OTHER TIME DURING THE YEAR. THAT BEING THE CASE, WE CAN'T PLUG ANY OF THOSE NUMBERS IN YET BECAUSE WE DON'T KNOW IF AND WHEN THEY WILL HAPPEN. DO WE KNOW WHAT THE BUDGET, THE, THE BUDGET WAS FOR THE, SO THE SKINNY BUDGET NUMBERS DO, CAN WE PLUG IN THE SKINNY BUDGET? YES. MOST OF THOSE, MOST OF THOSE ARE IN HERE. OKAY. SO MOST OF THOSE ARE ALREADY IN, AND WE'RE GONNA CONFIRM THAT WE'VE GOT THE RIGHT NUMBERS FOR THE COMP BOARD AND SO FORTH. OKAY. BUT MOST OF THE SKINNY BUDGET, THEY'RE IN HERE BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THEY PROPOSED LAST YEAR, RIGHT? FOR THIS YEAR THEY HAVE APPROVED IT. YES. IT, IT'S APPROVED. SO THERE IS A BUDGET. YEAH. BUT IT ONLY HAS 5% FOR PUBLIC SAFETY. OKAY. 5% FOR SCHOOLS AND [01:15:01] SO FORTH. WHEREAS THE PROPOSALS FLIPPING BACK AND FORTH, AND I DON'T MEAN TO TAKE SIDES IN IT, BUT JUST BOUNCING BACK AND FORTH, SOME OF THEM ARE AT 7%. AND SO THE 7% WOULD COME OVER HERE ON THE EXPENDITURE SIDE, BUT THERE'D BE SOME ADDITIONAL MONEY OVER ON THE OTHER SIDE OVER HERE ON THE LEFT UNDER NEW STATE COMP BOARD. AND THE SAME WITH SOCIAL SERVICES. THERE CAN BE NEW MONEY. NOW UP ABOVE THAT YOU SEE THE PLANNING AND ZONING FEES AND THE BUILDING INSPECTION FEES AND THE SANITARY FEES. AND SO WE THOUGHT WE WOULD WALK THROUGH THE BUILDING FEES AND THEN THE PLANNING OR THE PLANNING AND ZONING FEES. AND THEN THE BUILDING FEES. AGAIN, SAME PRESENTATION YOU LOOKED AT, BUT WHERE YOU WANT TO GO WITH IT SO THAT WE CAN GET SOMETHING AS A PROPOSAL AND PUT THE NUMBER IN HERE. THIS BUDGET IS DOABLE, YET SOMETHING, SOMETHING'S OVER ON THE RIGHT WILL COME DOWN. SOMETHING'S OVER ON THE LEFT, DEPENDING UPON WHERE YOU SET THE TAX RATE MAY COME UP, BUT IT WILL, IT IS DOABLE. SO I'M NOT TRYING TO SCARE YOU WITH ANY OF THIS, BUT I WANT YOU TO SEE EXACTLY WHERE WE ARE. IF YOU, THINGS WILL HAVE TO COME OUT OF HERE IF WE DO THIS AND WE DON'T DO ANYTHING ELSE. SO WHEN YOU SAY THIS IS DOABLE ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF OUR EXPENDITURES, OF THE 90 MILLION, EXCUSE ME. UM, YEAH, THE 9.9 MILLION MM-HMM. , IT'S DOABLE FOR THE NEW POSITIONS, IT'S DOABLE FOR THE 7% IN INCREASE? NO MA'AM. OKAY. THESE ARE THINGS THAT ARE ADDED IN HERE. AND IF YOU SAID YOU WANTED TO KEEP THE TAX RATE AND ALL YOUR FEES SO THAT THE REVENUE WAS GOING TO BE 88 925, I WILL MAKE THIS SIDE EQUAL 88 925 AND THESE EXTRAS WILL BE DELAYED. MM-HMM. , THEY WILL, WILL BE TALKING ABOUT PUSHING MOST ALL OF THE ASSETS AND THE CAPITAL BOTH OUT FIRE. THERE WOULD BE NO MORE TALK ABOUT 7% FOR ANYBODY UNLESS THE STATE CAME IN AND FUNDED IT AND SO FORTH. SO IT WOULD BE, IT WOULD BE DOABLE, BUT THERE WILL BE CHANGES. I WILL BE TAKING ALL THE LITTLE LINE ITEM BUDGET THAT YOU LOOKED AT BEFORE AND I WILL BE MAKING CHANGES. AND WHEN WE FINISH THE CHANGES, MEGAN AND ALYSSA WILL HAVE A BALANCED BUDGET. OKAY. SO IT, IT CAN BE DONE. UH, NOBODY WILL BE THRILLED BY IT, BUT IT CAN BE DONE. SO I THOUGHT WE WOULD TALK ABOUT PLANNING AND ZONING AND THEN BUILDING INSPECTION FEES. WHERE DID SHE SWITCH IT? OKAY. HOW ABOUT IF WE DO BUILDING INSPECTION FIRST? OKAY. GOOD EVENING. HELLO. I DON'T THINK THAT YOU'ALL HAVE THE SAME MATERIAL THAT I GAVE YOU LAST WEEK OR THE COUPLE WEEKS AGO. SO I'M GOING TO GIVE YOU AT LEAST SPREADSHEET SO YOU CAN LOOK AT, HAVE YOU CHANGED IT? WE WANT MORE PAPER. I HAVE NOT CHANGED IT. OKAY. . OKAY. BUT I DO WANT TO GO OVER A COUPLE PIECES AND ASK IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS. THANKS DAVID. THANKS DAVID. OH MY GOODNESS, THIS IS TOO SMALL FOR MY EYES. MINE TOO SMALL. I, I NEED MY, I LEFT MY GLASSES AND MY CARD. I NEED, I APOLOGIZE BECAUSE I CAN'T DRIVE AND WEAR 'EM OR I'LL KILL SOMEBODY SO I HAVE TO TAKE 'EM OFF THEN. ANYWAY. ANYWAY, IT'S ALRIGHT. UM, AGAIN, THERE ARE TWO OPTIONS THAT I'VE PROVIDED TO YOU. THE FIRST OPTION IS IN THE SECOND COLUMN AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD REPRESENT PROBABLY ABOUT 90% OF COVERAGE OF WHAT OUR FEES ARE AT, UH, THE LINE ITEM COLUMN, THE COLUMN NUMBER THREE, WHICH SAYS PAGE FIVE AND SIX. THAT WOULD GIVE US POTENTIALLY COVERING OUR COSTS AND MAKING SURE THAT WE CAN [01:20:01] ACTUALLY PROVIDE A FEW ADDITIONAL THINGS AS FAR AS THE SERVICES THAT ARE PROVIDE THAT WE SHOULD BE DOING THAT WE'RE ACTUALLY NOT DOING THAT WE REALLY DO NEED TO. UM, THERE ARE A COUPLE OF ITEMS THAT I WAS ACTUALLY POINTED OUT BY MY PERMIT CENTER SUPERVISOR THAT I HAD MISSED, BUT THEY GO HAND IN HAND WITH WHAT'S ALREADY EXISTING. IT'S NOT SOMETHING THAT WE'RE ADDING TO THE FEE SCHEDULE AND THEY'RE NOT GOING UP ANY DIFFERENT THAN ANY OF THE OTHER FEES. SO I DID WANT TO POINT THAT OUT. UM, APPARENT, UH, APOLOGETIC. SHE WAS OUT THIS AFTERNOON AND I DIDN'T GET A CHANCE TO PULL THOSE NUMBERS BACK IN AS FAR AS WHAT SHE SPECIFICALLY TALKED ABOUT. THE ONE THAT I DO WANT TO LET YOU KNOW OF IS THERE IS AN INCREASE OF A, A SERVICE AT THE VERY END OF THIS. THIS IS FOR, IT'S ON THE VERY LAST TWO LINES. THIS CAME INTO EFFECT A LITTLE BIT BECAUSE OF A PROJECT THAT'S GOING ON RIGHT NOW WITH A LARGER SCALE, UH, SITE DEVELOPMENT DURING REVIEWS USE THE REQUEST FOR COMMENTS COME IN FROM PLANNING AND ZONING FOR SITE DEVELOPMENTS AT THAT TIME. I LOOK AT IT AND TYPICALLY I'LL ALSO HAVE THE EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL PLAN THAT I'M WORKING ON. SO I DO MY REVIEW FOR EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL AND GET THOSE PIECES ALL TAKEN CARE OF. THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT THAT IS MORE SO IN LINE WITH WHAT THIS IS ASKING FOR, EXCUSE ME. BUILDING INSPECTIONS AND BUILDING PERMITS ARE ISSUED AT ONE POINT IN TIME, BUT IT'S NOT PART OF THE SITE DEVELOPMENT. SO WE'RE GETTING FURTHER AHEAD OF OURSELVES WHEN WE'RE DOING THE EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL AND ALSO REQUESTS FOR COMMENTS. SO THIS PARTICULAR PROJECT HAD NEW BUILDINGS THAT HAD NO INFORMATION OTHER THAN LITTLE SQUARE BOXES PLACED ON THE SITE PLAN. BASICALLY THAT'S FOR IMPERVIOUS AREAS SO THAT WE CAN GET THE CALCULATIONS FOR RUNOFF AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE THROUGH STORMWATER. IT ALSO GIVES ME A UNDERSTANDING AS TO HOW THE SITE GRADE IS GOING TO BE, WHERE THINGS NEED TO BE FOR SILT FENCE AND ITEMS OF THAT NATURE FOR THE EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL. MM-HMM. , THE BUILDING DEPARTMENT IS REQUIRED TO PROVIDE THE APPLICANTS PRIOR TO A BUILDING PERMIT BEING ISSUED. IF THEY ARE REQUIRED TO HAVE FIRE LANES. WE DON'T TAKE THAT INTO ACCOUNT DURING THE EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE INFORMATION THAT WE NEED TO SAY WHERE THE FIRE LANES NEED TO BE. WHEN YOU JUST SEE A LITTLE BOX, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT CONSTRUCTION TYPE THAT BUILDING IS GOING TO BE. YOU DON'T KNOW COMPLETE HEIGHT AREA IF THERE IS ACTUALLY GOING TO BE ACCESSIBLE FEATURES AROUND THERE. SO THIS PROJECT CAME ABOUT WHERE THEY SENT A BLANK COPY TO THE FIRE MARSHAL TO SAY, HEY, DOES THIS WORK? FIRE MARSHAL TURNED IT BACK OVER TO ME. HE SAYS, I DON'T DO THIS. WHAT ARE THEY ASKING? CUZ THERE WAS NO INFORMATION PROVIDED. THIS SITE PLAN REVIEW WOULD TAKE INTO ACCOUNT FOR THINGS OF THAT NATURE AHEAD OF TIME SO THAT I CAN ACTUALLY REQUEST OF THE APPLICANT WHAT IS THE STRUCTURE GONNA BE. SO I CAN COMPARE THAT TO THE GRADES AROUND THE PROPERTY BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO BE ABLE TO GET WITHIN 150 FEET OF THE FURTHEST CORNER OF THE BUILDING DEPENDING ON WHAT THEY DO. NOW, IF IT'S A FULLY SPRINKLER BUILDING, NON-COMBUSTIBLE TYPE BUILDING, THAT INCREASES THE DISTANCE FURTHER AWAY. HOWEVER, UM, THE FIRE DEPARTMENT ACCESS FOR THE HOSPITAL WAS PART OF THEIR ORIGINAL PLAN. I WAS ABLE TO SEE THAT, KNOW WHERE THAT THING WAS GOING AND IT WAS FULLY SPRINKLED, BUT THERE STILL HAD TO BE ACCESSIBILITY TO SOME OF THOSE AREAS BECAUSE OF THE TYPE OF AREA THAT THEY WERE DEALING WITH SO THAT THE APPARATUS TRUCKS COULD GET IN TO MAKE RESCUES BECAUSE OF THE HEIGHT OF THE STRUCTURE AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. THOSE ARE ALL THINGS THAT NEED TO BE CONSIDERED ALSO NEED TO BE MONITORED DURING THE ENTIRE PROCESS. SO THOSE LAST TWO LINE ITEMS ARE NOT SOMETHING THAT IS CURRENTLY EXISTING WITHIN OUR SCHEDULE, SO I WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU UNDERSTOOD THAT. SO ONCE THIS GOES OUT FOR PUBLIC HEARING, YOU WEREN'T GETTING QUESTIONS. WE'VE NEVER SEEN THIS. WHAT IS THIS? IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, THANK YOU. RELATED TO THE OTHERS AS FAR AS THE FEES, I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER THOSE. UM, JUST TO, TO CLARIFY WHAT YOU SAID, UM, PAGES THREE AND FOUR, OPTION ONE THAT YOU SAID WOULD PAY ABOUT COVER ABOUT 90% OF THE EXPENSES, UM, CO COLUMN TWO, OPTION ONE WOULD COVER APPROXIMATELY 90%. 90% THAT, THAT'S WHAT I'M SPECULATING. AND THEN PAGES FIVE AND SIX YES. YOU SAID WOULD BE NOW THE PAGES FIVE AND SIX. THAT WAS ACTUALLY FOR THE REFERENCE MATERIAL RIGHT. THAT I GAVE YOU. SO, BUT [01:25:01] YES, THAT WOULD COVER, AT LEAST COVER THE COST AND POSSIBLY PROVIDE FOR THINGS THAT WE'RE NOT ACTUALLY COVERING AT THIS POINT IN TIME. I DID, I JUST WANTED TO PUT THE PERCENTAGES AND I DIDN'T WANNA GET 'EM IN THE WRONG BOXES THERE. THANK YOU. YEP. YEP. BUT THE CYCLE OF THIS HAS TO GO OUT FOR PUBLIC HEARING. YOU'LL, YOU'LL HAVE IT IN THE, UH, CONSENT AGENDA. IT'LL GO OUT FOR PUBLIC HEARING. AFTER THAT, YOU'LL HAVE THE ACTUAL PUBLIC HEARING ITSELF AND THEN YOU'LL HAVE THE CHANCE TO VOTE ON THAT. BUT I THINK DR. DALEY IS LOOKING TO PUT SOMETHING IN FRONT OF YOU TO SAY, OKAY, ARE YOU GONNA LOOK AT THE 90% COVERAGE OR ARE YOU GONNA LOOK AT THE HUNDRED, 105% COVERAGE AS FAR AS THAT GOES? WHO WHO DO YOU EXPECT TO GET YOUR MOST QUESTIONS FROM ON THESE? WOULD WOULD IT BE THE, THE, THE BUILDERS OR QUITE FRANKLY, YES. UM, I DO KNOW I'VE SPOKEN TO AT LEAST TWO CONTRACTORS AND THEY'RE THE MORE OF THE PROMINENT CONTRACTORS IN THE, UH, COMMUNITY. THEY KNOW THAT THEIR FEES ARE LOWER THAN WHAT THEY SHOULD BE. THEY, THEY KNOW THAT THERE'S A FEE INCREASE. I HAVE ENCOURAGED THOSE TWO CONTRACTORS TO LOOK AT IT BECAUSE EMILY WAS SUPPOSED TO HAVE PUT THAT OUT ON THE, UH, LAST WORK SESSION AS FAR AS FOR THE AGENDA. AND I BELIEVE THEY HAVE, I DON'T HAVE ANY COMMENTS BACK FROM THEM, BUT THOSE ARE THE ONES, THE LOCAL CONTRACTORS ARE GONNA BE THE ONES THAT HAVE MORE QUESTIONS. I I KNOW THAT YOU HAVEN'T GOTTEN ANY COMMENTS BACK FROM 'EM, BUT, UH, YOU, YOU KIND OF GET THAT GUT FEELING THAT THEY'RE GONNA BE SOMEWHAT OKAY BECAUSE OF THE FACT THEY KNOW THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE PAYING LESS THAN THAN WHAT THEY WOULD AT OTHER LOCALITIES. AT OTHER LOCALITIES. YES. ALL RIGHT. PROBABLY THE ONE THAT WILL IMPACT THE LOCAL CONTRACTORS THE MOST IS, UH, LINE ITEM NUMBER 21 ON PAGE ONE. AND BASICALLY THAT IS THE AGREEMENT IN LIEU OF A PLAN. UH, YEAH. 21. UM, RIGHT NOW, THIS WAS A DISCUSSION THAT WHEN THE TOWN TOOK OVER THE PERMITTING FEE, THEY WANTED TO KNOW WHY OUR PERMIT FEE FOR AN AGREEMENT IN LIEU OF WENT FROM THE $5 UP TO THE, I THINK IT WAS GONNA BE TWO ACTUALLY UP TO GO BACK AND TAKE A LOOK TO SEE WHAT THE EROSION OF THE PATROL PLAN IS. I THINK IT WAS AT LEAST $225. AND THE REASON THAT THE $5 FEE WAS IN THERE WAS BECAUSE WE'RE ALREADY ON SITE. BUT QUITE FRANKLY, WE HAVE A LOT OF COMPLAINTS THAT WE HAVE TO GO OUT AND MAKE SPECIAL TRIPS TO THE, THE FEE THAT IS ASSOCIATED WITH THIS IS BASICALLY WHAT THE PERMIT FEE WOULD HAVE BEEN, LESS THE PLAN REVIEW FEE. SO I'M JUST CHARGING APPLES FOR APPLES. WE'RE DOING THE EROSION AND SENTIMENT CONTROL PERMIT FOR THIS. WE'RE GONNA GO AHEAD AND CHARGE THE SAME AMOUNT FOR IT WHEN WE DO JUST A SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING AS OPPOSED TO THE REDUCED AMOUNT. BECAUSE EVEN THOUGH WE'RE ON SITE, IT IS TAKING TIME AND IT IS PRETTY CUMBERSOME TO KEEP UP THE THESE THINGS. BASED ON YOUR CURRENT WORKLOAD, WHAT, HOW MUCH REVENUE WILL THE COLUMN ONE AND COLUMN TWO PRODUCE? DO YOU KNOW? COLUMN ONE, AND I HAVEN'T ACTUALLY LOOKED AT THE ACTUAL TOTAL AT THE BOTTOM. ALYSSA, YOU DON'T HAVE THE TOTALS WITH YOU, DO YOU? AS FAR AS FOR THE BUDGETS FOR BUILDING INSPECTIONS, I THINK IT'S IN THE AREA OF ABOUT 550,000 AS FAR AS THE BUDGET ITEM. SO COLUMN TWO WOULD PROBABLY BE IN ABOUT THE FOUR 90 TO 500,000. OKAY. OF THAT 550,000, THE COLUMN THREE WOULD PROBABLY BE ABOUT FIVE 50 TO 600. OKAY. AND WHEN I SAY THAT THERE'S PROBABLY MORE THAN WHAT THE BUDGET LINE ITEM INCLUDES, IT'S BECAUSE THERE'S TWO THINGS THAT ARE, THAT HAVE SHIFTED IN THE LAST COUPLE OF CYCLES. SOME OF OUR EXPENSES FOR TECHNOLOGY HAVE BEEN MOVED OUT, BUT IT'S STILL SOLELY PRETTY MUCH OUR EXPENSE THAT'S COSTING THE COUNTY. SO YOU'VE GOTTA KIND OF INCORPORATE THAT BACK IN. PLUS YOU DON'T ACTUALLY CALCULATE IN WHAT OUR FEES FOR THAT SPACE IF WE HAD TO RENT A LOCATION AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. SO THERE ARE THINGS THAT ARE OUTSIDE THE REALM OF WHAT WE ACTUALLY HAVE NOW. WE GET CHARGED FOR THE PHONES, WE GET CHARGED FOR DIFFERENT THINGS AS FAR AS THAT GOES, BUT THERE ARE STILL SOME THINGS OUT THERE THAT WE DON'T GET CHARGED FOR. THANK YOU. SUCH AS, UM, WELL, THE UTILITIES, LIGHTS, THINGS OF THAT NATURE. IT'S ALL INCORPORATED INTO THE BUILDING AS FAR AS THAT GOES. IT'S NOT BROKEN DOWN FOR THE UTILITIES. SO WHAT HE'S SAYING IS THAT THE COMMUNITY IS ABSORBING [01:30:01] PART OF THE BUDGET FOR THAT'S, THAT'S NOT ACTUALLY SHOWN IN MY BUDGET LETTER. RIGHT. THAT ISN'T REFLECTED IN HIS BUDGET. BUT THEY'RE STILL PAYING IT BECAUSE THE WHOLE COMMUNITY PAYS FOR THE ELECTRIC FOR THIS BUILDING. YES, SIR. YEAH. SO THE, THESE ARE THE, THE, THE COMMON THINGS THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT. EVERYBODY USES LIGHTS, EVERYBODY USES THE, THE PHONES, ALL THAT. YEAH. OKAY. AND I USE THOSE KIND OF THINGS BECAUSE I DO KNOW THAT IN CHESTERFIELD, ACTUALLY IT WAS INCO COUNTY, THEY HAD A, UH, CONTRACTOR GO BACK AGAINST THE BUILDING INSPECTIONS DEPARTMENT BECAUSE THERE WAS A COMMENT MADE THAT THEY WERE MAKING MONEY, PUTTING MONEY INTO THE GENERAL FUND WHERE THEY STARTED TO BREAK EVERYTHING DOWN AND SHOW, YES, WE ARE ACTUALLY MAKING MORE THAN WHAT OUR BUDGET SHOWS, BUT WE'RE NOT GETTING CHARGED FOR THIS. WE'RE NOT GETTING CHARGED FOR THIS. SO BY THE TIME IT WAS ALL CALCULATED IN, IT WASN'T ACTUALLY PUTTING MONEY BACK INTO, IT WAS COVERING ITS COSTS. AND THAT'S ALL THAT THE BUILDING INSPECTIONS DEPARTMENT IS SUPPOSED TO DO. BUT CURRENTLY UNDER, UNDER OUR CURRENT REVENUE, WE WE'RE SUBSIDIZING THE COUNTY IS SUBSIDIZING YOU, UH, THE COUNTY TAXPAYERS. YES. AND TOWN TAXPAYERS ARE ALSO COUNTY TAXPAYERS. YES. ARE SUBSIDIZING ANYWHERE BETWEEN AT 40 $500,000. OH, WELL BETWEEN 40 AND 60% DEPENDING ON WHAT THAT GOOD YEAR OR BAD YEAR IS. RIGHT, RIGHT. BECAUSE I'M LOOKING AT THE NUMBERS RIGHT NOW. SO FOR FISCAL YEAR 23, YOUR EXPENDITURES WERE, UM, 618,000. AND WHEN I LOOK UNDERNEATH THIS ACCOUNT FOR REVENUE, IT'S 602,000. SO IS OUR, IS OUR OBJECTIVE HERE TO BREAK EVEN? THAT WOULD BE A PERFECT WORLD. YES. THIS IS TO BREAK EVEN MM-HMM. . NOW ARE WE, DO WE HAVE OUR FEES SET TO WHERE WE HAVE THE POTENTIAL FOR DOING THAT? OR DO, ARE WE WORKING TO WHERE WE KNOW THAT WE'RE GONNA BE SUBSIDIZED SOMEWHAT. IF WE GO WITH COLUMN THREE, WHICH IS OPTION TWO, WE WOULD BE COVERING OUR FEES. IF WE GO WITH COLUMN TWO, IT'S UM, THE OPTION ONE, WE WOULD STILL BE SUBSIDIZING IT TO THE TUNE OF ABOUT 10%. THAT, THAT'S MY EX. OKAY. THANK YOU. EXPECTATION . AND IN COLUMN TWO, OR IN COLUMN THREE, DO YOU ANTICIPATE HIRING ADDITIONAL PEOPLE TO BE ABLE TO, TO TAKE SOME OF THE WORKLOAD FROM WHERE YOU ARE NOW SO THAT YOU CAN DO THE COLUMN THREE WOULD GIVE US THAT ABILITY TO SHOW YOU THAT THERE IS REVENUE THERE TO JUSTIFY AN INITIAL PERSON? YES. RIGHT. UM, QUITE FRANKLY, OUR, THE, WHERE WE LACK THE MOST IS HAVING SOMEBODY TO DO MORE. SO SPECIFICALLY ON THE EROSION AND SEDIMENT CONTROL FOLLOW UP AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE. UM, I DON'T KNOW OF A JURISDICTION OF OUR SIZE, EVEN WITH THE CITY OF WINCHESTER, THEY ACTUALLY HAVE A DEPARTMENT THAT HANDLES ALL THEIR EROSION AND SETTLEMENT CONTROL THAT ACTUALLY DOES THE MINIMUM OF WHAT'S REQUIRED. BECAUSE W WHEN WE HAVE A RAINFALL, WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE OUT LOOKING AT EACH AND EVERY SITE THAT HAS A PERMIT ISSUE TO IT. WHEW. DO YOU, DO YOU UNDERSTAND THE MAGNITUDE OF YEAH, THAT'S HUGE. ? YES. . YEAH. SO CAN, CAN YOU EXPLAIN HERE, I'M JUST TAKING A LOOK AT, UH, UH, LINES SIX UHHUH , IT SAYS PER SQUARE FOOT OF, UH, AND IT LOOKS LIKE MANUFACTURER OR INDUSTRIALIZED. AND, AND THAT'S, THAT'S FOR, FOR COMMERCIAL LINES? THAT, THAT NO, THAT IS RESIDENTIAL. OKAY. SO THE, THE, THE NEW MANUFACTURING OR WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? INDUSTRIALIZED? THOSE ARE TERMINOLOGIES THAT WE USE IN THE BUILDING. CODE MODULAR IS A, THE, UH, NORTH AMERICAN, THAT'S A MODULAR INDUSTRIALIZED IS THE ACTUAL HOUSE. THAT'S A MANUFACTURED HOUSE. OKAY. A, A, A TRAILER. AND THEN THEN ONE NINE IT SAYS PER SQUARE PUT, UH, OF ADDITION OR RENOVATION OR ALTERATION. SO SAY LIKE IF, UH, IF, IF YOU HAVE A, UH, UH, A HOUSE THAT YOU WANT TO PULL A PERMIT ON MM-HMM. AND YOU'VE GOT A 10 BY 10 ROOM, THEN THAT'S GONNA BE A $45 FEE IF YOU, IF YOU GO WITH A 0.45 PER SQUARE FOOT. CORRECT. OKAY. ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, COMMENTS? THANK YOU VERY MUCH. THANK YOU. AND IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS AFTER THIS, FEEL FREE TO LET ME KNOW. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. [01:35:05] I'M NOT SURE IF MATT, DO YOU HAVE A PACKET OF MATT OF THE PLANNING? YES. OKAY. I'VE MADE COPIES REAL QUICK. I WASN'T SURE IF HE PUT THEM DOWN. THESE ARE THE FEES THAT, UM, MATT HAD PRESENTED AT THE WORK SESSION. I THINK THAT WAS LAST MONTH. AND, UM, HE ALSO CALCULATED THE REVENUE THAT THE, UM, PLANNING DEPARTMENT HAS MADE. THAT'S OFF OUR CURRENT FEES, UM, FOR I THINK THE LAST FIVE YEARS. SO THE CURRENT FEES WERE AVERAGING ABOUT 45,000, UM, $670 PER YEAR SINCE 2016 WHEN HE WENT BACK IN AND LOOKED AT THE REVENUES. SO HE HAS THE PROPOSED FEE AND THE CURRENT FEE, AND THE LAST FOUR ON HIS SPREADSHEET ARE, UM, SERVICES THAT WE'VE BEEN PROVIDING OVER THE YEARS AND JUST NOT CHARGING FOR. I'M HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. I THINK IT'S PR THESE ARE PROBABLY PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD. UM, WE HAVEN'T RAISED THE FEES IN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT SINCE 2004, I BELIEVE. SO WE KEPT SAYING WE WERE GOING TO BRING IT FORWARD AND JUST GOT BUSY. AND, UM, SO, SO, SO THEN SAY LIKE IF, UH, IF YOU PLAN TO, TO BUILD A HOUSE AND, UH, YOU COME IN AND YOU SAY, UH, YOU KNOW, HERE'S MY PLANS, THEN THESE WOULD BE THE FEES THAT YOU COULD EXPECT TO PAY. WELL, THAT'S GONNA BE MORE SO IN DAVID'S, UM, DEPARTMENT FOR THE BUILDING, BUILDING PERMITS. OKAY. YOU DO PAY A ZONING PERMIT FEE. UM, SO WHEN YOU APPLY FOR YOUR BUILDING PERMIT, YOUR BUILDING PERMIT, IT IS REVIEWED, UM, THROUGH THE, THE PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT TO SEE IF IT MEETS THE ZONING REQUIREMENTS. SO SETBACKS, UM, MAKING SURE YOU HAVE YOUR HEALTH PERMIT FOR YOUR WELL AND SEPTIC. UM, THESE ARE MORE, IF YOU WANNA COME AND CHANGE THE ZONING OF YOUR PROPERTY FROM AGRICULTURAL TO COMMERCIAL, LET'S SAY, UM, OR YOU WANNA SUBDIVIDE YOUR PROPERTY, OR A LOT OF PEOPLE, UM, HAVE TWO LOTS NEXT TO EACH OTHER. THEY WANT TO COMBINE OR THEY WANNA CHANGE THE BOUNDARIES OF THEIR PARCEL. UM, SHORT TERM RENTALS, UM, ALL THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FEES, THEY ARE PROPOSING TO, UM, WELL WE, WE DO ACTUALLY HAVE LOW FEES, UM, IN THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT, BUT, UM, IN, IN CONTRAST WITH OUR NEIGHBORS. SO WE, UM, THEY ARE PROPOSING A SEPARATE, UM, FEE SPECIFICALLY, YOU KNOW, FOR CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS. SO FOR PROFIT, FOR PROFIT NON-PROFIT, WHICH WE ALREADY HAVE. AND WE DO HAVE CERTAIN, UM, CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS NOW THAT DO YOU HAVE A DIFFERENT FEE SUCH AS COMMUNICATION TOWERS, BUT THEY'RE ALSO PROPOSING A DIFFERENT FEE FOR THE SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTALS BECAUSE OF ALL THE FOLLOW UP THAT GOES INTO THOSE THAT, THAT THEIR STAFF HAS TO DO. SO THEN THIS NOTE THAT YOU HAVE OVER HERE FOR THE SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL HERE, THE, UH, IT'S, UH, FOR, FOR POST APPLICATION REVIEW. DOES THAT MEAN THAT IF, IF THEY, THEY COME IN AND THEY PUT A, UH, AN APPLICATION IN AND FOR WHATEVER REASON WE TURN IT DOWN, THEN DID THEY GET REFUNDED THAT OR THEY DO NOT GET REFUNDED THAT THEY DO NOT GET REFUNDED? UM, THE POST APPLICATION REVIEW IS IF THEY ARE APPROVED, THEN ALL THE WORK THAT GOES INTO MAKING SURE THAT THEY, THEY HAVE TO SUBMIT ANNUAL REPORTS, THEY HAVE TO, UM, THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT DOES A SITE VISIT TO MAKE SURE ALL THE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS ARE, UM, THAT THEY'RE ADHERING TO THOSE. SO IT MORE GOES INTO, TO THE SHORT TERM RENTAL REVIEW, UM, JUST BECAUSE OF THE FOLLOW UP THEY HAVE TO DO ONCE THE APPLICATION IS APPROVED. SOME APPLICATIONS REALLY, IF YOU HAVE LIKE A GUEST HOUSE PER SE, YOU KNOW, NOT A LOT'S GONNA GO INTO THAT POST-APPROVAL. UM, JUST SOME CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS, SPECIFICALLY SHORT TERM RENTALS HAVE A LOT MORE FOLLOW UP AFTER THE FACT. BUT, BUT THEY DO NOT GET REFUNDED. UM, THAT FEE ALSO GOES, THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FEE, UM, GOES FOR THE ADVERTISING, UM, THE ADJOINING PROPERTY OWNER LETTERS, AND THEN JUST STAFF TIME OF STAFF REPORTS. AND SO, SO I, I'M JUST KIND OF CURIOUS, DO WE HAVE ANY FINES FOR PEOPLE THAT, UH, OR FOR [01:40:01] FOLKS THAT GO OUT AND SAY LIKE, UH, EITHER, EITHER BECAUSE THEY JUST DIDN'T KNOW, OR THEY JUST KIND OF BLEW IT OFF THAT, UH, THAT THEY, THEY WERE GONNA HAVE A SHORT TERM RENTAL OR, OR EVEN AND I'VE GOT A, UH, I'VE GOT A CONSTITUENT THAT, UH, APPARENTLY A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO THERE WAS A BUILDING UP THERE THAT HE SAID THAT THERE WERE LIKE 15 DIFFERENT APARTMENTS THAT, THAT WERE, WERE UP THERE. AND I DON'T THINK THE COUNTY EVER KNEW ABOUT THAT OR WELL, AND THAT WAS A ZONING VIOLATION. OKAY. UM, THERE ARE, IF, AND IF THE ZONING VIOLATION IS TO THE POINT WHERE THEY'RE NOT COMPLYING AND THEY DON'T COMPLY, THEN THE ZONING OFFICER DOES, DOES TAKE THEM TO COURT. AND THE COURT DOES IMPOSE A FINE A LOT, MOST TIMES IS THAT, UM, WE DON'T HAVE A FI A A FINE THROUGH COMPLAINING ZONING, BUT THAT'S JUST THE PROCESS THAT IT GOES THROUGH THE COURT. THE JUDGE WILL ACTUALLY IMPOSE A FINE D DOES THE MONEY COME BACK TO THE COUNTY OR DOES THAT GO INTO SOME POOL FOR THE JUDICIAL? DEPENDING UPON WHAT THE CITATION IS, IT WOULD GO BACK INTO THE COUNTY POOL. YOU HAVE A LINE OVER YOUR REVENUES THERE FOR, BUT IF THEY WERE ON SPECIFIC JUST STATE CHARGES, THEN IT WOULD GO TO THE STATE. OKAY. YEAH. HOW LONG DOES THAT TAKE? HOW LONG DOES IT TAKE TO HAVE IT HAVE ANY BITE INTO ANY VIOLATION? NOBODY'S BEEN EVER, EVER, AND WE, WE, WE, I THINK, WELL, WHEN I WAS BACK THERE, WE DID, UM, IT WAS LIKE 30 DAYS FOR THEM TO COMPLY. UM, AND THEN WHEN YOU ACTUALLY GO TO COURT, I MEAN, IT'S PROBABLY A SIX MONTH PROCESS, I WOULD SAY IF YOU DO TAKE THEM TO COURT AND GO THROUGH THE PROCESS. BUT WE, WE, THAT DOESN'T HAPPEN OFTEN. I MEAN, NORMALLY IF, IF THE ZONING ADMINISTRATOR SENDS A LETTER AND THEY HAVE 30 DAYS TO COMPLY, THEN UM, THE PEOPLE REACH OUT AND WE WORK WITH THEM. I MEAN, SO YOU'RE NOT CONSTANTLY TELLING 'EM YOUR'RE IN VIOLATION AND HERE'S ANOTHER 30 DAY NOTICE? NO, SIR. OKAY. THANK YOU. I'M NOT SURE HOW MANY CASES THEY HAVE IN COURT RIGHT NOW. UM, I'M SURE MATT CAN GIVE YOU AN UPDATE ON THAT. I'LL ASK QUESTION. YES, MA'AM. OKAY. SO I'M LOOKING AT THE REQUEST AND I SEE PLANNING AND ZONING FOR LA UH, THIS CURRENT FISCAL YEAR WAS $473,000. BILLING INSPECTIONS FOR THIS YEAR WAS $618,000. THEN I GO OVER HERE AND I LOOK AT THE REVENUE THAT WE BRING IN FOR BOTH OF THOSE DEPARTMENTS. I ONLY SEE ONE LINE ITEM, WHICH IS PERMITS, ANOTHER LICENSES, AND THE REV, UH, THE OFFSETTING REVENUE IS $602,000. SO MY QUESTION IS FOR PERMITS FEES AND LICENSE FOR REVENUE ACCOUNT 13 0 30, DOES THAT INCLUDE INSPECTIONS AND PLANNING AND ZONING, OR IS THAT JUST, I DON'T THINK BUILDING DON'T THINK SO. I DON'T HAVE THAT IN FRONT OF ME, BUT, OH, I'M SORRY. NO, THAT'S OKAY. BECAUSE I'M JUST KIND OF LOOKING AT THE MATH. YOU KNOW, AS FAR, YOU KNOW, OUR OBJECTIVES TO BREAK EVEN. RIGHT. MAYBE IT DOES INCLUDE IT SEPARATE. THEY'RE NOT IN FRONT, THEY'RE, THEY'RE TWO SEPARATE FEES. SO THEY SHOULD, THEY SHOULD BE, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT, BUT, OH, I'M LOOKING AT OUR REVENUE THINGY. OKAY. THAT IS PROBABLY FOR PLANNING ZONING THERAPY THAT THEY HAVE THE REVENUE COMING IN AND YOUR FEE AS WELL. SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT SHE'S LOOKING AT. I'M LOOKING AT THIS RIGHT HERE. I THINK SHE'S LOOKING AT THIS SUMMARY RIGHT HERE. YEAH, RIGHT THERE. I'M ASSUMING THAT'S THE OFFSETTING REVENUE FOR BOTH OF THE DEPARTMENTS, I'M ASSUMING. IS IT, UM, IS IT COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT? YES. IS THAT WHAT IT'S ENTITLED? MM-HMM. . SO I LOOK UNDER COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT FOR EXPENSES IS, UH, FOR PLANNING AND ZONINGS $473,000. AND THEN I LOOK UNDERNEATH THE EXPENDITURES. SO ANYWAY, SO WHAT I'M GETTING AT, YOU KNOW, IS THAT WE'RE IT, IF WHAT WE'RE SAYING IS TRUE AS FAR AS THE REVENUES COMING IN, SO WE'RE SPENDING FOR THIS FISCAL YEAR OVER A MILLION DOLLARS FOR THE ZONING AND THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. AND IF THIS NUMBER IS CORRECT, WE'RE ONLY BRINGING IN 600. WE HAVE A [01:45:01] SEPARATION. BUT THIS IS COMBINED. IT'S COMBINED. OKAY. YEAH, I'M, YEAH. SO LAST YEAR WE HAD WE'RE 4,000, UM, $637 IN REVENUE AND PLANNING. AND THEN OUR BUDGET WAS, OUR TOTAL BUDGET WAS FOUR 60. YEAH, FOUR SEVEN. YEAH. YEAH. SO, SO JUST MY POINT THAT I'M MAKING IS THAT WE'RE SUBSIDING 50%. YES, THAT WAS MY POINT. SO JUST WANTED TO UNDERSTAND , JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, PLANNING AND ZONING IS SOMETHING THAT EACH AND EVERY COUNTY WANTS TO HAVE. EVERY JURISDICTION WANTS TO HAVE BUILDING INSPECTIONS AS A NECESSARY EVIL. THE STATE MANDATES YOU HAVE A BUILDING INSPECTIONS DEPARTMENT. MM-HMM. , THEY DON'T MANDATE THAT YOU SPECIFICALLY HAVE A PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT, BUT IT IT'S DEFINITELY A GOOD IDEA. AND THEY DO HAVE REG REGULATIONS THAT YOU HAVE TO MEET, BUT BUILDING INSPECTIONS ISN'T MANDATED. YOU HAVE TO HAVE, WELL, I CAN TELL YOU FROM, FROM EXPERIENCE, WE, WE LIVED IN HOUSTON FOR A COUPLE OF YEARS AND, UH, THEY DON'T HAVE ANY ZONING THERE. AND YOU CAN BE DRIVING IN A RESIDENTIAL NEIGHBORHOOD, TURN THE CORNER, AND HERE'S A 20 STORY OFFICE BUILDING RIGHT IN THE MIDDLE. AND IT'S, IT'S VERY ODD. OH, LOOKING AT THESE FEES ARE LONG OVERDUE. YES, MA'AM. WE NEED BEYOND YOUR, WE NEED TO COME TALK AMONGST YOURSELVES AND WE NEED TO PUT THEM ON THE AGENDA THIS NEXT MONTH. MM-HMM. , IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? NOPE. THANK YOU. ONE LAST, SO WE'LL LET YOU SEE SCHEDULE. THANK YOU. ONE OF YOUR ORDINANCES, SHERRY, DON'T LEAVE. I GOT SOMETHING I WANNA BRING UP AND ASK YOU ABOUT. WHY DON'T YOU GO AHEAD. OKAY, SHERRY, SO WE ARE A TOURIST DESTINATION WHERE PEOPLE COME AND PURCHASE SECOND HOMES, RIGHT? THERE'S A LOT OF SECOND HOME OWNERSHIP HERE. SOME OF THEM ARE OUT-OF-STATE OWNERS. AND WHAT I DISCOVERED WAS THAT SOME OF THE OTHER TOURISTS, DESTINATIONS AROUND THE EAST COAST CHARGE DIFFERENT RATES. SO FOR INSTANCE, A PRIMARY RESIDENT PAYS A LOWER RATE THAN A SECONDARY RESIDENT OR AN EVEN A HIGHER RATE FOR OUTTA STATE OWNERS. AND I WAS WONDERING, A, IS THAT, IS THAT PERMISSIBLE IN THE STATE OF VIRGINIA? YOU MAY NOT BE ABLE TO ANSWER THIS RIGHT AWAY. . SO HE'S SAYING NO, , I'VE NEVER HEARD OF IT. YOU'VE NEVER HEARD OF IT. OKAY. SO THIS, THIS IS SOUTH CAROLINA WHERE IT, THERE'S A LOT OF TOURISM, UH, AND MY SON CAME ACROSS THIS AND SHARED THIS WITH ME. HE GOES, THIS MIGHT BE THE ANSWER TO YOUR SHORT TERM RENTAL PROBLEM, , WHERE YOU HAVE A LOT OF OUT-OF-STATE INVESTORS DRIVING UP THE COST, THEN YOU'RE RECOVERING OUT-OF-STATE INVESTORS THROUGH TAX REVENUE. SO ANYWAY, YEAH, I THOUGHT I'D TRY . I ALREADY TRIED THAT WITH HIM AND I THINK HE SHOT ME DOWN TOO. . SO YOUR FRIENDLY NEIGHBORS DOWN THE ROAD HERE IN WEST VIRGINIA, RIGHT? WEST BY GOD, VIRGINIA. YEP. THEY CHARGED TWICE. YEAH. THEY CHARGE A RATE OF TWO FOR OWNER OCCUPIED RESIDENTIAL. THEY CHARGE A RATE OF FOUR FOR RENTALS. RIGHT. TENNESSEE DOES SOMETHING VERY SIMILAR. I'M NOT SURE EXACTLY WHAT IT IS. YEAH. BUT THEY DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT. SO THERE ARE, BUT THAT REQUIRES YOUR FRIENDLY STATE LEGISLATURE TO COOPERATE, BUT IT MAY BE A SOURCE OF REVENUE. YES, IT IS FOR LOCALITIES, SINCE THE STATE CONTINUES TO MANDATE UNFUNDED STUFF, IT'S A GOOD CON, IT'S A GOOD SOURCE OF REVENUE FOR LOCALITIES, AND IT DOESN'T COST THE STATE A PENNY. WELL, AND IT ALSO I THINK, MITIGATES SOME OF THE IMPACT OF THESE INCREASING HOME PRICES YES. THAT HAPPEN AS A RESULT OF THIS INVESTMENT THAT'S GOING ON INTO YOUR COMMUNITY. SO IT MAY BE [01:50:01] A GREAT TOPIC TO EXPLORE IN THE NEAR FUTURE. AND IT IS. THANK YOU, MA'AM. CAN, CAN WE DO SOMETHING LIKE THAT IN THE STATE OR IS IT YOU CAN CONTACT YOUR FRIENDLY LOCAL DELEGATE. IT'S NOT LEGAL IN THE STATE OF VIRGINIA ACCORDING TO THESE TWO. THERE IT IS NOT BECAUSE WE HAVE, I HAVE LOOKED BEFORE. OKAY. I'VE HAD MY ATTORNEYS LOOK BEFORE AND OKAY, WE CAN'T DO IT AT THIS POINT BECAUSE BEING A DILLON STATE, WHAT STATE DILLON RULE STATE, WE HAVE TO GO DOWN IN MOTHER MAY. I WE'RE ONLY ALLOWED TO DO THE THINGS WHICH THEY APPROVE. THESE ARE TERMS THAT ONE LEARNS. IF YOU TAKE THE CERTIFIED SUPERVISOR TRAINING PROGRAM IN A HOME RULE CLASS, YEAH. STATE RATHER, YOU CAN GO AND YOU CAN DO ANYTHING THE STATE DOES NOT PROHIBIT. SO AN EXAMPLE BEING IN KANSAS IS A HOME RULE STATE. SO IN KANSAS, WE E ESTABLISHED A 1 CENT SALES TAX FOR CAPITAL PROJECTS IN 1978. AND THEY BUILT CITY HALL FIRE STATION SCHOOLS NEVER HAD TO RAISE ONE PENNY OF DEBT BECAUSE THEY PUT THE SALES TAX ON. AND WHEN THEY HAD ENOUGH MONEY, THEY BUILT ONE OF THEIR PROJECTS. UM, GUINEA BACK TO THE ISSUE AT HAND, UH, LOOKING AT THE DUE DATE THAT YOU WILL SEE HERE, THAT'S PROPOSED IS JUNE 22ND. AND WE TOOK JUNE 22ND BECAUSE THE TOWN IS DOING THE 20TH. AND THE 20TH FOR US IS A HOLIDAY FOLLOWED BY ELECTION DAY. SO WE TOOK THE 22ND THERE. THIS WOULD REQUIRE TO DO THAT, THAT THERE BE BILLS BE MAILED ON OR ABOUT MAY 17, WHICH REQUIRES THAT THE BILLS GET TO THE TREASURER ON OR ABOUT MAY 10, WHICH REQUIRES THAT THE RATES BE GIVEN TO THE COMMISSIONER ON OR ABOUT MAY 3RD. THIS WOULD MEAN THAT YOU NEED TO SET THE RATES FOR ALL THE TAXES ON MAY THE SECOND. THE, YOU CAN SCHEDULE A PUBLIC HEARING ON NEXT TUESDAY FOR THE SECOND, OR FOR THE END OF IT, FOR ANY OTHER DATE THAT YOU WANT IN THERE. UM, YOU CAN, IF YOU SET A RATE, UH, EXAMPLE BEING, IF YOU SET 50 CENTS REQUIRES A PUBLIC HEARING, AND IF YOU THEN DECIDED YOU WANTED TO SET THE RATE AT 49, YOU COULD DO SO. YOU COULD NOT SET THE RATE AT 51 WITHOUT ANOTHER HEARING, BUT YOU COULD SET IT FOR A LOWER RATE THAN WHAT YOU ADVERTISE. UH, THAT, AND THE SANITARY DISTRICTS ARE THE PRIMARY ONE. THERE'S A COUPLE OF SANITARY DISTRICTS THAT WANT TO CHANGE THEIR RATES, AND WE'RE GETTING THOSE LOCKED DOWN TO MAKE SURE WE HAVE EXACTLY WHAT IT IS THEY WANT. ONE OF THEM IS GONNA MEET MONDAY NIGHT, UH, ONE OF MR. MA'S FAVORITES. GOOD DEAL. AND, UH, THEY'RE GOING TO MEET ON MONDAY NIGHT, SO WE MAY BE BRINGING YOU A DIFFERENT RATE FOR THEM ON TUESDAY, NEXT TUESDAY. UM, SO, SO JUST TO CLARIFY, SO THAT MEANS, DOES THAT MEAN THAT, SAY LIKE IF WE COME ALONG, WE GO, OKAY, WE'RE GONNA SET THE RATE AT 51, WE HAVE THE PUBLIC HEARING, AND THEN WE COME BACK AND WE GO, NO, WE'RE GONNA SET AT 50. WE DON'T NEED ANOTHER PUBLIC HEARING. NO. OKAY. YOU CAN DO THAT. YES. OKAY. AND YOU WOULD DO THAT AT THAT TIME? YES. UM, DON'T MEAN TO FRIGHTEN ANYBODY SHOWING THE GAP IN THE BUDGET. THAT'S 10% AND THAT'S VERY DOABLE. I WENT THROUGH THEM THROUGH ALL THE LINE ITEMS BEFORE. AND YOU NOTICE THERE ARE A NUMBER OF BUDGETS IN HERE THAT ARE ASKING FOR 10% INCREASES. AND SO THERE ARE PLACES WHERE THOSE CAN BE REDUCED AND WITH, OBVIOUSLY THERE'S SOME IMPACT ON ANY SERVICE, BUT MINIMAL IMPACT ON ANY SERVICE. AND ALL THE, UH, PARTNER AGENCIES IN THIS BUDGET PROPOSAL ARE LEVEL FUNDED AT THIS POINT, SO THAT YOU'RE AWARE OF THAT LEVEL FUNDED FROM 20, FROM THE CURRENT YEAR, FROM THIS YEAR, FROM THIS FROM THE CURRENT YEAR, BUT NOT WITH THE PROPOSED, UM, [01:55:01] THAT THEY CAME IN ASKING FOR. NO. GOTCHA. THIS HAS A LEVEL. OKAY. IS THERE ANY THAT'S REDUCED? NO. NO QUESTION. DO WE KNOW WHEN THE, OR WHAT DATES, UM, FOR THE BOARD OF EQUALIZATION TO START MEETING WITH PEOPLE? I'M NOT SURE. UH, WE CAN GET YOU THAT SHE SAID NEXT WEEK, BUT WELL, I'M, I'M THINKING THAT'S ABOUT RIGHT, BUT I'M NOT SURE. OKAY. AND I DON'T WANT TO GIVE YOU THE WRONG DATE, BUT WE'LL CHECK THAT. OKAY. I THINK IT'S ABOUT THE MIDDLE OF APRIL THAT THEY WERE GONNA START MEETING. CAN PEOPLE START THAT, START CALLING IN FOR APPOINTMENTS? I KNOW THERE WAS A WELL, THEY'LL PUBLISH THAT AND PUT IT ON THE WEB. OKAY. UH, MR. HENDERSON WILL PUT THAT UP ON THE WEBSITE FOR EVERYBODY. OKAY. THANK YOU. TODD WILL DO SOME SORT OF A LITTLE, I'VE HAD A LOT OF PEOPLE ON THE RADIO AND YEAH. TELL EVERYBODY. OKAY. AND IT GOES FOR SEVERAL MONTHS, SO IT'S NOT AS, UH, QUICK AS IT WAS WITH, UH, THE ASSESSMENT HEARINGS. OKAY. I HAVE A COUPLE MORE QUESTIONS. OKAY. FROM THIS SHEET HERE, THE BUDGET MM-HMM. , THIS ONE HERE. BUDGET IN A BOX. BUDGET IN A BOX. ALL RIGHT. SO IF WE BREAK EVEN LOOKING ON THE REVENUE SIDE OF THE 88 MILL MM-HMM. , THAT, THAT'S JUST GOING TO BE ZERO FROM, WELL, I DON'T ANTICIPATE, I WOULD NOT ANTICIPATE THAT COMING FROM ME, MA'AM. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. THERE'LL BE SOME CHANGES ON BOTH SIDES OF THE EQUATION. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. AND THEN YOU HAVE A COLUMN, UH, A ROW HERE CALLED LESS GROCERY SALES. SO HOW DOES THAT FIT IN INTO THIS? THAT'S THE WILD CARD. THAT'S THE STATE, THAT'S THE WILD CARD. OKAY. THE STATE HAS SAID THEY WANT TO ELIMINATE THE GROCERY TAX, RIGHT. ONE AND A HALF PERCENT. THEY HAVE, HAVE HAD DIFFERENT IDEAS AS TO WHAT THEY WOULD REPLACE THAT WITH. WE DO NOT HAVE ANYTHING ON ANY TYPE OF FORMULA TO SEE HOW IT RELATES TO US. WE ANTICIPATE JUST ANTICIPATING KIND OF DRAWING AROUND AND PLAYING WITH THINGS LIKE THE BUDGET IN A BOX. WE THINK IT'S ABOUT 1.2 MILLION. OKAY. IS WHAT WE, AND IF THEY TURNED AROUND AND GAVE US BACK 1.3, WE'RE GONNA BE A HUNDRED THOUSAND TO THE GOOD. AND IF WE WERE WRONG AND IT ACTUALLY COSTS US 1.4, THEN WE'LL BE ONE DOT A HUNDRED THOUSAND BEHIND. BUT I THINK THAT 1.2 IS GONNA BE IN THE RANGE. OKAY. NOW THIS 9.9 MILLION MM-HMM. ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF EXPENDITURES. THAT'S, IF I GO BACK TO THE, THIS, WHAT ARE WE CALLING THE, UH, THE DIFFERENT RATES? MM-HMM. . SO IF I LOOK AT, IF WE, IF WE CHOSE THE POINT 48 MM-HMM. AND WE'RE LOSING SIX, UH, WE'RE LOSING 694,000 YES. IN REVENUE, CAN I GO BACK TO THIS 9 MILLION AND REDUCE 600,000? NO, YOU'D HAVE TO ADD, IF YOU RE, IF YOU REDUCE THE RATE DOWN TO 48, WE'RE ASSUMING A LEVEL RATE AT 49. OKAY. IF YOU REDUCE THE RATE, THEN THAT HAS TO BE ADDED TO THE DEFICIT RIGHT HERE, BECAUSE THAT'S GONNA LOWER THE GREEN NUMBER. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. AND YOU'LL PUSH ME OVER 10 MILLION. SO I, I JUST WANT TO CONFIRM SOMETHING. AND THE, SO WE'VE GOT THE, THE BASE BUDGET IS 88,925,000 MM-HMM. . AND WE'RE ALSO TAKING A LOOK AT THE, AT THE REAL ESTATE OVER HERE THAT, UH, SAY LIKE IF WE KEEP IT AT 49, IT'S GONNA BE BRINGING IN 32 MILLION. MM-HMM. . SO ARE WE MAKING THE ASSUMPTION THAT WE'RE GONNA GET 57 MILLION FROM THE STATE AND OTHER SOURCES OR? WELL, THERE ARE A WHOLE BUNCH OF SOURCES. UM, AND WE GET, UM, LET ME GET ONE OF THE SHEETS. SO IF YOU LOOK ON YOUR, THIS REVENUE SHEET, YOU SEE THERE'S 6.2 MILLION SALES TAX AND THAT WILL GO UP PROBABLY 6.6 NEXT YEAR. YOU SEE THERE'S 1,000,003 IN BUSINESS LICENSES AND 1,000,003 IN MEALS IN BEVERAGE [02:00:01] TAX. AND THAT TOTAL COLUMN THERE'S 12 MILLION. SO THAT 12 MILLION GETS ADDED ON TO THIS 62 UP HERE. AND THEN IF WE TAKE THE PERMITS, IF YOU INCREASE THOSE PERMITS, THEN WE'RE GONNA BE ABOVE THIS 900,000. AND THEN OVER ON THE CHARGES STATE REVENUE, YOU SEE A TOTAL THERE FOR EACH OF THE CATEGORICAL CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS AND YOU SEE A TOTAL OF 6.9 MILLION. AND THEN YOU SEE THE REVENUE FROM THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT, FEDERAL PROJECTS, THAT'S 2.4. AND THOSE WILL BE ADDED, ALL ADDED IN THERE TO COME UP WITH THIS 88. AND AS I SAY, THIS DOESN'T COME ALL FROM ONE SPOT. MM-HMM. , YOU'LL NOTICE THAT TWO YEARS, THAT THIS PAST YEAR, THIS CURRENT BUDGET, WE BUDGETED 995,000 TO COME FROM FUND BALANCE. WE'RE SHOWING FOR NEXT YEAR, WE'RE SHOWING A ZERO. AND OUR FRIENDLY LOCAL AUDITOR SAID THAT WE WERE 1.2 MILLION FOR THE GOOD LAST YEAR. SO THAT'S 1.2 MILLION OVER THERE THAT ALYSSA HAS THAT SHE CAN LET ME PUT DOWN HERE IN USE OF FUND BALANCE SO THAT THE 9.9 MILLION IS DOABLE. I DON'T WANT TO PAINT A PICTURE OF DOOM AND GLOOM, BUT IT IS SERIOUS. EVERYTHING ON THE RED SIDE WILL NOT BE FUNDED. YEAH. THE, THE REASON I WAS ASKING THAT WAS CUZ I, I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE THAT, UH, WE HAD A GOOD HANDLE ON, YOU KNOW, THE, THE OTHER, OTHER SOURCES OF, OF INCOME FOR THE, THE COUNTY IN YEAH, THEY MAY, THE WHOLE BUDGET MAY CHANGE. IF THEY DECIDE IN AUGUST THEY WANT TO HAVE A MEETING AND THEY WANT TO ADOPT A NEW STATE BUDGET. AND IF THEY DO THAT, THEN THAT'S GONNA CHANGE. WE'LL BE BACK HERE AGAIN WITH A WHOLE NEW PICTURE. OKAY. HMM. SO THE NEW POSITIONS THAT WE HAVE HIGHLIGHTED, THE 1.2 MILLION MM-HMM. , ARE THESE ALL THE NEW POSITIONS THAT ALL THE DEPARTMENTS PROPOSED? YES. SO THIS INCLUDES THE FIRE IN, IN SCHOOLS, EX EXCLUDING SCHOOLS, EXCLUDING SCHOOLS. SO THIS, THIS IS ALL THE, THIS IS ALL THE FIRE DEPARTMENT POSITIONS, UH, THE POSITIONS IN HR. UH, THERE'S A POSITION IN THE COMMISSIONER'S OFFICE. THERE'S THIS POSITION IN THE SHERIFF'S, IN THE TREASURER'S OFFICE, UH, ET CETERA, PLANNING. THEY'RE ALL IN THIS PICTURE. AND I KNOW PLANNING WAS LOOKING TO HAVE ONE. THEY HAVE ONE. THE, THE BACK, THE ORIGINAL SHEET YOU SAW HAD TWO MM-HMM. AND THEY TOOK ONE OF THOSE BACK. SO THE ONLY ONE THAT'S IN THERE IS THE GIS. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. BUT IT HAS ALL THE POSITIONS AND ALL THE CHANGES AND WE MIGHT VERY WELL COME BACK AND SAY THAT WE NEED TO DO A STUDY AND DO ALL THE CHANGES AT ONE TIME RATHER THAN THIS NITPICKING OF EACH DEPARTMENT COMING IN WHILE I DESPERATELY NEED TO INCREASE SO-AND-SO. MM-HMM. , NOW WE'RE GOING DOWN TO THE CAPITAL AND ASSETS. THOSE TOTAL NUMBERS, THOSE IN THOSE INCLUDE THE GRANTS, RIGHT? THESE NUMBERS, THE 3.2 OR THOSE ARE THE GRANTS? NO, THOSE HAVE NO GRANTS IN IT. THOSE HAVE NO GRANTS IN IT. OH MY. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. JUST TRYING TO FIGURE OUT YOUR BUDGET IN A BOX. OH. AND AS AN EXAMPLE IN THAT ONE OF THE FIRE STATIONS IS PROBABLY GONNA GET TO BE MOVED. MM-HMM. IS PROBABLY ONE OF THE THINGS WE WILL DO. I'M NOT SURE WE CAN DO TOO SIMULTANEOUS. WELL, FOR THE SAKE OF NOT TAKING MORE TIME, I WILL DEFINITELY LOOK AT THE CAPITAL AND THE ASSETS TO SEE WHAT REALLY IS NEEDED VERSUS WHAT IS NOT REALLY NEEDED. AND LOOK AT ALL OF THE CAPITAL AND THE ASSETS. AND THEN YOU CAN GO BACK AND LOOK AT ALL THOSE LINE ITEMS YOU GOT. MM-HMM. AND ANY SUGGESTIONS YOU HAVE FOR REDUCTIONS, SEND THEM IN. PLEASE. HMM. WELL NOW I GET IT. IS THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ANYBODY HAS? NOPE. OKAY. [02:05:01] THANK YOU. WELL, THANK YOU EVERYONE FOR DOING THESE NUMBER CRUSHING TIME TO BRING IT ALL TOGETHER, PLEASE. YEAH, ABSOLUTELY. ABSOLUTELY. IT'S, UM, IT'S CALLED BALANCING THE BUDGET. ALL RIGHT. WITH ALL THAT BEING SAID, OH, WE, UM, DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO ADJOURN THIS BUDGET MEETING? SO MOVE MADAM CHAIR. YEP. SECOND, SECOND, SECOND. ALL IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. THANK YOU EVERYONE. MEETING'S OVER. AYE, FOR WASHINGTON. * This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.