[00:00:05]
ALL RIGHT.WE'RE GONNA, MR. STAN MEYER IS STUCK IN TRAFFIC.
SO WE'RE GONNA GO AHEAD AND GET STARTED, UM, WITH THE WORK SESSION FOR NOVEMBER 12TH, 2024.
[ A. Discussion - FY 2025 Budget Request Warren County Health Department]
THE FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS RE, UH, 2025, UH, BUDGET REQUEST FOR WARREN COUNTY HEALTH DEPARTMENT.SO I WILL TURN IT OVER TO YOU LADIES FOR YOUR PRESENTATION.
WILL WE APPRECIATE YOU ALL MEETING WITH THAT.
LET US COME, UM, SPEAK TO YOU ALL TODAY.
UM, HOPEFULLY YOU GOT THE MEMORANDUM THAT WE SENT OUT, UM, REQUESTING AN ADDITIONAL 24,744 IN LOCAL FUNDS SO THAT WE CAN GET THE STATE MATCH.
UM, AS WE CAME TO Y'ALL IN THE FALL, WE DIDN'T THINK WE'D HAVE ANY CARRY FORWARD, AND WE DID NOT HAVE ANY CARRY FORWARD THIS YEAR, AND WE DON'T WANNA LEAVE THAT MONEY ON THE TABLE BECAUSE THAT IS ALMOST ONE POSITION IN THE WARREN COUNTY HEALTH DEPARTMENT.
UM, WE WOULD CONTINUE TO PROVIDE THE SERVICES THAT WE OFFER RIGHT NOW, BUT IT COULD TAKE US LONGER TO GET THROUGH THOSE SERVICES, ESPECIALLY ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH.
'CAUSE THAT WOULD PROBABLY BE THE POSITION WE WOULD HAVE TO RELOCATE TO ANOTHER DISTRICT OR ANOTHER LOCALITY.
IS THERE ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU GUYS HAVE FOR US ABOUT THAT REQUEST? UH, OH, I WAS JUST GONNA ASK, SO WHEN, UM, WHEN YOU PRESENTED THE BUDGET, WAS THE $24,000 PART OF THE ORIGINAL BUDGET AND WE CUT IT BACK, SO DIDN'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW MUCH THE GENERAL STATE FUND WOULD BE AT THAT MOMENT, BUT WE ARE, WE, WHAT YOU ALL APPROVED FOR US WAS LESS THAN WE DID ASK.
AND IT WAS ACTUALLY, WE ASKED FOR 4 88 0 5 7 AND YOU APPROVED FOUR 20.
SO IT IS IN THERE THAT OF OUR INITIAL ASK.
SO, UM, IF I CAN ASK MS. MEADOWS, ARE, UH, THIS ADDITIONAL MONEY, WILL THAT COME OUT OF OUR CONTINGENCY FUND OR HOW, HOW, I MEAN, WE APPROVE THE BUDGET, YOU KNOW, SO YOU HAVE, UM, A BUILDINGS COMMITTEE, UH, THIS WEEK? MM-HMM.
CAN YOU, UM, EXPLAIN WHAT THE ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH PERSON DOES? SO THEY HANDLE ALL THE WELL AND SEPTIC APPLICATIONS AND MAKE SURE THEY GO OUT AND INSPECT THINGS.
THEY ALSO DO A LOT OF FOIA REQUESTS WHERE PEOPLE ARE REQUESTING TAX MAP AND, AND, UM, INFORMATION ABOUT THEIR WELL AND SEPTIC.
THEY ALSO HANDLE ANIMAL BITES, SO RABIES CALLS WHERE THEY HAVE TO GO GET ANIMALS AND TEST THEM ALSO, UM, FOOD PERMITS, THEY DO THE FOOD INSPECTIONS FOR THE RESTAURANTS.
AND, AND WARREN COUNTY DOES HAVE A VERY HIGH VOLUME OF SEPTIC AND WELL APPLICATIONS.
MR. BUTLER, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION? NO, I THINK, UH, THE, THE QUESTION THAT, UH, MS. COOK ASKED, UH, ANSWERED THAT, BUT YOU MENTIONED ABOUT ANIMAL BITES.
THE, SO DO THEY ACTUALLY GO OUT AND GET THE ANIMAL OR IS THAT DONE BY SOMEBODY ELSE? OR IF YOU WANT TO, YEAH.
UM, SO WHAT HAPPENS IS WHEN WE HAVE AN ANIMAL BITE, WE FIRST HAVE TO DETERMINE WHAT THE RISK FOR RABIES IS.
SO IF THERE'S A RISK FOR RABIES, THERE'S A COUPLE DIFFERENT THINGS WE CAN DO.
SO, FOR EXAMPLE, IF IT'S, LET'S SAY IT WAS A WILD ANIMAL AND WE HAVE NO WAY OF CAPTURING THE ANIMAL, THEN WE WOULD RECOMMEND THE PERSON RECEIVE PROPHYLAXIS AND THEN RABIES VACCINATION.
IF THERE'S A WAY FOR US TO CAPTURE THE ANIMAL, FOR EXAMPLE, AND IT'S A WILD ANIMAL.
UM, THE ONLY WAY TO TEST FOR RABIES IS THROUGH BRAIN MATTER.
AND SO WE, WE NEED TO CAPTURE THE, AN ANIMAL, EUTHANIZE THE ANIMAL, AND THEN TAKE THE BRAIN MATTER TO TEST FOR RABIES.
SO WE DO THAT BECAUSE ONCE YOU HAVE RABIES, THERE IS VERY, IT'S VERY, VERY, VERY LIKELY THAT THE ONLY, UM, END SITUATION WILL BE MORTALITY.
SO, UM, THAT'S WHY WE GO ABOUT IT IN THAT WAY.
FOR EXAMPLE, IF IT WAS AN ANIMAL, UM, LIKE A, A DOG OR A CAT, IT WOULD REALLY DEPEND ON IF THERE'S HISTORY OF RABIES VACCINATION, WHAT THE EXPOSURE LOOKS LIKE TO OTHER INDIVIDUALS IN THE FAMILY OR OTHER ANIMALS.
AND THEN THERE'S SOME DIFFERENT, UH, STEPS WE CAN TAKE WITHIN CODE FOR CONFINEMENT OF THE ANIMAL.
UM, BUT IN SOME SITUATIONS, DEPENDING ON VACCINATION STATUS, WE DO HAVE TO MOVE FORWARD WITH YOU IIA.
I WAS JUST, UH, I WAS JUST KIND OF CURIOUS ON THAT.
'CAUSE I REMEMBER WHEN MY, MY SON WAS YOUNGER THAT HE AND SOME KIDS WERE OUT PLAYING AND THERE WAS A BAT OR SOMETHING THAT, THAT THEY GOT EXPOSED TO.
AND, AND, UH, I THINK THAT HE HAD TO GO AND GET THE, YOU SAID IT WAS THE, THE PROPHYLACTICS, UH MM-HMM.
AND THEN VACCINATIONS AS WELL.
AND, AND I THINK HE HAD TO GO AND GET THOSE MM-HMM.
[00:05:01]
STAN MEYER, IF YOU DON'T MIND JUST, UM, GOING OVER YOUR REQUEST SO THAT HE HEARS IT TOO, PLEASE.SO WE, WE CAME TODAY WITH A REQUEST FOR AN ADDITIONAL $24,744 SO THAT WE CAN GET THE STATE MATCH FUND, WHICH IS ALMOST 50.
AND AS WE WERE EXPLAINING, IF WE DON'T GET THAT, THAT'S A POSITION IN OUR, OUR HEALTH DEPARTMENT, WE WOULD HAVE TO RELOCATE A STAFF MEMBER.
AND, AND JUST TO CLARIFY, YOU HAD ORIGINALLY ASKED FOR THAT IN THE, IN THE ORIGINAL, BUT UH, YOU WEREN'T SURE IF, IF YOU'RE GONNA NEED THAT NOW, YOU KNOW FOR SURE THAT YOU DO NEED IT.
THE STATE BUDGET CYCLE'S VERY DIFFERENT THAN THE COUNTY'S BUDGET CYCLE.
SO WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ACT WE'RE ABLE, WE HAVE METHODS TO DO PROJECTIONS.
SO USUALLY WHAT WE DO IS WE TAKE A FIVE OR A THREE YEAR, LIKE WHAT HAS BEEN THE INCREASE OVER THE LAST THREE YEARS.
AND THEN WE USE THAT TO KIND OF PROVIDE YOU ALL WITH A PROJECTION OF WHAT WE'RE GONNA NEED.
UM, AND SO THAT'S THE METHODOLOGY WE USE, BUT WE DON'T ACTUALLY GET THE STATE BUDGET AMOUNT UNTIL SEPTEMBER WHEN WE'VE GONE ALREADY GONE THROUGH THE BUDGET PROCESS WITH YOU ALL THIS SPRING BEFORE.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS AT THIS TIME? DR.
DALEY, JUST FOR EDIFICATION THERE, TWO YEARS AGO, THE BUDGET, THEY, THREE YEARS AGO, EXCUSE ME, THREE YEARS AGO, STATE AGENCIES RECEIVED A BIG, LARGE INFLUX OF CARES ACT MONEY.
SO THE BUDGET WENT FROM APPROXIMATELY TWO 50 TO ABOUT THREE 50,000.
AND WE DID NOT FUND ALL THAT LAST, A YEAR AGO THIS PAST YEAR.
AND THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT HAD ABOUT 85,000, I THINK.
SO THAT WAS FROM SURPLUS FROM THE PRIOR YEAR THAT THEY HADN'T BEEN ABLE TO USE BECAUSE WHEN THE BIG INFLUX OF THE FEDERAL MONEY CAME IN, NUMBER ONE, THEY COULDN'T FILL ALL THE POSITIONS.
NUMBER TWO, WE HADN'T MATCHED IT.
SO A YEAR AGO THE REQUEST WAS UP TO ABOUT 400,000 AND WE ONLY FUNDED ABOUT 320, WHICH SHOWED A LITTLE BIT OF AN INCREASE, BUT NOT A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS, NOT A 25% TO MATCH ALL OF THEIR NEW FEDERAL MONEY.
SO THEY HAD USED THE CARRYOVER TO FILL THAT GAP THIS PAST YEAR AND THE BOARD APPROVED THAT.
SO THIS YEAR THE REQUEST WAS ABOUT FOUR 50.
IT WAS, THE ORIGINAL WAS 4 88, BUT YEAH, WE'RE LOOKING AT 48 88.
ANTICIPATING THERE WOULD BE SOME TYPE OF A CARRYOVER AND THE FACT THAT WE COULD NOT INCREASE IT A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS IN ONE SWOOP, WE DID 50 OR $70,000 IN THERE.
WE DID A SUBSTANTIAL INCREASE, THE LARGEST INCREASE OF ALL THE AGENCIES, BUT WE JUST COULDN'T DO IT ALL AT ONCE.
SO WE WERE COUNTING ON THAT THEY WOULD HAVE SOME CARRYOVER AND AS THEY'VE EXPLAINED, THEY DON'T HAVE THE CARRYOVER.
SO THAT, THAT'S HOW WE GOT TO THIS POSITION.
AND WE HAVE FILLED A LOT OF THE VACANCIES.
WE'VE HAD, WE HAD A LOT OF VACANCIES FOR A COUPLE YEARS AND WE'RE FULLY STAFFED NOW IN THE WARREN COUNTY HEALTH DEPARTMENT, WHICH IS, WE'RE GREAT TO HEAR.
WE ACTUALLY ENDED LAST YEAR, UM, IN A LITTLE BIT OF DEBT, $86 AND 75 CENTS
SO WE FIGURE WE CAN, WE CAN COVER THAT WHOLE, WE'LL TAKE CARE OF THAT PIECE.
BUT, UM, WE DID GET KIND OF DOWN TO THOSE LAST PENNIES LAST YEAR.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? ALL RIGHT, THANK YOU VERY MUCH.
AND IF I CAN JUST ASK, DO WE KNOW WHEN YOU GUYS WOULD MAKE A DECISION? UM, I WOULD THINK WE WOULD KNOW SOMETHING BY THE END OF THE YEAR.
WE'VE ONLY GOT TWO MORE MEETINGS IN THERE THIS YEAR, MA'AM.
[ B. Discussion - Proposed 2025 Parks and Recreation League and Fee Schedule]
NEXT ON THE AGENDA IS A PROPOSED 2025 PARKS AND RECREATION LEAGUE AND FEE SCHEDULES.[00:10:01]
MUCH.SO I'M HERE TO PROPOSE THE 2025 PARKS AND RECREATION LEAGUE FEE SCHEDULE.
UM, WE MADE A FEW CHANGES FROM 2024 TO THE 2025.
UM, WE'D LIKE TO INCREASE THE PUNCH PASS OPTION BY $10.
UM, WE'D LIKE TO ELIMINATE THE OPTION OF PIZZAS AND THE POOL RENTAL PACKAGE.
UM, THEY CAN JUST GO TO THE CONCESSION STAND AND BUY PIZZAS.
UM, IT JUST HELPS US NOT BE LOCKED IN IF WE SELL OUT OF PIZZAS.
AND THEN WE'VE ALREADY GUARANTEED A PARTY TWO MONTHS IN ADVANCE, A SET AMOUNT OF PIZZAS.
UM, WE'D LIKE TO OPEN SATURDAY AND SUNDAY EVENINGS FOR WHOLE FACILITY RENTALS.
LAST YEAR WE WERE ONLY OPEN SUNDAY EVENINGS FOR ORGANIZATIONS.
WE HAD A LOT OF REQUESTS, UM, FOR PRIVATE POOL PARTIES AND WE NOTICED THAT ON FRIDAY NIGHT AND SATURDAY NIGHTS OUR NUMBERS DWINDLE.
AND DURING THAT TIMEFRAME, WHEN WE'D BE OPEN, WE'D ONLY HAVE ABOUT 10 PATRONS AT THE POOL THAT TIMEFRAME.
SO IT WOULD PROBABLY BENEFIT US MORE TO RENT THAT OUT IN THE EVENING FOR A FULL PARTY.
UM, THEN WE'D LIKE TO ADD A 10% NON-RESIDENT FEE, UM, ASSESSED ON ALL USERS THAT DO NOT RESIDE IN WARREN COUNTY.
UM, WE DID REACH OUT TO OUR SURROUNDING COUNTIES AND THEY OFFER THAT SAME, UM, PERCENTAGE.
SO WE'D BE COMPATIBLE AND WITH THEM.
UM, WE WOULD LIKE TO INCREASE THE 5% FOR THE LEAD USERS, UM, PER, PER THEIR LEASE TERM THAT YOU GUYS AGREED LAST YEAR.
UM, AND THEN THIS YEAR WE'RE GONNA START CHARGING THE WARREN COUNTY SUNFISH, WHICH AT THE LAST REGULAR MEETING YOU APPROVED IT TO BE ADVERTISED FOR 30 DAYS AND THEN IT'LL BE ON THE NEXT AGENDA.
HOW WILL, UM, SPEAKING OF SUNFISH, IF YOU, WHEN DO THEY USE THE POLL? AND IT IS YES.
SO THEY USE IT, UM, MONDAY THROUGH THURSDAY EVENINGS FROM ABOUT SIX 30 TO EIGHT 30 IN THE EVENINGS.
UM, UNLESS WE HAVE SWIM LESSONS AND THEN THEY DO NOT GO THAT WEEK.
SO THEY KNOW THAT THEY CAN'T CONFLICT WITH OUR ACTUAL REGULAR SCHEDULED ACTIVITIES.
BUT OUR POOL CLOSES AT SIX AND THEY GET IN AT SIX 30.
AND THEN THEY DON'T USE IT ON FRIDAYS.
SO WE CAN STAY OPEN LATE ON FRIDAYS.
AND THEN OF COURSE SATURDAY AND SUNDAY.
SO THEY DON'T HAVE ANY MORNING PRACTICES? NO.
UM, SO WE ASKED THEM AND THEY SAID IT WOULD BE HARD TO GET THEIR KIDS THERE IN THE MORNING AND IT'S TOO COLD, UM, BEFORE WE OPEN.
AND THEN WE HAVE SWIM LESSONS THREE WEEKS OUT OF THE SUMMER THAT WE DO USE FOR THE MORNING.
SO THEY OPTED JUST TO DO THE EVENINGS.
ANY QUE OTHER QUESTIONS? SO THAT SOUNDS LIKE A GOOD IDEA TO UTILIZE THOSE SATURDAYS BETTER.
UH, IS THAT, HOW, HOW, HOW MUCH DOES THAT? UM, SO THEY RENT THE POOL FOR $250, UM, ON A SATURDAY EVENING.
UM, WHEN WE DID IT TWO YEARS PRIOR, EVERY SATURDAY, SUNDAY AND FRIDAY WERE BOOKED.
'CAUSE WE DID OFFER IT FRIDAY NIGHTS AS WELL.
UM, WE DECIDED TO TRY TO STAY OPEN THE ENTIRE TIME, BUT PEOPLE CAN COME AND PAY $5 FOR THE ENTIRE DAY AND THAT'S FROM 12:00 PM TO 8:00 PM AND THEN PEOPLE USUALLY LEAVE AROUND SIX OR SEVEN ANYWAY.
SO WE FIGURED WE MIGHT AS WELL UTILIZE THAT TIME TO BRING IN MORE REVENUE.
SO IT'S EVENING TIME SLOT, LIKE SIX TO NINE OR SIX TO EIGHT? UM, AT SEVEN 30 TO NINE 30.
SO WE'LL O STAY OPEN TILL SIX AND THEN WE'LL CLOSE AND THEN THEY CAN COME IN AND SET UP AND THEN WE OPEN UP AGAIN AT SEVEN 30 TO NINE 30.
AND I KNOW THE FOUR H HAS DONE SOME EVENING RENTALS LIKE THAT.
AND I THINK ALSO FOR ROUND TWO 50.
SO THAT'S SORT OF MARKET RATE SOUNDS.
WE DID REACH OUT TO THE OTHER COUNTIES.
WINCHESTER THERE TWO 50 AS WELL, SO.
AND I BELIEVE I HAVE THE NEXT TOPIC TOO.
[ C. Discussion - Proposed Amendment to the Parks and Recreation Commission Bylaws]
AND REC AMENDMENT TO THE PARKS AND RECREATION COMMISSION BYLAWS.SO WE WOULD LIKE TO MAKE TWO CHANGES TO THE BYLAWS.
UM, WE'D LIKE TO HAVE 17 DIRECTORS.
UM, THE DIRECTOR SHALL BE REPRESENTED AS APPOINTED BY THE COUNTY OF WARREN, INCLUDING ONE MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, THE WARREN COUNTY PERSON RECREATION DIRECTOR, AND INSTEAD OF THE ASSISTANT DIRECTOR, A RECREATION STAFF MEMBER DESIGNATED BY THE DIRECTOR.
UM, THAT WAY WE CAN HAVE OUR PROGRAM COORDINATOR COME ONE DAY IF NECESSARY TO TALK ABOUT EVENTS THAT SHE'S OFFERING OR THE RECREATION COORDINATOR CAN COME AND TALK ABOUT PROGRAMS THAT HE'S OFFERING AND GIVE NUMBERS BASED OFF OF REGISTRATION.
AND THEN THE OTHER CHANGE WE'D LIKE TO MAKE IS, UM, WHAT WE HAVE BEEN DOING, BUT IT NEEDS TO BE UPDATED, IS MEETINGS OF THE COMMISSION SHELBY HALL IN JANUARY, MARCH, MAY, SEPTEMBER AND NOVEMBER WITH EACH MEETING BEGINNING AT FIVE 30.
IT USED TO BE EVERY OTHER MONTH.
AND THEN IT WAS CHANGED TO JUST FIVE TIMES OUT OF THE YEAR.
AND THESE AMENDMENTS NEED A MAJORITY VOTE FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THE 30 DAY NOTICE.
SO ANY QUESTIONS ON THAT ONE? SO, UH, HOW LONG HAVE YOU WORKED FOR, FOR THE DEPARTMENT? UM, I HAVE BEEN WITH THE PARKS AND RECREATION SINCE 2005.
AND YOU'RE THE, YOU'VE BEEN THE DIRECTOR AND, AND YOU PROBABLY HAD AN IDEA THAT YOU WANTED TO DO THIS STUFF FOR A WHILE? OH, YES, SIR.
[00:15:01]
GOOD.SO YOU GOT, YOU'RE STARTING TO SHAPE THINGS IN THE WAY YOU WANNA MANAGE IT? WE'RE TRYING, YES, SIR.
IS THE STATE LEGISLATIVE PROGRAM YOURS AS WELL? NO, MA'AM.
AND THERE'S NO NAMES NEXT TO 'EM, SO I'M NOT SURE.
[ D. Discussion - State Legislative Program]
MS. MEADOWS? UH, DR.THIS IS THE, WHICH YOU HAD LAST YEAR WITH THE ADDITION OF THE FIRST ITEM, THE REGIONAL, UH, PUBLIC SAFETY FIRING RANGE, AND A COUPLE OF OTHER AMENDMENTS DELETIONS IN THERE.
YOU'VE SEEN THIS COUPLE OF TIMES BEFORE IN THE LAST MONTH.
AND WE NEED TO KNOW WHAT YOU WANT TO CHANGE ON THIS BEFORE WE PUT IT ON YOUR AGENDA NEEDS TO GET TO YOUR LEGISLATORS.
UM, WE NEED TO HAVE IT TO THEM QUICKLY.
MM-HMM,
DOES ANYONE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS, UH, FOR DISCUSSION ON ANY OF THESE? I HAVE READ THROUGH THIS AND I I FOUND NOTHING DISAGREEABLE.
UM, SO ANYTHING TO ADD, SIR? NOT, NOT THAT I KNOW OF.
I'M, I FEEL FAIRLY NEW HERE AND I'M NOT SURE THAT I WOULD KNOW WHAT TO SUGGEST TO ADD.
ARE THERE ANY CHANGES FROM THE LAST TIME THIS WAS DONE THAT YOU COULD POINT OUT TO US ON THE PRIMARY ITEMS IN HERE? NO.
THERE'S A COUPLE OF DELETIONS OF THINGS THAT HAVE EXPIRED AND THEN THE ADDITION OF THE FIRST ITEM, BUT THOSE ARE PRETTY MUCH THE CHANGES.
WE CAN SEND YOU LAST YEAR'S AGAIN, IF YOU'D LIKE, JUST TO LOOK TO COMPARE.
BUT THIS IS VERY, VERY MUCH LIKE LAST YEAR.
IF THERE'S NO QUESTIONS OR DISCUSSION, WE'LL MOVE ON
[ E. Discussion - FY2026 Budget Summary Forms]
TO, UM, FY 2026 BUDGET SUMMARY FORMS. IS THAT YOURS OR MS. MEADOW'S? IT'S, UH, KIND OF MYSELF AND MRS. SCOTT.UM, WHEN WE TALKED ABOUT THE BUDGET SCHEDULE, WE TALKED ABOUT THAT, UH, WE WERE NOT GOING TO BE HERE EVERY THURSDAY NIGHT AND WE WERE GONNA HAVE KIND OF A UNIFORM PRESENTATION FORMAT FOR THE DEPARTMENTS ON WHAT THEY, THE KEY FACTORS THEY WOULD BE HIGHLIGHTING FOR YOU IN ADDITION TO HAVING THE LINE ITEMS FOR YOU.
BUT WHAT THEY WOULD TALK ABOUT, AND THIS IS A DRAFT TO LOOK AT, UH, I THINK YOU'VE SEEN A COUPLE OF VERSIONS OF THIS TO MARK UP ON THAT.
AND WOULD THIS, UH, WOULD THIS HIGHLIGHT WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE THE DEPARTMENTS TO CONCENTRATE ON? AND THEN THEY WOULD BE USING THIS AS A GUIDE FOR THEIR PRESENTATION? SO, SO WHERE YOU'VE GOT THE, UH, UH, IT, IT SAYS HERE, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE DEPARTMENT NAME, AND THEN YOU COME DOWN TO THE, UH, AND IT SAYS SUMMARY OF NEW OPERATING REQUESTS.
WHAT, WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? SPOT FOR WHAT, SIR? BUT FOR RANK.
OH, HOW THEY RANK IF, IF THEY WERE LISTING ONE OR TWO ITEMS ON THESE AS PRIORITIES.
SO THAT THIS IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING WE WOULD LIKE THE BOARD TO CONSIDER.
CHIEF IS GONNA HAVE TO SAY, WOULD HE RATHER HAVE A FIRE TRUCK OR AN AMBULANCE? HE'S GONNA HAVE TO SAY ONE'S ONE AND ONE'S TWO.
AND THEN YOU CAN DECIDE FROM THERE WHETHER YOU SUPPORT THAT OR, OR YOU CAN DO EITHER ONE OR BOTH.
SO, SO IT'S NO LONGER GONNA BE, DO YOU WANT THIS OR THIS? AND THE ANSWER IS YES, IT'S GONNA BE, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE TO EITHER OR.
I THINK THE ANSWER'S PROBABLY STILL YES.
BUT THEY HAVE TO RANK THEM AT LEAST.
UM, I SEE WE HAVE, UM, CAP, UH, UNDER THE SUMMARY OF BUDGET CHANGES, UM, WHY IS IT THAT WE DON'T HAVE THE
[00:20:01]
ASSET REPLACEMENT LINE ITEM HERE? THE WHAT? THE ASSET REPLACEMENT THEY ARE, THEY ARE NOT LISTED IN EACH BUDGET, BUT THEY COULD BE, THEY COULD BE SHOWN BY BUDGET, COULDN'T THEY? AND WE CAN PUT THAT IN THERE.'CAUSE YOU ALREADY HAVE CAPITAL.
JUST PUT ANOTHER ONE FOR THAT, FOR ASSET REPLACEMENT.
JUST TO ADD ANOTHER LINE THERE.
AND THEN THE OTHER COMMENT I HAVE, UM, AND I KNOW THAT THE PROCESS MAKES THIS DIFFICULT AND I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE ANSWER WOULD BE, BUT I'D, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE WHAT THEIR PERFORMANCE OF THE PRIOR YEAR, WHAT DID THEY SPEND.
RIGHT NOW YOU HAVE THE CURRENT BUDGET AND YOU HAVE THE REQUESTED BUDGET, BUT THERE ISN'T ANYTHING IN HERE SAYING HOW MUCH THEY SPENT THE PRIOR YEAR.
SO WOULD YOU WANT THAT, UM, ARE YOU THINKING IN TERMS OF THE PRIOR FISCAL YEAR OR SIX MONTHS TO DATE OF THE CURRENT YEAR? 'CAUSE LIKE WE'VE GOT THE DECEMBER, UH, REPORT I THAT SHOWS BOTH OF THOSE OR, AND WE CAN HAVE THAT AVAILABLE WITH THE BUDGET.
UHHUH
SO IF I'M LOOKING BY HERE, YOU HAVE FISCAL YEAR 25, OH WELL, WE'LL GO TO FISCAL YEAR 26, RIGHT? MM-HMM.
UM, SO YOU COULD PUT THE ACTUALS AND THEN HAVE THE DEPARTMENT HEADS TO DO AN ESTIMATE OF COMPLETE.
SO, AND THEN THAT WOULD GIVE AN ESTIMATE OF WHAT THEY'RE GOING TO SPAN BY THE END OF THE FISCAL YEAR.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S TOO MUCH TO ASK.
UM, SO YOU, YOU, IT'S NOT THAT HARD TO, YOU'RE SAYING FOR THE END OF THE YEAR YOU WANT AN ESTIMATE FOR THE ENTIRE YEAR, RIGHT? WELL, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO DO IS, YOU KNOW, OKAY.
YOU KNOW, I, IT ALL DEPENDS WHEN THIS IS BEING PRESENTED.
SO YOU, YOU'RE GONNA BE LOOKING AT THIS IN JANUARY, FEBRUARY.
THEY'RE GOING TO TURN IT IN ABOUT A MONTH FROM TODAY.
SO, UM, YOU WOULD HAVE ACTUALS WHAT THEY ACTUALLY SPENT UP TO NOVEMBER.
'CAUSE YOU'RE ALWAYS A MONTH, FIVE MONTHS.
SO YOU WOULD OH, SO YOU WOULD HAVE YOUR ACTUALS.
SO IF THEY CAN FORECAST FROM NOVEMBER TO THE END OF THE YEAR WHAT THEY'RE GONNA SPEND AND THEN CONSIDER THAT AS AN ESTIMATE.
I'M JUST, I'M NOT SAYING I NEED IT.
I DON'T, YEAH, I WOULD LIKE TO SEE IT.
'CAUSE IT'S VERY, YOU KNOW, I'VE BEEN HERE FOR THREE, THREE YEARS AND I'M A BUDGET PERSON AND IT'S HARD FOR, YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S ALWAYS BEEN A CHALLENGE FOR ME TO SEE.
I'M GONNA BE APPROVING THE BUDGET, BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEY SPENT.
WE CAN TELL YOU WHAT THEY SPENT THE PRIOR, WHICH FOR 24 WE CAN TELL YOU EXACTLY WHAT THEY SPENT.
THAT'S A YEAR BEHIND IS A BIT OF A SWAG.
THAT'S PERFECTLY A GOOD PRACTICE IN ANY FINANCIAL, UH, BUDGET, YOU KNOW, UM, DEPARTMENT, AND I UNDERSTAND THIS IS SOMETHING HIGH TO SHOW YOU THAT THEY NEED 99.5% OF THE MONEY THEY HAVE THIS YEAR.
SO THEY NEED THAT MUCH MORE NEXT YEAR.
WELL, AGAIN, IT'S A GAUGE FOR ME.
I MEAN, I CAN, I, YOU KNOW, WHEN I, WHEN LOOK, BUT YOU WILL HAVE THE SIX MONTHS, WHEN I LOOK AT, WHEN I LOOK AT THE, UM, THE FINANCIAL REPORTS EVERY MONTH, AND I'VE SAID THIS OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN, THAT I ALWAYS GIVE PLUS AND MINUS 10% OF THE PERCENT COMPLETE.
SO, YOU KNOW, IF YOU HAVE A DEPARTMENT THAT SHOULD BE 50% COMPLETE AND THEY'RE ONLY ACCORDING TO THE NUMBERS ON THE REPORT, THEY SHOW THE 30%, THEN BY DEFINITION, UNLESS THERE'S SOME MILESTONES OR SOME MAJOR PURCHASES THAT ARE SUPPOSED TO BE ACCOMPLISHED DURING THE LATTER PART OF THE YEAR, THAT THEY WOULD HAVE THAT MUCH, THAT THEY, THEY WOULD NOT HAVE SPENT THAT MUCH MONEY.
WHICH WOULD GIVE US SOME, UM, A VIEW OF HOW WE CAN REALLOCATE THOSE BUDGETS TO OTHER DEPARTMENTS.
AND THE, AND THE REASON WHY, YOU KNOW, RAISING TAXES.
SO, YOU KNOW, IF A DEPARTMENT DOESN'T SPEND ALL OF THEIR BUDGET, WHY AM I GONNA GIVE 'EM ANOTHER BUDGET? THE SAME, SAME AMOUNT OF MONEY WHEN THEY DIDN'T BURN IT, THE, THE PRIOR YEAR.
YOU KNOW, BUT THIS, WE'RE JUST DISCUSSING.
IT'S SOMETHING I WANT, I WOULD LIKE TO EVENTUALLY ONE DAY SEE.
SO LET'S TALK ABOUT THAT FOR A SECOND.
[00:25:01]
THEN MIKE LOOKS AT THAT AT, I GOTTA SPEND IT.
AND I TELL OUR PEOPLE, NO, YOU NEED TO HOLD ONTO YOUR MONEY FOR LIKE WHEN YOU HAVE YOUR BUILDING COMMITTEE MEETING ON THURSDAY WHEN YOU HAVE THINGS COME UP.
AND SO I THINK IT'S A BETTER POLICY TO BE ABLE TO LOOK AT IT AND SAY, MIKE, YOU'VE GOT 90% IS WHERE YOU'RE GONNA END UP THE YEAR.
WHAT CAN YOU, WHAT CAPITAL ITEMS DO YOU NEED THAT YOU CAN BUY NOW THAT ARE IN ALI'S CHART OVER HERE FOR FIXED ASSETS THAT YOU COULD BUY NOW SO THAT YOU KEEP, NUMBER ONE, YOU GET THE ASSETS AHEAD.
AND NUMBER TWO, YOU DON'T LOSE YOUR MONEY.
AND THREE, YOU DON'T WASTE IT.
YOU DON'T SPEND IT JUST BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANNA LOSE IT.
AND I THINK WE NEED TO CAUTION ON INCUR IN TELLING THEM THAT WE'RE GONNA PUNISH THEM IF THEY DON'T SPEND ALL OUR MONEY.
WELL, I HAVE NO PROBLEM IF THEY DO THEIR, THEIR ANALYSIS AND REALIZE THEY'RE GONNA HAVE $30,000 LEFT OVER IN THEIR BUDGET AND OH, BY THE WAY, I CAN GO OUT AND GET MY VEHICLE FIXED.
OH, BY THE WAY, I CAN BUY ANOTHER VEHICLE.
'CAUSE I KNOW WE'RE AT, YOU KNOW, COMMODITY.
UM, POOR AND THAT'S WHERE THEY COME.
SO, YOU KNOW, IF THEY, IF YOU KNOW, IF THEY LOOK AT THEIR BUDGET AND THEY REALIZE, AND THEY DON'T HAVE TO COME TELL THE BOARD I'M GONNA HAVE $50,000 LEFT OVER, BUT THEY CAN LOOK AT IT AND SAY, OKAY, WELL I GOT $50,000 SO I CAN GO AND PER, YOU KNOW, PURCHASE SOMETHING THAT I NEED.
AND THEN, AND THEN PUT THAT IN THE PERFORMANCE FACTOR FOR THE, THEY CAN PUT IT IN THE PERFORMANCE FACTOR, BUT THEY DO HAVE TO COME BACK SO THAT THE BOARD APPROVES THE LINE ITEM TRANSFER.
SO THAT, YOU KNOW, THE MONEY WAS USED FOR THE VEHICLE.
THEY JUST A VEHICLE ON THEIR OWN.
WE HAVE A PROCESS IN PLACE FOR THAT.
BUT NO, I HAVE, WE'RE WE'RE ASSET CORE.
SO IF ANY DEPARTMENT COMES IN AND SAYS, HEY, I GOT SOME MONEY, I CAN BUY A LOADER OR I CAN, YOU KNOW, UH, PARKS AND REC CAN GO OUT AND GET A GOLF, UM, COURSE OR WHATEVER.
SOMETHING THAT ISN'T A HAND ME DOWN, UH, VEHICLE FROM, UH, PUBLIC SAFETY SOMEPLACE.
BUT IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST, IT'S, IT IS EASIER FOR ME.
IT'S EASIER FOR ME TO JUSTIFY A APPROVING A BUDGET.
AND IF WE HAVE TO LOOK AT RAISING TAXES.
WELL, I THINK THE BOARD'S ALREADY SAID WE'RE NOT DOING THAT THIS YEAR.
WELL, PLUS WE HAVE TO LEVEL UP THIS YEAR.
I, I DON'T KNOW WHEN, I DON'T LOOK AT WHEN I DON'T HAVE THOSE NUMBERS, YOU KNOW, SO ANY, ANY EVENT, IT'S A SUGGESTION.
JAMESON, UH, IF I COULD, I'LL, WE'LL, WE'LL STICK WITH, UH, KI PICKING ON MIKE SINCE HE'S NOT HERE.
YEAH, WE, SO WE CAN PICK, WELL ACTUALLY MAYBE I SHOULD SWITCH TO, TO IT.
UM, NO, IT'S NOT PICKING ON, IT'S ACTUALLY HIGHLIGHTING IT'S HIGHLIGHTED ASSET POOR AS WELL.
IT'S, IT'S THE IDEA THAT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT, THAT WE'VE BEEN BEEN WORKING ON THERE IS THE SOLARWIND SYSTEM WHERE WE ARE, ARE ACQUIRING A LOT OF METRICS IN TERMS OF VOLUME OF, OF SERVICE REQUESTS AND THE TIMELINESS WITH WHICH THEY'RE DISPENSED AND YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO WE'RE GETTING INFORMATION OFF WHICH IS RELEVANT BECAUSE ONE OF THE THINGS THAT'S NOT ON HERE, I MEAN, WHAT'S ON HERE IS LIKE, WHAT WAS THE MONEY LAST YEAR? WHAT WAS THE MONEY THIS YEAR? WHAT'S NOT ON HERE IS WHAT WAS THE SERVICE LEVEL DEMAND, RIGHT? WHAT, WHAT WAS THE, WAS THE REQUIREMENT, UH, THAT WAS MET.
AND IF, UM, YOU KNOW, IF UM, NEXT YEAR THERE'S ONLY 50%
[00:30:01]
AS MANY SERVICE REQUESTS FOR, FOR IT, THEN UM, HE'LL PROBABLY SAY WE CAN CUT THIS DEPARTMENT IN HALF.NO, BUT THE, I'M, I'M BEING FACETIOUS, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THAT, AND THERE'S AN EXAMPLE WHERE THEY'RE STARTING THE PROCESS OF COLLECTING A LOT OF METRICS.
SO IF THE DEMAND GOES WAY UP, HEY, WE GOT A THOUSAND REQUESTS FOR SERVICES RATHER THAN SEVEN 50 THE PRIOR YEAR.
WHY IS THAT? WELL, BECAUSE THE VARIOUS DEPARTMENTS GREW, OR A CERTAIN TECHNOLOGY WAS ADOPTED OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, THAT LETS US OBJECTIVELY SEE THERE'S LEGITIMATELY MORE DEMAND ON THIS DEPARTMENT.
THERE'S A REASON FOR A REQUEST OF, OF MORE OF MORE FUNDS THAT, THAT IS A METRIC.
UM, I BROUGHT UP MIKE BECAUSE I THINK, YOU KNOW, THERE'S PROBABLY SOME POTENTIAL TO COME TO HIM IN THE NEXT YEAR.
UM, I THINK HE ALREADY, HE ALREADY KNOWS I WANNA TALK TO HIM ABOUT IT AND TODD'S PROBABLY BROACHED ON HIM.
'CAUSE THIS SOLAR WIND SYSTEM IS, HAS POTENTIAL TO, TO FIND ITS WAY INTO OTHER DEPARTMENTS TO WHERE, UH, SO WHEN, AGAIN, IF YOU WANT TO, TO THINK OF IT IN THE PUBLIC WORKS ARENA, YOU KNOW, UM, IF MORE ROADS WERE, WERE PAVED, THEN THERE'S A METRIC MM-HMM.
LIKE, UM, MAYBE, I MEAN, MELISSA HAS A, A CERTAIN STAFF AND YOU'RE, YOU'RE DOING A, A DEFINED JOB.
SO IT'S NOT GONNA BE LIKE MORE 10 MORE WIDGETS OR 15% MORE PROCESS WAS DONE OR SOMETHING.
I DON'T KNOW IF YOU HAVE A WAY TO MEASURE THAT SORT OF THING.
SO IT'S JUST NOT A UNIVERSAL, IT DOESN'T, DOESN'T MOVE EVERYWHERE EQUALLY WELL, BUT SOME PLACES IT, IT DOES MOVE WELL, AND IN THOSE PLACES, I THINK, UM, METRICS ARE GOOD.
IF WE CAN HAVE THAT, WE NEED METRICS ON, PARTICULARLY ON THE, ON THE SERVICE AGENCY, RIGHT? 'CAUSE WE HAVE, WE HAVE DOLLARS SPENT AND WE HAVE SERVICE OBTAINED FOR THAT DOLLARS.
SO THIS YEAR WE HAD THIS MANY CALLS, UH, FIRE CALLS AND WE HAD THIS MANY, UH, EMS CALLS, ET CETERA, RIGHT? YES, EXACTLY.
UM, WE HAVE THIS MANY THOUSANDS OF TONS TO THE LANDFILL, RIGHT? MM-HMM.
YOU KNOW, THE, UH, I REMEMBER WATCHING A, UH, UH, ONE OF THESE YOUTUBE VIDEOS, GOSH, THIS IS PROBABLY ABOUT 15 YEARS AGO, AND THEY HAD A, UH, UH, ONE OF THE, UH, ONE OF THE BUSINESS PEOPLE THAT, UH, THAT THEY HAD HIRED INTO THE GOVERNMENT AND HE WAS TALKING TO THE SENATE AND HE SAID THAT, UH, HE WISHED THERE THERE WAS A WAY THAT, UH, THAT WE COULD ENCOURAGE, YOU KNOW, THE, LIKE, LIKE TOWARDS THE END OF THE YEAR, YOU KNOW, YOU GOT X NUMBER OF BUDGET LEFT AND WE'LL, WE GOTTA SPEND THAT BE, OTHERWISE WE'LL GET PENALIZED.
AND HE SAID, YOU KNOW, IN THE INDUSTRY, YOU'RE REWARDED FOR COMING IN UNDER BUDGET.
BUT HE SAID IN GOVERNMENT, YOU'RE PUNISHED FOR COMING IN UNDER BUDGET.
AND I WISH THERE WAS A WAY THAT WE COULD, WE COULD REWARD.
UH, AND, AND EVENTUALLY THAT WOULD GET TO THE TAXPAYERS BECAUSE INSTEAD OF HAVING TO RAISE TAXES, YOU KNOW, EVERY OTHER YEAR WE MAY BE ABLE TO GO FIVE YEARS WITHOUT RAISING TAXES AND, AND STILL BE ABLE TO, TO MEET EVERYTHING THAT WE, WE'VE GOT.
UH, I KNOW THAT, UH, BECAUSE OF INFLATION THAT, UH, THAT TAXES EVENTUALLY HAVE TO BE RAISED AND HOPEFULLY THE, UH, BUT THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I WOULD, THAT'S WHAT I WOULD REALLY LIKE TO SEE IS, UH, OF GOVERNMENT ENTITIES, YOU KNOW, TOWN, COUNTY, FEDERAL, STATE OF BEING REWARDED FOR COMING IN UNDER BUDGET AND, UH, UH, YOU KNOW, THE HOW TO DO THAT.
WELL THAT'S, UH, I, I HONESTLY DON'T HAVE ANY GOOD IDEAS RIGHT NOW,
I THINK THAT'D BE FANTASTIC BECAUSE EVENTUALLY, BECAUSE THAT WOULD HELP EVERYBODY, YOU KNOW, THAT'D BECOME MORE EFFICIENT OF AND, UH, YOU KNOW, WITHOUT, WITHOUT CUTTING ANY JOBS.
AND, UH, THAT'S, THAT'S THE ONE THING THAT, UH, THAT I WOULD NOT WANT TO DO.
BUT YOU TAKE PEOPLE AND PUT 'EM INTO, INTO POSITIONS, HAVE THEM DOING THINGS FOR THE COUNTY THAT HAS NEEDED TO BE DONE.
UH, BUT WE'VE JUST BEEN PUTTING IT OFF AND LATE AND, AND EVENTUALLY IT GETS SO D ON EXPENSIVE THAT WELL, WE HAVE TO SPEND THREE TIMES AS MUCH MONEY TO DO THIS.
WHEREAS, YOU KNOW, IF YOU CAN TAKE CARE OF IT IN A TIMELY MANNER BECAUSE YOU HAD SOME, UH, UH, SOME EXCESS LABOR THAT, UH, THAT YOU WERE ABLE TO SAVE, THAT HELPS EVERYBODY AND, UH, YEAH.
'CAUSE COST, YOU KNOW, AS THERE EVERYONE KNOWS, I MEAN, YOU HAVE THE INFLATION FACTOR.
COSTS ARE GONNA GO UP EVERY YEAR.
YOU KNOW, IT DEPENDS AT WHAT LEVEL, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW.
SO, UM, 1, 1, 1 MORE QUESTION.
[00:35:01]
ARE UM, NONPROFITS GONNA BE USING THIS AS WELL? NONPROFITS USE THIS FORM THAT YOU LOOKED AT LAST YEAR.AND WE PUT A COPY OF IT UP HERE AGAIN TO SEE IF THERE WAS ANYTHING YOU WANTED TO CHANGE.
DO WE HAVE IT UP HERE? IT'S THE PARTNER AGENCY.
THIS ONE YOU SPENT SOME TIME ON LAST YEAR.
AND I WOULD SAY THE SAME THING IF ME, YOU KNOW, AND I DID DO REMEMBER SEEING SOME NUMBERS FROM THEM LAST TIME, BUT THEY WERE INCORPORATED INTO THE BODY OF THEIR TEXT AND IT'S REALLY A NUMBERS THING.
SO I, I WOULD FIGURE OUT A WAY TO REPRESENT THAT.
AND FOR THE NONPROFITS RE WE'RE ONLY LOOKING AT THE MONEY, UH, THAT WE ARE ALLOCATING TO THEM, RIGHT? DO WE NEED ALL THIS INFORMATION ABOUT FUND FUNDRAISING AND GRANTS AND THINGS LIKE THAT? WELL, YOU CAN TAKE ANYTHING OFF OF HERE YOU WANT, THE BOARD HAD BEEN IN THE POSITION THAT THEY WANTED TO KNOW THEIR WHOLE PICTURE OF THESE AGENCIES.
I THINK WE NEED TO BE FAIR ACROSS THE BOARD IF WE'RE GONNA QUESTION ONE, WE NEED TO QUESTION ALL THE SAME.
UM, OUR RELATIONSHIP IS A LOT SMALLER.
AND SOME OF THEM IT'S, UH, BY CONTRACT YOU MUST CONTRIBUTE SOMETHING TO THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT.
THAT, THAT'S WHERE I WOULD THINK YOU WOULD WANT GRANT IN HERE KNOWING THAT WE HAVE TO MATCH IT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
BUT WE DID NOT, UM, YOU REMEMBER WE CUT A LITTLE BIT OFF OF EACH AGENCY, EVEN WHEN FROM LAST YEAR'S BUDGET.
SO THEY'RE ALL JUST A LITTLE BIT LESS.
I'LL TAKE ANOTHER LOOK AT THIS.
IF I HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS, ANYTHING ELSE, SEND IT BACK TO US.
UM, WE WILL SEND THESE OUT, UH, 'CAUSE THEY ARE DUE EARLY DECEMBER AND WE WILL SEND THESE AND THEN WE WILL HAVE THEM BACK, UH, FOR YOU IN JANUARY.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS ON THESE? IF NOT, WE'LL
[ F. Discussion - Sub-committee report presentation on 2023 Library Debrief and Research]
MOVE ON TO SUBCOMMITTEE REPORT PRESENTATION ON THE 2023 LIBRARY DEBRIEF AND RESEARCH.THIS IS, UH, REPORT IS A CULMINATION OF, OF, UH, RESEARCH THAT MRS. COOK AND I HAVE BEEN DOING, UH, AFTER THE PROJECT WAS INITIATED THAT THE LA PART STARTED OF LAST YEAR.
I'D, I THANK EVERYBODY FOR YOUR, FOR YOUR PATIENCE.
DID NOT ANTICIPATE TO TAKE THIS LONG TO GET THIS DONE.
I START OFF BY MAKING SEVERAL ACKNOWLEDGEMENTS.
FIRST ACKNOWLEDGEMENT IS THAT, UH, WE, UH, ON AS A COMMITTEE, WHEN I SAY WE, I'M REFERRING TO OUR SUBCOMMITTEE, WE, WE ACKNOWLEDGE THE THRIVING PUBLIC LIBRARY IS ABSOLUTELY AN ASSET TO THE COUNTY, SHOULD ALWAYS BE FINANCIALLY SUPPORTED BY THE COUNTY GOVERNMENT.
WE ALSO RECOGNIZE THAT SAMUEL'S LIBRARY IS A VERY, UH, IS WIDELY RECOGNIZED WITHIN THE COUNTY FOR QUALITY SERVICES AND A WELCOMING STAFF.
AND WE ALSO RECOGNIZE AND ACKNOWLEDGE THAT THE SCRUTINY THAT'S UNDERTAKEN IN THIS REPORT WILL NOT BE WELCOMED BY EVERYBODY.
UH, BUT THAT IN ITSELF IS NOT A REASON TO WITHHOLD THE SCRUTINY.
NOW, SOME PREFACE, FIRST OF ALL, THIS REPORT IS NOT AN EVALUATION OF THE QUALITY OF SAMUELS LIBRARY SERVICES.
NOTHING IN THIS REPORT CAN BE CONSTRUED AS TO DIMINISH OR SLIGHT THE STAFF WHO WORK FOR SAMUELS AND PROVIDE THE DAILY LIBRARY EXPERIENCES ENJOYED WITHIN THE COUNTY.
THIS REPORT DOES NOT ATTEMPT TO ADDRESS THE BOOK RECALL IN ANY DEPTH.
AND FINALLY, THIS REPORT IS FOCUSED ON GOVERNANCE ISSUES ASSOCIATED WITH PUBLIC LIBRARY SERVICES.
THIS, THE ORGANIZATION OF THE PRESENTATION IS AS FOLLOWS, WHY WE ARE HERE 2023 IN REVIEW, CORE GOVERNANCE ISSUES, THE EVOLVING PUBLIC PRIVATE RELATIONSHIP, COST, COST EFFICIENCY, GOVERNANCE IN THE MIDST OF PUBLIC MEDIA NARRATIVES, NORMAL GOVERNANCE IN PUBLIC LIBRARIES, AND CONCLUSIONS AND RECOMMENDATIONS AS TO
[00:40:01]
WHY WE ARE HERE.I THINK MOST PEOPLE LIVING IN THE COUNTY IN SOME FORM OR FASHION, WERE AWARE THAT IN 2023 THERE WAS A VERY DISRUPTIVE AND DIVISIVE SITUATION IN THE COUNTY REGARDING THE LIBRARY AND A BOOK RECALL EFFORT.
THESE MONTHS OF JUNE, MAY, MAY, JUNE THROUGH SEPTEMBER WERE WERE REALLY A DIFF A A A SAD AND COMMUNITY SPLITTING TIME AND A LOT OF RANKER IN THE COUNTY WITH PEOPLE OF BOTH SIDES, UH, GETTING VERY INVOLVED, VERY EMOTIONAL, AND, UH, JUST A LOT OF, A LOT OF DIFFICULT TIMES THAT WAS NOT GOOD FOR THE COMMUNITY.
DURING THIS TIME, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WAS CALLED ON TO EXERCISE THEIR GOVERNANCE PREROGATIVES.
THE LIBRARY'S A, A PUBLIC SERVICE FUNDED BY PUBLIC TAX DOLLARS PREDOMINANTLY, AND IT CERTAINLY WAS THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS JOB TO EXERCISE THEIR GOVERNANCE PREROGATIVES.
TWO OF THE THINGS, TWO THINGS EMERGED AS THEIR PRINCIPLE PREROGATIVES.
THE FIRST WAS TO ENSURE THAT THERE WAS AN IMPLEMENTATION OF A SATISFACTORY RESOLUTION TO THE RECALL CONTROVERSY.
THE SECOND WAS TO ACQUIRE AN OPERATING AGREEMENT FOR SAMUELS TO CONTINUE OPERATING THE LIBRARY ON A CONTRACT BASIS.
UNFORTUNATELY, THE ENTIRE EPISODE WAS DAMAGING TO THE COMMUNITY.
IT ATTRACTED NATURAL ATTENTION AND CREATED A, A WHAT WOULD BE CONSIDERED A NEGATIVE IMPRESSION OF THE COUNTY.
THIS BOARD SUPERVISORS DEEMED IT A WORTHY PROJECT TO EXAMINE WHAT HAPPENED FROM A GOVERNANCE PERSPECTIVE AND TO RESEARCH HOW TO AVOID IT IN THE FUTURE.
CONTINUING ON AFTER THE RECALL, CONTROVERSY HAD COME INTO THE PUBLIC VIEW.
BY THE TIME JULY 10TH ROLLED AROUND, SAMUEL'S LIBRARY HAD DEVISED A SOLUTION TO THE RECALL SITUATION, HAD DISCUSSED IT WITH THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND HAD BEGUN TO IMPLEMENT IT.
ACTUALLY, IT WAS ANNOUNCED ON JULY 10TH.
ON JULY 13TH, THE COUNTY DISPERSED THE FIRST QUARTER FUNDS TO SAMUEL'S JULY 13TH.
THIS WAS THE NORMAL MANNER OF OPERATIONS.
THE FUNDING FOR SAMUEL'S LIBRARY HAS ALWAYS BEEN DISPERSED QUARTERLY, AND THE FIRST QUARTER WAS DISPERSED.
THE DATE OF THE CHECK HAPPENED TO BE THE 13TH OF JULY.
THE INVOICE WAS AS NORMAL FROM SAMUEL'S JULY 1ST.
THEN WHAT HAPPENED AFTER THIS? WELL, IN JULY, AUGUST AND SEPTEMBER, THERE WERE A, THERE WAS A PROTRACTED PERIOD OF NEGOTIATIONS OVER THE OPERATING AGREEMENT.
SO TO REITERATE, THE TWO REQUIREMENTS WERE DEVELOP AN ACCEPTABLE SOLUTION TO THE BOOK RECALL AND NEGOTIATE A MEMORANDUM OF AGREEMENT FOR OPERATING THE LIBRARY.
SO THE PROTRACTED NEGOTIATIONS IN THE JULY, AUGUST, AND SEPTEMBER PERIOD WERE ABOUT THE AGREEMENT.
COUPLE OF NOTABLE POINTS, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TOOK THE INITIATIVE TO DRAFT A MEMORANDUM OF AGREEMENT TO THE LIBRARY TO SAMUELS.
AND THE PRINCIPAL, THE PRINCIPAL FEATURE OF THAT AGREEMENT WAS GREATER TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION ON THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES FOR SAMUELS.
THERE WERE ALSO SOME ITEMS CONCERNING, UH, POTENTIAL CHANGES TO THE COLLECTION DEVELOPMENT POLICY THAT WOULD HELP RESOLVE FUTURE RECALL SITUATIONS.
IN FACT, THEY, THEY REJECTED THE FIRST REQUEST FROM THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS THAT INVOLVED ADDITIONAL REPRESENTATION, FIVE ADDITIONAL FIVE TRUSTEES AND THE BOARD TRUSTEES.
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS STARTED WITH SEVEN.
SAMUELS REJECTED THAT WITHOUT COMMENT, WITHOUT EDIT, WITHOUT MARKUP.
THEN THEY PROFFERED THEIR OWN AGREEMENT TO THE COUNTY.
THE OWNER, THE AGREEMENT THEY PROFFERED WAS A STATUS QUO OF ONE TRUSTEE OUT OF 16.
AND THE TERMS IN THAT PROFFER WERE CONSIDERABLY MORE AGGRESSIVE IN THERE THAN THE, UH, PREVIOUS MEMORANDUM OF, UNDER A MEMORANDUM OF AGREEMENT THAT SAMUELS HAD BEEN OPERATING UNDER PUBLIC MEDIA AND SOCIAL MEDIA NARRATIVES ABOUNDED, THERE WAS A NARRATIVE CONCERNING THE ESSENTIAL
[00:45:01]
ACCUSATION THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WAS DEFUNDING THE LIBRARY.THERE WAS A PREVALENT NARRATIVE CIRCULATING THAT THE LIBRARY MAY HAVE TO BE CLOSED.
AND THERE WAS THIS A PREVALENT NARRATIVE CIRCULATING THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE RECALLING BOOKS WERE BANNERS, BIGOTS, AND SENSORS.
IN THAT CONTEXT, WE'RE GOING TO EXAMINE, START BY EXAMINING CORE GOVERNANCE ISSUES.
WHAT THIS SLIDE SHOWS IS BASICALLY A TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION MISALIGNMENT.
WE HAVE A, A TWO AXIS GRAPH HERE, TWO AXIS CHART.
ONE OF THE AES REPRESENTS FINANCIAL INDEPENDENCE.
THAT'S THE BOTTOM AXES AND THE OTHER AXES.
THE VERTICAL AXES REPRESENTS MANAGEMENT INDEPENDENCE.
THE ZONE THAT'S SHADED GREEN IS WHAT I CALL THE FIDUCIARY SENSIBILITY ZONE.
IF YOU HAVE FINANCIAL INDEPENDENCE, THEN YOU CAN HAVE MANAGEMENT INDEPENDENCE.
THERE'S A POSITIVE CORRELATION BETWEEN FINANCIAL INDEPENDENCE AND MANAGEMENT INDEPENDENCE.
SO IF WE LOOK AT THE TOP RIGHT SECTION, WE HAVE BASICALLY, WE HAVE PARTNER AGENCIES, NONPROFITS THAT COME TO THE COUNTY, USUALLY WITH VERY NOMINAL REQUESTS FOR MONEY.
AND USUALLY IN CASES WHERE THE PERCENTAGE OF MONEY THAT WARREN COUNTY IS CONTRIBUTING TO THAT ORGANIZATION OR IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OF ONE TO 5%, THESE ENTITIES ARE FINANCIALLY INDEPENDENT FROM WARREN COUNTY AND THEREFORE THEY HAVE COMPLETE MANAGEMENT INDEPENDENCE.
IF YOU FOLLOW DOWN INTO THE LOWER LEFT CORNER OF THE GRAPH, YOU'LL NOTE ALL COUNTY DEPARTMENTS, EVERY COUNTY DEPARTMENT IS FULLY FINANCIALLY DEPENDENT ON THE COUNTY.
THEREFORE, THEY ARE FULLY DEPENDENT ON THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION FOR THEIR BUDGETS, FOR THEIR POLICIES, ET CETERA.
LOOK TO THE TOP LEFT OF THE CHART.
AND WHAT WE SEE IS SAMUEL'S LIBRARY, WHICH IS COMPLETELY TAXPAYER DEPENDENT, YET THEIR MANAGEMENT INDEPENDENCE IS ALMOST ABSOLUTE, I WOULD SAY ABSOLUTE.
BUT THE BOARD SUPERVISORS DOES HAVE ONE REPRESENTATIVE ON THEIR 16 BOARD OF TRUST, 16 MEMBER BOARD OF TRUSTEES.
I'LL LEAVE IT TO YOU TO DECIDE WHETHER THAT ACTUALLY INVOL ENTAILS, UH, ANY KIND OF GOVERNANCE AUTHORITY.
DR. JAMES THINKING BACK UP, UM, WHAT IS THE, WHAT IS THE ACRONYM? NCS IN THE TOP RIGHT CIRCLE.
IT'S A NORTHERN, UM, WHAT'S THE, OUR, OUR, UM, REGIONAL COMMISSION? YEAH, NO, IT'S A DR.
DALEY, THE NORTHERN SOMETHING SERVICES.
OH, NORTHWESTERN COMMUNITY, YEAH, YEAH.
NORTHWESTERN COMMUNITY SERVICES.
AND THEY, UM, THEY SHOULD ALMOST BE DOWN HERE WITH REGIONAL JAIL.
THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT, THEY'RE INDEPENDENTLY APPOINT THE BOARD MEMBERS AND THEY'RE GOVERNED BY THE STATE GUIDELINES.
OKAY, WELL, THEY'RE HERE BECAUSE THEY'RE THE NEXT BIGGEST SUPPLICANT FOR FUNDS.
WHEN WE EXCLUDE NON-DISCRETIONARY AGENCIES, UH, REGIONAL JAIL, THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT HUMANE SOCIETY, WHICH ARE NOT, UH, WHICH ARE NON-DISCRETIONARY, UM, SAMUELS, IT REPRESENTS 63% OF ALL THE, UH, PARTNER AGENCY FUNDING REQUESTS.
FOR ANOTHER PERSPECTIVE ON THE, UH, ALIGNMENT OF FUNDING VERSUS GOVERNANCE, WE HAVE THE FOLLOWING PIE CHART.
THIS, THIS CHART SHOWS ON THE LEFT THE PEER.
THIS IS A, A, AN AMALGAMATION AND, AND AGGREGATION FROM 2007 TO 2023, TAXPAYER TOTAL TAXPAYER CONTRIBUTIONS INCLUDE, THIS GOES BACK TO 2007.
SO AT THAT TIME, TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL STILL CONTRIBUTED TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL, WARREN COUNTY, STATE OF VIRGINIA.
AND THE BLUE, THE TOTAL TAXPAYER FIGURE ALSO INCLUDES THE LIBRARY FUNDING AT CHRYSLER ROAD, WHICH WAS, WHICH WAS $6.4 MILLION.
SO THE ORANGE SLIDE, THE ORANGE SLICES OF BOTH PIES REPRESENT SAMUELS.
UH, THE 1.7 MILLION REPRESENTS APPROXIMATELY 12%.
SO THE, THE RIGHT SIDE SHOWS THE TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION ON THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES OF SAMUELS.
SO WHAT WE HAVE IS AN INVERSION OF OF FUNDING AND REPRESENTATION.
[00:50:01]
THIS IS AN ANOTHER REPRESENTATION OF THIS.SO FUNDING IS PUBLIC DOMINANT, BUT GOVERNANCE IS PRIVATE DOMINANT.
YET ANOTHER LOOK AT THE IMBALANCE THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.
IN THE TOP PORTION OF THE GRAPH, WE HAVE SEESAW, WHERE 15 TRUSTEES GOVERN THE LI THE PUBLIC LIBRARY.
HOWEVER, UM, THE PREDOMINANCE OF FUNDING IS PUBLIC TAXPAYER FUNDING.
ONE OF THE THINGS THAT MIGHT BE, YOU KNOW, AN EXERCISE, A THOUGHT EXPERIMENT FOR ANYBODY TO TRY IS TO FLIP THE SCRIPT ON THIS.
IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO GO BACK TO 2008, APPROXIMATELY, AND IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE THAT SAMUEL'S UNDERTAKE THE, THE RAISING OF $6.4 MILLION TO BUILD A LIBRARY AND TO COMMIT TO RAISING 83% OF THE OPERATING COSTS OF THE LIBRARY ON AN ANNUAL BASIS, AND THEN OFFERED TO TAKE ONE SEAT ON THE BOARD OF, OF TRUSTEES AND ALLOW THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO APPOINT THE OTHER 16 MEMBERS OF THE BOARD OF TRUSTEES.
AND I INVITE EVERYBODY TO ANSWER YOUR, ANSWER THE QUESTION YOURSELF.
DO YOU DO ALL THE MONEY? RAISE ALL THE MONEY, NOT ALL OF IT, BUT MOST OF IT.
AND THEN ACCEPT A VERY MINOR POSITION IN THE GOVERNANCE MATTERS.
IN THIS THEME ALSO OF CORE GOVERNANCE FEATURES, WE HAVE HISTORICAL SPENDING GROWTH.
ONE OF THE THINGS WE RECOGNIZE EVERY YEAR WHEN WE GO THROUGH A BUDGET CYCLE IS THAT EVERY DEPARTMENT HEAD, THAT EVEN CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICERS HAVE TO COME IN TO THIS, TO THIS BUILDING AND PROVIDE DETAILED REASONED ARGUMENTS FOR THEIR BUDGETS.
THE FIRE CHIEF HAS TO DEMONSTRATE IT.
ONE OF THE THINGS WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IS WHAT OUR BUDGET PROCESS LOOKS LIKE.
AND I REMEMBER IT, IT STICKS OUT IN MY HEAD THAT SHE, SHE WAS IMPLORING THE BOARD TO, TO ALLOCATE ENOUGH MONEY SO THAT SHE COULD HAVE PROVIDE HER, HER, HER DEPUTIES WITH THE DIGNITY OF HAVING MORE THAN ONE UNIFORM.
UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S MEANINGFUL AND IT, IT REPRESENTS THE IDEA THAT DISCRETION OVER PUBLIC SERVICES AND BUDGETS RESIDES WITH REPRESENTATIVES OF THE TAXPAYER.
AND WE ARE ELECTED TO DO THAT JOB.
SO ANY SITUATION IN WHICH OUR DISCRETION OVER DECIDING WHAT THOSE LEVEL OF PUBLIC SERVICES IS GONNA BE, UH, IS AN IMPEDANCE TO OUR, TO OUR JOB.
YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THIS, THIS GOES DOWN TO SCOPE.
WE HAVE THE ABILITY AND THE RESPONSIBILITY TO DETERMINE WHAT SCOPE IS.
IN THIS LAST FUNDING CYCLE, WE DISCERNED THAT THE SCOPE OF OUR FIRE AND RESCUE SERVICES NEEDED TO BE EXPANDED.
SO WE TOOK THE EXTRAORDINARY STEP OF ACTUALLY RAISING TAXES TO MAKE THAT HAPPEN.
THIS GRAPH ILLUSTRATES THAT FOR 12 YEARS, THE GROWING, THE GROWTH OF THE FUNDING OF THE LIBRARY EXCEEDED POPULATION, THE AVERAGE POPULATION GROWTH OF 0.85%, AND THE AVERAGE INFLATION OF 1.85% BY A FACTOR OF THREE AND A HALF.
NOW, IT'S TRUE THAT THAT FLATTENED OUT AND THAT'S GOOD, BUT WHAT THIS REPRESENTS, IF YOU LOOK AT THE ORANGE LINE, IS THE INFLATION OF POPULATION GROWTH.
SO THERE'S NO, THERE, THERE IS AN, AN, IT'S MERELY AN INDICATION THAT THE BASIS OF THIS OPERATION HAS GROWN SIGNIFICANTLY DURING A PERIOD OF TIME.
AND WHEN A BASIS FOR AN OPERATION GROWS SIGNIFICANTLY, IT STARTS TO COMPETE WITH OTHER SERVICES, ESPECIALLY ON AN ANNUAL BASIS.
WHEN EVERYBODY'S LOOKING FOR THAT INFLATION ADJUSTMENT, THEN WELL, AND 3% OF A MILLION DOLLARS IS A LOT MORE THAN 3% ON 500,000 OR 3% ON 600,000.
SO, UH, THE POINT OF THIS CHARGE IS TO DEMONSTRATE THAT, THAT THERE WAS AN INCREASE IN BASIS.
AND THAT INCREASE, UH, IS SOMETHING THAT CALLS SOME ATTENTION TO IT AND IS MERITS EXAMINATION OF WHETHER THERE'S A POSSIBILITY OF RE-BASELINING.
[00:55:01]
UH, UH, DR.JAMESON, I JUST WANTED TO MAKE A COMMENT THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THE, THE LIBRARY THEY RECEIVED, UH, WHAT WAS IT, UH, BEST LIBRARY IN VIRGINIA, YOU KNOW, THIS YEAR.
AND I WOULD EXPECT THAT, UH, WITH THIS TYPE OF FUNDING THAT THEY WOULD RECEIVE THAT.
SO THAT KIND OF BEGS THE QUESTION, WHY DID THEY RECEIVE IT JUST THIS YEAR? WHEN YOU TAKE A LOOK AT THIS GRAPH OVER HERE AND SEE THE, THE 2018 WHERE IT BEGINS TO LEVEL OUT, WHY DID THEY RECEIVE IT BACK THEN? OR, YOU KNOW, SOME OTHER TIME.
I, I'M JUST KIND OF CURIOUS AS TO THAT.
UM, I FIND IT RATHER CURIOUS AS TO WE HAVE THIS, THIS, UH, WHAT YOU POINTED OUT EARLIER, UH, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE COMMUNITY UNREST AND THEN BINGO, THEY BECOME LIBRARY OF THE, THE YEAR.
SO I, I JUST FIND THAT CURIOUS.
I I WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO HELP YOU WITH THAT
UM, AND WE'RE GONNA EXAMINE THE E THE EVOLUTION OF THE PRIVATE PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP.
UH, THIS, THE SAMUEL'S NAME BECAME ASSOCIATED WITH PUBLIC LIBRARY IN WARREN COUNTY IN 1952 WHEN DR.
SAMUELS GAVE HIS PROPERTY, HIS BUILDING, HIS PERSONAL ASSETS TO BE THE LIBRARY OF WARREN COUNTY OF, OF, OF FRONT ROYAL, UH, THAT WAS A MATERIAL REAL CONTRIBUTION AND IT WAS, BECAME ESSENTIALLY THE REASON THAT THERE COULD BE A WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY.
HIS BROTHER WALTER IN 1976, I BELIEVE BEQUEATHED HIS ESTATE TO SAMUELS.
AND THAT IS WHY THE 10,000 SQUARE FOOT BUILDING ON WAL VILLA AVENUE EXISTS.
YOU HAVE A LEGACY OF OF FAMILY SACRIFICE AND FAMILY CON FAMILY CONTRIBUTION, UM, THAT MADE POSSIBLE THE WARREN COUNTY PUBLIC LIBRARY.
AND WHAT THIS, THIS GRAPHIC ILLUSTRATES IS THAT THEIR REAL ASSETS, THEIR BUILDING, THEIR MONEY, UH, WAS A, A BASICALLY A DOMINANT FACTOR IN THE PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP.
I DON'T HAVE ACCESS TO THE AMOUNT OF MONEY THAT TAXPAYERS SUPPORTED THE LIBRARY WITH.
BUT THIS GRAPH, THIS CHART ILLUSTRATES THAT CONTRIBUTION TIME GOES BY AND SOMEWHERE AROUND THE 2006, 2007 TIMEFRAME, UH, A THE COUNTY, THE TOWN WAS OUTGROWING THAT FACILITY.
SO THE NEW LIBRARY ON CHRYSLER ROSE WAS ROAD WAS CONCEIVED.
THIS WAS A SIGNIFICANT CHANGE.
CHRYSLER, THE CHRYSLER ROAD LIBRARY IS APPROXIMATELY, I THINK IT'S 25,000 FEET, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY.
UM, BUT THIS WAS A SUBSTANTIALLY LARGER LIBRARY.
THE, THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS THAT THE BALANCE CHANGED IN THE PUBLIC PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP, AND THAT'S APPROPRIATE, THAT'S FINE.
THE TAXPAYER FUNDS AND ANNUAL FUNDS ARE STARTING TO BECOME MORE DOMINANT IN THE PROVI PROVISION OF LIBRARY SERVICES.
THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.
THIS GRAPH ALSO, THIS CHART ALSO SHOWS THAT THE BUILDING IS STILL ON THE SAMUELS SIDE.
THE VILLA AVENUE BUILDING WAS NOT BEING USED AS THE LIBRARY.
NEVERTHELESS, THE NATURE OF THE AGREEMENT BETWEEN WARREN COUNTY AND SAMUEL'S WAS THAT SAMUEL'S WAS ABLE TO LEASE THE BRAND NEW ER ROAD LIBRARY BUILT WITH COUNTY FUNDS OF $6.4 MILLION FOR $1 A YEAR.
AS A PART OF THAT SAME LEASE AGREEMENT, WARREN COUNTY WAS GRANTED THE RIGHT TO USE THE VILLA AVENUE BUILDING FOR 20 YEARS FREE WITH NO COST.
THAT IS A PUBLIC-PRIVATE PARTNERSHIP.
BOTH PARTNERS HAD ASSETS AND EQUITY IN THE DEAL.
HOWEVER, THE TURNING POINT CAME IN 2011, 2011.
THE FOLLOWING SITUATION OCCURRED.
FIRST OF ALL, IT WAS A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND.
IN 2008 WHEN THE BUILDING WAS BEING CONSTRUCTED, SAMUELS HAD COMMITTED $600,000 OF DONATIONS TO FURNISH THE LIBRARY IN 2009.
I MAY GET SOME YEARS WRONG HERE, BUT THEY'RE IN THE REPORT.
THE, THE COUNTY LOANED SAMUELS, I BELIEVE $356,000.
AGAIN, THE ACTUAL, I'M SORRY, BUT THE ACTUAL FIGURES WILL BE IN THE REPORT, UM, TO BUY FURNITURE.
SO BY THE TIME 2011 ROLLED AROUND, SAMUELS HADN'T
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NOT APPARENTLY RAISED THE 600,000.THEY BORROWED 300 SOMETHING THOUSAND TO GET THE, THE FURNITURE.
BY THE TIME 2011 ROLLED AROUND, THERE WERE $256,000 IN DEBT.
AND THE COUNTY, AS I ALLUDED TO THE OTHER NIGHT IN OUR JOINT MEETING, THE COUNTY DECIDED THEY WOULD BUY SAMUEL BUY THE WHEEL AVENUE BUILDING FROM SAMUEL'S INSTEAD OF CONTINUING TO USE IT FOR FREE FOR THE NEXT 17 AND A HALF YEARS.
AS A RESULT OF THAT ABROGATION OF THAT LEASE, THE COUNTY PAID SAMUEL'S DEBT AND SEEDED THEIR CAPITAL ACCOUNT.
IT'S IMPORTANT TO NOTE THAT THE COUNTY GOT NOTHING OF CURRENT VALUE IN THAT TRANSACTION, EVEN TODAY IN 2024, THAT LEASE WOULD'VE ALLOWED THE COUNTY TO USE THAT BUILDING FOR ANOTHER FOUR YEARS BEFORE ANY CONSIDERATION OF ADDITIONAL VALUE IS COMES INTO PLAY.
SO WE CAN SEE AT THIS POINT, AFTER THAT TRANSACTION, THE VILLA AVENUE BUILDING HAS TRANSFERRED ONTO THE WARREN COUNTY SIDE, AND NOW THE TAXPAYER ASSETS AND FUNDS ARE VERY DOMINANT IN THE LIBRARY.
THE TRANSFERS OF CASH AND DEBT FORGIVENESS FROM WARREN COUNTY TO SAMUEL'S ARE PROPERLY AND LEGALLY SAMUEL'S MONEY.
THERE'S NO CONTENTION BEING MADE OTHERWISE.
HOWEVER, IT'S NOT IRRELEVANT THAT THE TAXPAYER WAS INVOLVED IN MAKING THOSE TRANSFERS AND SEEDING THAT ACCOUNT.
SO THE COUNTY HAS ESSENTIALLY THE VERY HIGH PREDOMINANCE OF THE BURDEN.
I'M GOING TO TO DISCUSS A A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THE ENDOWMENT.
THE SAMUELS ENDOWMENT CAME INTO THE, INTO THE, THE SPOTLIGHT, AT LEAST IN MY CASE, WHEN THE LIBRARY CLOSING NARRATIVE WAS CIRCULATING, CIRCULATING LAST YEAR.
AND I WAS ASKING WHY IS THERE, TALK ABOUT CLOSING THE LIBRARY.
WHAT SAMUELS HAD, WHAT THEY CALLED AT THE TIME, AN INVESTMENT ACCOUNT THEY NOW CALL AN ENDOWMENT WHEN THEY HAD A MILLION DOLLAR ENDOWMENT.
WHY WAS THERE THIS NARRATIVE CIRCULATING ABOUT CLOSING THE LIBRARY AND WHY WASN'T SAMUELS CALMING? PEOPLE SAYING, DON'T WORRY, IT WON'T BE NECESSARY.
ALL WE'RE TRYING TO DO IS NEGOTIATE AN AGREEMENT WITH THE COUNTY TO BE ABLE TO OPERATE THE LIBRARY.
THAT REASSURANCE NEVER HAPPENED.
THIS CHART SHOWS THAT THE TAXPAYERS ESSENTIALLY SEEDED THE SAMUEL'S ENDOWMENT.
THE DEBT FORGIVENESS AND THE CASH PAYMENTS IN A SIMPLIFIED FINANCIAL MODEL, IF COMPOUNDED AT 6.4%, WHICH IS WHAT SAMUEL'S HISTORICAL RECORD IS, WOULD BE WORTH A MILLION $80,000 TODAY.
TO BE CLEAR, THIS IS NOT A CHART THAT IS TRYING TO SIMULATE OR SAY WHAT SAMUEL'S BALANCE IS.
THIS IS A SHOW, A DEMONSTRATION THAT THE FUNDS THAT WERE TRANSFERRED TO SAMUELS IN THAT TRANSACTION AND THAT ABROGATION OF THAT AGREEMENT ARE EQUIVALENT TO WHAT THEIR ENDOWMENT CURRENTLY IS.
NOW WE'LL TURN TO COST EFFICIENCY.
WE JUST HAD A DISCUSSION WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THE BUDGET PROCESS A FEW MINUTES AGO, THAT WE CANNOT REALLY JUDGE WHETHER SOMETHING IS APPROPRIATE JUST BY EVALUATING THE SERVICE LEVELS.
WE HAVE TO KNOW WHAT THEY COST.
SERVICE LEVELS ARE, ARE INCREASING AND COSTS ARE INCREASING.
THAT'S THE MAIN, THAT'S A MAINTENANCE OF EFFICIENCY.
SERVICE LEVELS ARE INCREASING AND COSTS ARE DECREASING.
THAT'S AN INCREASE IN EFFICIENCY.
DO WE HAVE A RATIO TO CONSIDER? SO IT'S ALWAYS GONNA BE A CONSIDERATION OF WHAT IS THE SCOPE THAT'S APPROPRIATE AND WHAT IS THE COST OF THE SERVICE.
WHILE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT COST EFFICIENCY AND TO PROVIDE A A A AN EXAMPLE OF ONE OF THE REASONS WHY THERE, THERE MAY BE A CAUSE FOR CONSIDERING A RE-BASELINING OF THE OPERATION OF THE LIBRARY IS THAT WE CAN COMPARE OUR NEIGHBOR IN FREDERICK COUNTY HANLEY LIBRARY.
WE CAN LOOK AT A STAFF EXPENDITURE PER CAPITA FOR FY 25 BUDGET AND SEE THAT SAMUEL'S HAS A PER CAPITA STAFF EXPENDITURE OF 20.27 HANLEY OF 1288.
SO THE STAFF EXPENDITURES PER CAPITA AT HANLEY ARE 57% HIGHER IN TERMS OF STAFF EXPENDITURES.
THE TOTAL PERCENTAGE OF BUDGET TO SIMILAR BUT NOT AS EXTREME FOR SAMUEL, 72%
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OF EXPENDITURES OF THE BUDGET ARE FOR, FOR SALARY AND PAYROLL, 59%.AT HANLEY, THAT'S A 23% DIFFERENCE.
THIS IS JUST A MARKER THAT INDICATES IT'S A RATIONAL THING TO BE ASKING BASED ON THE COST EX ESCALATION THAT WE SAW BEFORE, BASED ON THE BASELINING OR THE, THE BASIS, THE MILLION DOLLAR BASIS THE COUNTY IS NOW SUPPORTING.
IS THERE A REASONABLE EXPECTATION OR RATIONAL REASON TO CONSIDER WHAT MAY BE POSSIBLE? NOW I WANNA SPEND A FEW MINUTES TALKING ABOUT THE PUBLIC NARRATIVE AND THE IMPACTS OF THE PUBLIC NARRATIVE ON GOVERNANCE.
THERE'S A TIMELINE HERE WHERE ROUGHLY IN JUNE, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS VOTED THEIR VOTE WAS TO ADOPT A BUDGET.
ONE OF THE FEATURES OF THAT BUDGET WAS THAT A 25% DISBURSEMENT TO SAMUELS WAS AUTHORIZED AND THE OTHER 75% WAS WITHHELD.
THAT WOULD BE IMPORTANT LANGUAGE TO UNDERSTAND.
THE RECALL EFFORT STARTED A PUBLIC NARRATIVE AROUND ACCUSATIONS OF BIGOTRY.
SOON FOLLOWED BY ACCUSATIONS OF THE BOARD SUPERVISORS DEFUNDING THE LIBRARY, AND THEN EVENTUALLY A CIRCULATION OF NARRATIVE ABOUT THE LIBRARY MIGHT BE CLOSING.
THIS WAS A DIFFICULT TIME IN THE COUNTY.
THERE WERE A LOT OF PEOPLE THAT I ENCOUNTERED PERSONALLY THAT DIDN'T EVEN KNOW THAT THE PUBLIC LIBRARY WAS NOT A COUNTY OPERATED OPERATION.
THEY JUST THOUGHT AND HAD THE IMPRESSION THAT BOARD OF SUPERVISORS DIDN'T THINK WE NEEDED A LIBRARY ANYMORE.
THAT SURPRISED ME, BUT IT, MANY PEOPLE THAT I SPOKE TO HAD THAT IMPRESSION.
THEY DID NOT KNOW ANY OF THE DETAILS OF THE CONTRACTS OR THE MECHANISM FOR HOW THE LIBRARY OPERATES.
THEY JUST HEARD BOARD SUPERVISORS DEFUNDING LIBRARY LIBRARIES CLOSING.
SO THAT IS A PUBLIC NARRATIVE THAT WAS DAMAGING.
THERE WERE TWO REQUIREMENTS FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
ONE OF THEM WAS TO ADOPT A POLICY THAT WAS A RESPONSE TO THE BOOK RECALL EFFORT.
SAMUEL'S ANNOUNCED THAT ON JULY 10TH, 2023, THE OTHER REQUIREMENT WAS FOR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND SAMUELS TO CONCLUDE A NEGOTIATION FOR A MEMORANDUM OF AGREEMENT TO CONTINUE OPERATING A LIBRARY ON A CONTRACT BASIS.
EVERYBODY KNEW THOSE REQUIREMENTS BY THE TIME THE END OF JUNE ROLLED AROUND.
SO THERE'S A LEGITIMATE QUESTION AS TO WHY THIS WAS, THIS RANKERS PUBLIC NARRATIVE WAS PERSISTENT THROUGH JULY, AUGUST AND SEPTEMBER.
THE NEXT NORMAL DISBURSEMENT DATE WOULD BE OCTOBER 1ST.
AGAIN, NOTABLE IN THIS TIMELINE IS THAT THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS DISPER DISPENSED, AS IT ALWAYS HAD FIRST FISCAL QUAR, FIRST QUARTER FISCAL FUNDING FOR SAMUEL'S LIBRARY, AND WITHIN THE, THE, YOU KNOW, THE FIRST PART OF JULY.
SO, SO AGAIN, NO FUNDING WAS EVER WITHHELD FROM SAMUELS LIBRARY.
I WANNA DISCUSS SOME KEY FACTORS ON THE MEDIA NARRATIVE IMPACTS ON GOVERNANCE.
ONE OF THE FACTORS WAS THAT SAMUELS RETAINED A NATIONALLY PROMINENT PUBLIC RELATIONS FIRM.
THEY, IN THEIR JULY 10TH MEETING OF 2023, INITIALLY ALLOCATED, UH, I BELIEVE THE NUMBER WAS 10,000, OR MAYBE IT WAS $15,000.
SAMUELS SEEMED TO ME, TO US TO PARTICIPATE IN RATHER THAN DISTANCE THEMSELVES FROM THE MEDIA.
NARRATIVE MANAGERS OF THE LIBRARY WERE CITED IN MEDIA STORIES INDICATING THE LIBRARY MAY HAVE TO CLOSE.
THE MEDIA NARRATIVES WERE UNDERWAY WHILE THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND SAMUELS WERE NEGOTIATING.
THE TOTAL TAB FOR THE PUBLIC RELATIONS FIRM WAS OVER $52,000.
WHAT ARE THE EFFECTS OF THIS? ONE OF THE EFFECTS WAS THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS BECAME THE OBJECT OF HEATED ACRIMONY.
WHILE THEY WERE TRYING TO FULFILL THEIR GOVERNANCE ROLE AS TAXPAYER REPRESENTATIVES.
THEIR JOB IS TO LISTEN TO THEIR CONSTITUENTS ON ALL SIDES.
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ONE WITNESSED ANY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, ANY MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, TO INTEGRATING OR, OR CATEGORIZING ANY OF THE PEOPLE ON EITHER SIDE OF THE CONTROVERSY.THE MEDIA MIS MESSAGING MISLED MANY CITIZENS IN THE GROUNDLESS CONCERNS ABOUT DEFUNDING AND CLOSING THE LIBRARY.
I'LL DISCUSS THAT IN A MINUTE.
WHAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN A, A ROUTINE CONTRACT RENEWAL BECAME A PROTRACTED PUBLIC BATTLE ABOUT WHO RIGHTLY HAS THE GOVERNANCE PREROGATIVE OF THE PUBLIC LIBRARY.
WHILE THE MEDIA NARRATIVES PORTRAYED SAMUELS AS A VICTIM OF FUNDING THREATS AND CLOSURE, THEY REFUSED TO INCREASE TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION THAT WOULD'VE INCREASED OVERSIGHT.
AND NOTABLY, THEY SOUGHT CONTRACT TERMS THAT WERE FAR MORE AGGRESSIVE THAN THEIR PREVIOUS AGREEMENT, BOTH IN TERM SIX YEARS.
JAMESON, DID THAT 52,000 COME OUT OF THEIR OPERATING FUND THAT'S TAXPAYER FUNDED, OR DID IT COME OUT OF THEIR DONATIONS OR OTHER I DON'T, I I DON'T KNOW.
NO, I, I, I, UNDER MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT EX POST FACTO, A DONOR PAID THE BILL, BUT FACT, WHILE IT WAS GOING ON, I HAVE NO IDEA.
BUT I JUST WANNA MAKE A POINT THAT I BROUGHT UP DURING OUR WORKING SESSIONS HOW THEY CO-MINGLE TAX DOLLARS WITH THEIR DONATIONS.
AND SO, I DON'T KNOW, YOU KNOW, WE WOULDN'T KNOW AT THIS POINT.
THEY SAID THAT THEY WERE GONNA PRESENT IT, I THINK, IN DECEMBER, BUT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, WE DO, UH, THE, THE TAX DOLLARS WERE NOT ITEMIZED FOR OPERATIONS.
SO WE, TO ANSWER YOUR QUESTIONS, NO, WE DON'T KNOW.
I'M GONNA ADDRESS TWO OF THE NARRATIVES NOW, IN TERMS OF POINTS, THE LIBRARY DEFUNDING NARRATIVE, SAMUEL SAYS THEY WERE THREATENED WITH DEFUNDING, BUT AS A MATTER OF FACT, NO FUNDS WERE EVER WITHHELD IN A CURRENT OPERATING PERIOD.
SAMUEL SAYS THEY HAD NO REASSURANCES, THEY WOULD RECEIVE FUNDING AGAIN, EVER.
THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS NEVER ALTERED THE COUNTY LIBRARY BUDGET OR DISCUSSED PERMANENTLY REMOVING LIBRARY FUNDING.
SAMUELS MADE THE STATEMENT, WE THINK A MORE RESPECTFUL APPROACH WOULD'VE BEEN TO HAVE YOUR ASSURANCES THAT FUNDING WOULD CONTINUE.
IN FACT, IT WOULD'VE BEEN AN ETHICAL VIOLATION FOR THE BOARD OF SUPER, FOR A MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS TO REACH OUT TO THEIR COUNTERPART AT SAMUELS AND REASSURE THEM THAT FUNDING WOULD CONTINUE WHILE THE PARTIES WERE NEGOTIATING AN AGREEMENT ON BALANCE.
THE CLAIM OF THE THREAT TO FUNDING AND THE FUNDING DEFUNDING NARRATIVE DON'T HOLD WATER AS TO THE FUND, AS TO THE LIBRARY CLOSING NARRATIVE.
THE REALITY IS THAT WITHOUT FUNDING BEING RESTORED BY OCTOBER 1ST, WE WOULD'VE HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO CLOSE THE DOORS.
THE FACT IS THAT SAMUELS WAS PAYING FOR A NATIONALLY RECOGNIZED PUBLIC RELATIONS LAW FIRM DURING THE VERY PERIOD THEY CLAIMED THE FINANCIAL EMERGENCY WOULD'VE FORCED CLOSURE.
THEY HAVE STATED THE $1 MILLION ENDOWMENT CURRENTLY FUND CURRENTLY EXISTS IN THE CASE OF AN EXTREME EMERGENCY.
THE QUESTION COULD BE ASKED, WOULD A LACK OF COUNTY FUNDS BE SUCH AN EMERGENCY? COULD IT HAVE BEEN USED FOR ONE WEEK OR TWO WEEKS, OR ONE MONTH WHILE NEGOTIATIONS WERE PROTRACTED AGAIN, ON BALANCE, THE LIBRARY CLOSING NARRATIVE DOESN'T HOLD WATER YET, YET, THOSE NARRATIVES AND THE MORE SOCIALLY EXPLOSIVE NARRATIVE OF THE BOOKS WAS GOING ON WHILE THE NEGOTIATIONS WERE TAKING PLACE NOW ONTO PUBLIC LIBRARY GOVERNANCE AND SUPPORT STRUCTURES.
THE NORMAL WAY THAT OUR LIBRARY BOARDS AND LIBRARIES ARE OPERATED IN THE STATE, INCLUDING THOSE OF ALL THE COUNTIES SURROUNDING US, ARE THAT ELECTED OFFICIALS APPOINT LIBRARY BOARDS.
AND LIBRARY BOARDS HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO OVERSEE PROFESSIONAL LIBRARY OPERATIONS, PRIVATE FOUNDATIONS, FRIENDS GROUPS, ENDOWMENTS, AND CHARITABLE SUPPORT ARE ALL NORMALLY PART OF THE EQUATION.
HOWEVER, THEY DO NOT MAKE GOVERNANCE DECISIONS.
THEY DON'T MAKE POLY DECISION POLICY DECISIONS.
THEY DO NOT MAKE DECISIONS ABOUT THE SCOPE OF SERVICES THAT THE GOVERNMENT IS GOING TO
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SURPRISE, UH, IS GOING TO PROVIDE.THEY ASSIST, THEY ENHANCE, AND THEY ADD VALUE.
AS PRIVATE ENDOWMENTS, FOUNDATIONS, FRIENDS GROUPS, AND CHARITABLE SUPPORT ORGANIZATIONS, I BELIEVE THERE'S A VERY POSITIVE TRANSFORMATION OPPORTUNITY FOR, FOR SAMUELS.
THE NEARBY HANLEY LIBRARY DEMONSTRATES HOW PRIVATE BENEFACTORS CAN MAINTAIN MEANINGFUL SUPPORT ROLES WHILE MAINTAIN, WHILE RESPECTING PROPER PUBLIC OVERSIGHT OF TAXPAYER FUNDED SERVICES.
THIS SEPARATION OF FUNCTIONS, PUBLIC GOVERNANCE FOR OPERATIONS, PRIVATE ENTITIES FOR SUPPLEMENTAL SUPPORT, PROVIDES A POTENTIAL PATHWAY FOR SAMUEL'S LIBRARY TO HONOR ITS LEGACY WHILE ENABLING APPROPRIATE TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION.
JUST AS THE HANLEY BOARD OF TRUSTEES ENHANCES LIBRARY SERVICES, WITHOUT CONTROLLING OPERATIONS, SAMUEL'S COULD CONTINUE ITS HISTORIC ROLE OF LIBRARY ADVANCEMENT FROM A STRUCTURAL POSITION, MORE FITTING TO THE PRESENT DAY CIRCUMSTANCES.
THE TRANSFORMATION OF SAMUEL'S LIBRARY INC.
INTO A PURE CHARITABLE SUPPORT ORGANIZATION WOULD OFFER SEVERAL ADVANTAGES.
RESTORATION OF THE ORIGINAL SAMUEL'S LEGACY OF COMMUNITY BENEFITS, FREEDOM TO FOCUS ON FUNDRAISING AND SPECIAL INITIATIVES, ENHANCE STABILITY TO ATTRACT PRIVATE DONATIONS, RELIEF FROM OPERATIONAL OVERSIGHT CONTROVERSIES, MAINTENANCE OF NAME RECOGNITION AND HISTORICAL CONNECTION, AND A CLEAR ALIGNMENT WITH NORMAL GOVERNMENT GO NORMAL LIBRARY GOVERNANCE PRACTICES IN THE STATE AND THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES.
AS TO SUMMARY AND CONCLUSIONS, WHAT WE FOUND, WHAT WE FOUND IS THAT THE LONG AND LONGSTANDING VALUED, PRODUCTIVE PARTNERSHIP WITH SAMUELS AND THE COUNTY HAD EVOLVED INTO A SUBSTANTIAL IMBALANCE.
WE HAVE A SITUATION THAT TAXPAYERS FUND, BUT DON'T GUIDE GOVERNANCE OF THE LIBRARY.
THE GROWTH CAN HAPPEN WITHOUT SUFFICIENT OVERSIGHT OVER TIME, AS WAS DEMONSTRATED.
AND NORMAL GOVERNANCE, NORMAL BEING WHAT, WHAT IS USUAL THAT, WHAT'S THE USUAL CASE IN OUR LIBRARIES OPERATING THROUGHOUT THE STATE? NORMAL GOVERNANCE IS LACKING.
FIDUCIARY RESPONSIBILITIES REQUIRE CHANGE.
THE STATUS QUO ISN'T A REASON TO CONTINUE.
THE STATUS QUO IS NOT NECESSARILY A REASON TO CHANGE, BUT WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, THIS COUNTY IS STILL STRUGGLING TO RECOVER FROM A 20 PLUS MILLION DOLLAR HOLE IN ITS FINANCES.
IT DOESN'T WORK TO SAY THAT THIS PUBLIC SERVICE IS ONLY 1% OF THE COUNTY BUDGET.
IF A MILLION DOLLARS CAN BE EXAMINED TO FIND 10% SAVINGS OR 15% SAVINGS, THEN THAT IS SUBSTANTIAL TO THE PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR.
THAT MIGHT BE AN A TRACK LOADER FOR A SITE TO THE FINANCE DEPARTMENT.
THAT MIGHT BE A NEW SERVER TO THE FIRE DEPARTMENT.
THAT MIGHT BE A NEW FIRST RESPONDER.
I MEAN, WE JUST DON'T APPROACH BUDGETS IN THAT, IN THAT FASHION.
1% OF THE FEDERAL BUDGET IS $600 BILLION, I THINK.
SO STANDARD MODELS EXIST AND WORK WE SHOULD BE OPEN TO CONSIDERING THEM.
EFFICIENCY ALWAYS NEEDS EVALUATION.
IT'S THE ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES PREROGATIVE AND DUTY TO LOOK AT BOTH SIDES OF THE EFFICIENCY EQUATION.
AND PUBLIC SERVICES NEED PUBLIC VOICE.
THE RECOMMENDATIONS FOR A PATH FORWARD ARE TO ESTABLISH A WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY BOARD TO ENCOURAGE AND PROMOTE A PROFESSIONAL IN AN ORGANIZED TRANSITION TO PRESERVE SAMUEL'S LEGACY AND TO ASSURE COMMUNITY BENEFITS OF PUBLIC LIBRARY SERVICES GOING FORWARD.
AND THAT CONCLUDES OUR REPORT.
ANY DISCUSS, UH, TURN THIS ON ANY DISCUSSION? I JUST WANT TO JUST, I THINK THAT WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT ALL.
EVENING IS ABOUT EFFICIENCIES, YOU KNOW,
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MEASUREMENTS IN, UM, AND, AND I THINK THE LIBRARY, UH, SHOULD BE FOLDED IN WITH ALL THE OTHER, THE, ALL THE OTHER, UM, DEPARTMENTS AND, UM, NONPROFITS.DALEY JUST SAID THAT THE BOARD IS NOT GONNA RAISE TAXES.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, BUT ANY EVENT, OKAY, SO WHAT IF THE INFLATION RATE GOES UP 8%? I DON'T KNOW.
I'M JUST THROWING THAT NUMBER OUT RIGHT NOW.
I MEAN, YOU HAVE AN ESCALATION FACTOR EVERY YEAR, COSTS ARE GONNA GO UP, YOU KNOW, SO WE HAVE TO START GETTING OUR ARMS AROUND.
AND JUST TO ADD SOME DATA POINTS, UM, TO DR.
JAMESON, RIGHT NOW, THE BOARD APPROVED TO GO FORWARD WITH, UM, SOFTBALL FIELDS OUT IN ROCKLAND PARK.
WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO MATCH THE, THE, THE FEDERAL GRANT BY $2 MILLION, AND THEN WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO PUT THAT IN OUR BUDGET NEXT YEAR.
YOU KNOW, I MEAN, SO THERE'S A LOT OF, YOU KNOW, UH, WE HAVE TO START TIGHTENING OUR BILLS.
ONE OTHER POINT I WANNA ADD IS THAT DR.
JAMESON WAS SAYING ABOUT A $20 MILLION DEBT, YOU KNOW, HOLE THAT WE HAVE FROM THE EDA.
WELL, ACTUALLY, THE COUNTY OWES $110 MILLION.
WE PAY $11 MILLION A YEAR IN DEBT SERVICE.
SO WE HAVE TO TIGHTEN OUR BELTS IF WE DON'T WANNA RAISE TAXES AND START LOOKING AT PERFORMANCE FACTORS.
AND, YOU KNOW, HOW WE CAN, YOU KNOW, UH, EFFICIENTLY USE TAXPAYER DOLLARS AND TRY AND AGAIN, I'M GONNA SAY IT AGAIN, THE THREE LEGGED STOOL BALANCE THAT STOOL.
SO, UM, I AGREE WITH DR. JAMES S MS. COOK.
COULD I, COULD I EMPHASIZE WITH YOU, WHEN YOU SAID THAT WE'VE GOT A, WE PAID $11 MILLION A YEAR IN SERVICE, UH, ON THAT $110 MILLION DEBT, THAT IS THE INTEREST THAT WE'RE PAYING.
THAT DOES NOT LOWER THAT PRINCIPLE AT ALL.
I THINK IT'S 3 MILLION IN, IN INTEREST THAT WE PAY IN INTEREST.
IF I REMEMBER THE NUMBER, I THINK WHEN I CAME ON THE BOARD, WE WERE SOMEWHERE AROUND 140 PLUS MILLION IN DEBT BECAUSE OF SCHOOL CONSTRUCTION AND OUR DEBT SERVICE.
SO EACH YEAR, BECAUSE OF, UM, THE LEADERSHIP, DR.
DALEY, WE HAVE BEEN NOT BORROWING, WE'VE BEEN PAYING IN CASH, AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE DOWN TO 110 MILLION.
THE BOARD AGREED NOT TO BORROW ANY MORE MONEY THREE, TWO YEARS AGO.
SO I THINK THIS BOARD AND THE MEMBERS OF THE BOARD, SINCE I'VE BEEN ON, AND DR.
DALEY'S BEEN HERE, HAS BEEN VERY FINANCIALLY MOTIVATED TO COUNT THE PENNIES.
I THINK WE BANG THOSE PENNIES TOGETHER REALLY TIGHT AT A LOT OF TIMES.
SO, UM, AT ANY EVENT, I SUPPORT DR.
JAMESON'S, UM, CONCLUSION THAT I THINK WE NEED TO ESTABLISH A WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY BOARD AND START LOOKING AT THE, UM, THE, THE BALANCE OF TAX DOLLARS THAT IS GOING, UH, TO THE OPERATIONS OF THE, OF THE LIBRARY.
YOU KNOW, I'M NOT SAYING WE'RE GONNA CUT THE BUDGET.
I'M NOT, YOU KNOW, BUT WE NEED TO START LOOKING AT ALL DEPARTMENTS, ALL, ALL THE NON-PROFITS.
I THINK IF WHAT WE DO FOR THE OVERSIGHT FOR ONE SHOULD BE THE OVERSIGHT FOR ALL, OTHERWISE WE'RE SINGLING OUT.
AND I DON'T THINK THAT'S A GOOD LOOK AT ALL.
DALEY, WHAT WOULD BE THE PROCESS FOR THIS? I KNOW BACK WHEN PUBLIC HEARING, I'M SURE HAS TO BE PART OF IT.
UM, BUT I KNOW BACK WHEN I FIRST GOT ON THE BOARD AND WE WERE HAVING THE CONTROVERSY OVER WHETHER THE STATUE STAYED ON THE COURTHOUSE LAWN, WE PUT IT AS A REFERENDUM TO FIND OUT WHAT TO DO WITH THAT.
SO TO FIND OUT WHAT THE COMMUNITY WANTS HERE, WHAT IS THE BEST WAY TO DO THAT? THE, WELL, THE PROCESS, IF YOU ESTABLISH A, UM, WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY, UM, YOU WOULD DO THAT BY ORDINANCE AND IT WOULD REQUIRE A PUBLIC HEARING.
UM, I, I'D HAVE TO ASK MR. HAM TO BE CERTAIN ABOUT WHETHER YOU CAN PUT THAT QUESTION ON A REFERENDUM.
I THINK YOU CAN, BUT I'M NOT CERTAIN.
I JUST, YOU KNOW, I KNOW WITH THE STATUE, THAT WAS THE, THE WAY WE FELT LIKE YOU COULD GET MORE PEOPLE THAN WHO COME TO A PUBLIC HEARING, SO THAT YOU HAD
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FAIR OPPORTUNITY FOR EVERYONE TO WEIGH IN.SO THAT WAS WHY, AS I'M SITTING HERE LISTENING, THINKING ABOUT HOW CONTROVERSIAL THAT WAS, AND THAT WAS TO, FOR LACK OF BETTER WORDS, THAT WAS THE EASY WAY OUT.
WE GAVE IT TO THE VOTE, AND MUCH AS HOW WE'RE ELECTED AND HOW ALL OF OUR LEGISLATORS AND SO FORTH, IT WENT TO A VOTE.
SO JUST THE THOUGHT TO THINK ON, I WOULD OH, AND THAT, FIRST OF ALL, ONE OF THE THINGS I WANNA MAKE CLEAR IS THAT THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY BOARD DOESN'T AUTOMATICALLY CHANGE ANYTHING.
IT JUST, IT, WELL, IT, IT, IT PLACES THE AUTHORITY FOR GOVERNANCE AND BUDGET IN THE HANDS OF ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES.
UM, SECOND THOUGHT I HAD IS, IS THAT THE NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT COME TO PUBLIC MEETINGS IS, IS LESS IMPORTANT THAN THE PEOPLE, PEOPLE WHO VOTE IN ELECTIONS.
AND, UM, I THINK THAT AN ELECTION MEANS A LOT.
AND THIS WAS DEFINITELY ON THE BALLOT, ON THE AGENDA OF MANY PEOPLE, THE LAST ELECTION.
UM, HIGHLY VISIBLE, VERY ACTIVE IN THE POLL POLLING PLACES.
UM, SO THAT SHOULD BE, SHOULD BE WEIGHED AS WELL.
JAMESON, I WAS JUST KIND OF CURIOUS.
YOU KNOW, YOU SHOWED THE STATS FOR THE, UH, WHAT WAS IT? IT WAS $20, UH, PER CAPITA, UH, FOR THE, UH, ABOUT $20 PER CAPITA AT, UH, AT SAMUEL'S VERSUS HANLEY.
CAN WE HAVE A BREAKDOWN OF THE, UH, OF, OF, UH, THE, THE DIFFERENT SALARIES THAT, THAT THE PEOPLE GOT? WELL, THAT, THAT, THAT REALLY IS INTENDED TO BE AN ILLUSTRATION AND A, AT A DATA POINT THAT SIMPLY INDICATES THERE'S A REASON TO GET A FRESH LOOK.
SO NOT, NOT TO BE, NOT TO GET A GREEN EYE EYE SHADE OUT AND GO THROUGH, UH, ONE ORGANIZATION'S NUMBERS.
IT'S JUST TO SAY, YOU KNOW, IF THERE'S A MARKET PLACE FOR SERVICES, THEN WE SHOULD BE LOOKING AT WHAT THAT MARKETPLACE LOOKS LIKE.
I WAS JUST KIND OF CURIOUS AS TO, YOU KNOW, IF THERE WAS AN IMBALANCE IN THE, UH, IN THE, THE, THE SALARIES THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE A BUNCH OF PEOPLE WHO MAKE A DOLLAR, AND THEN YOU HAVE TWO OR THREE PEOPLE WHO MAKE $20, AND YOU GO, WAIT A MINUTE.
THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF AN IMBALANCE.
MY, MY, IN MY, IN MY OPINION, THERE ARE TWO FUNDAMENTAL PILLARS.
ONE OF THEM IS TAXPAYER REPRESENTATION.
THE OTHER IS THE POSSIBILITY OF FISCAL BENEFIT.
SO CAN WE TALK A LITTLE BIT THIS ADVISORY BOARD, WHAT, WHAT EXACTLY WOULD BE IN THEIR REMIT? WHAT WOULD THEY HAVE AUTHORITY TO DO AND, AND NOT TO DO? UM, AND AT WHAT POINT WOULD THEY NEED TO COME TO US FOR APPROVAL ON SOMETHING VERSUS SORT OF, YOU KNOW, WE'VE FULLY DELEGATED THAT.
IT'S, IT'S A DELEGATED, IT'S A DELEGATION THAT IS FULL.
THE, THE LIBRARY BOARD GOVERNS THE LIBRARY.
THEY'RE APPOINTED BY, BY THIS BOARD.
SO THEIR TAXPAYER REPRESENTED APPOINTEES, BUT THEY HAVE AUTHORITY OVER BUDGET, POLICY, SERVICE LEVEL.
THEY ARE RESPONSIBLE FOR THE PROFESSIONAL MANAGEMENT OF THE LIBRARY.
THEY CAN, THEY CAN, THEY CAN ESSENTIALLY, I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS THE RIGHT WAY TO SAY THIS, DO IT HOW THEY WANT.
BUT, BUT IT, IT REMOVES THE DETAILS FROM THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
IT GETS THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OUT FROM THESE, THESE TYPES OF, OF SITUATIONS.
SO, SO, UH, IT, IT ABSOLUTELY UP TO THAT WARREN COUNTY LIBRARY BOARD TO, TO GOVERN ALL MATTERS.
THERE'S, THERE'S NO POSSIBILITY OF YOU OR ME OR ANYBODY GOING IN AND PUSHING A BUTTON AND PULLING A LEVER TO SATISFY A CONSTITUENT OR SOMETHING.
IT'S, IT'S AN AUTONOMOUS GROUP.
AND SO WE COULD, WE COULD APPOINT THIS BOARD, AND THEN WE MAY OR MAY NOT LIKE WHAT THEY DID AFTER THAT.
YOU DON'T HAVE, IT'S JUST LIKE A, A JUST LIKE ANOTHER COMMISSION.
YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T LIKE WHAT THE AIRPORT COMMISSION'S DOING, THEN TOO BAD.
THEY HAVE A, THEY HAVE A TERM AND WE APPOINTED THEM.
SO YOU WORK THAT OUT THROUGH THE LONG TERM PROCESS OF TAXPAYERS ELECTING REPRESENTATIVES WHO MAKE APPOINTMENTS.
AND SO THIS STRUCTURE IS THEN THE NORM FOR THE MAJORITY, THE VAST, FOR THE VAST MAJORITY, VAST MAJORITY SYSTEMS IN VIRGINIA.
[01:30:01]
IT'S PROVIDED FOR ALREADY IN STATE CODE.UM, AND WHEN YOU SAY RELINING, DOES THAT TRANSLITERATE TO RECOMPETE OR YES.
OR DOES THAT, COULD THAT ALSO BE LIKE A CONVERSATION, LIKE TO TALK, LET'S TALK ABOUT WHERE CAN WE, WHERE CAN WE MAKE THIS OPERATION MORE EFFICIENT AND THEN MAYBE, OR NOT, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER THEY DECIDE.
WELL, AND THIS BOARD COULD DECIDE, IN MY OPINION, IT MEANS THAT YOU, YOU MAKE IT COMPETITIVE BECAUSE THAT'S THE WAY YOU GET THE REAL ANSWER.
UH, HAVING A STUDY OR, OR, YOU KNOW, DOING A, A, AN EVALUATION, ET CETERA.
THOSE ARE NOT, THOSE ARE NOT THE REAL DEAL.
LIKE, WHAT IS IT ACTUALLY, WHAT IS SOMEONE WILLING TO PUT THEIR, THEIR CONTRACT DOWN FOR? MM-HMM.
BY THE WAY, OBVIOUSLY SAMUELS WOULD BE PERFECTLY CAPABLE OF SUBMITTING IN A COMPETITIVE SITUATION, SO THEY COULD ACTUALLY WIN AND YEAH.
SO MR. HAM IS CHECKING SOME MORE, BUT HE DOESN'T THINK IT CAN BE A REFERENDUM.
BUT HE'S SAID HE'S GONNA DO SOME MORE LOOKING AT THIS RIGHT NOW.
AT ANY, AND I THINK THE ELECTION WAS A REFERENDUM THAT IS, IS A HIGH, HIGH, UH, QUALITY ONE.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? SO WE CAN, WE'LL COME BACK IF YOU WANT TO HIS RESPONSE WHEN I GET IT.
IF THAT'S ALL RIGHT, YOU COULD GO
[ G. Discussion - Board interest in Media Consultant]
ON TO YOUR NEXT ITEM.NO, NEXT ITEM ON THE AGENDA IS BOARD INTEREST IN A MEDIA CONSULTANT.
AND I'M NOT SURE THEY'D LIKE TOMORROW.
AT, AT THE BEGINNING OF THE YEAR, WE HAD A NUMBER OF DISCUSSIONS ABOUT WHETHER, UM, MR. JONES WAS GONNA BE ABLE TO PROVIDE, UH, PUBLIC, PUBLIC, UH, COMMUNICATIONS ASSISTANCE TO US.
UH, YOU KNOW, HIS WORKLOAD AND OTHER DUTIES HAVE ESSENTIALLY PRECLUDED THAT.
UM, WE, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT IT'S A, A REASONABLE PROSPECT FOR US TO ALLOCATE SOME FUNDS TO BE ABLE TO HAVE ASSISTANCE IN THE WAY THAT WE ARE ABLE TO RESPOND AS A BOARD, UM, NOT BE CAUGHT ON OUR HEELS.
WE HAVE, WE HAVE IN THE PAST, IN THE PAST, BEFORE I WAS ON THIS BOARD, AND EVEN WHILE I'VE BEEN ON THIS BOARD, UM, YOU KNOW, SITUATIONS WHERE MEDIA, A LOT OF MEDIA HUBB IS GOING ON.
AND, AND WE DON'T HAVE A, UM, A MECHANISM AS A BOARD TO COLLECT, TO COLLECTIVELY DEAL WITH IT AND COMMUNICATE, HAVE PUBLIC COMMUNICATION.
SO, IT'S MY ADVOCATION THAT WE, UH, ALLOCATE SOME FUNDS TO DO THIS.
WE HAVE A PROPOSAL, UM, FROM I THINK, UM, A LOCAL CONSULTANT WHO HAS DONE A LOT OF WORK FOR THE COUNTY, HAS A VERY GOOD REPUTATION, ALREADY KNOWS OUR SYSTEM, UM, NEEDS NO WARMUP TIME AND ET CETERA.
SO I'M OPEN TO QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.
WOULD THIS BE LIKE, ON AS NEEDED BASIS? IT'S AN ON-CALL, ON-CALL TESTING, BUT, BUT IT'S A TI IT'S A LIMIT.
THERE'S A, THERE'S A, I BELIEVE IT'S A, THERE'S A CEILING.
SO THEN IT KIND OF LIKE BEING, KEEPING SOMEBODY ON RETAINER.
I'M NOT SURE WE CALL A RETAINER.
THERE IS A, I, I DON'T HAVE THE LETTER IN FRONT OF ME, BUT IT'S A, IT'S A PROPOSAL.
UH, I THINK IT'S, UM, I'M NOT, I DON'T WANNA SAY THE NUMBERS 'CAUSE I DON'T WANNA MISQUOTE IT, BUT IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A, IT'S A CAPPED ALLOWANCE OF TIME.
UM, SO WHO WOULD THIS THIRD PARTY REPORT TO? INTERESTING QUESTION.
UH, WHAT WOULD IT BE? PROBABLY DR.
WELL, WHO ELSE? I DON'T KNOW WHAT TO SAY ABOUT THAT.
WE HAVEN'T THOUGHT IT THROUGH.
HUH? THAT'S WHY WE HAVE A WORKING SESSION.
I, I COULD SEE A LOT OF PLACES WHERE HAVING A BETTER MEDIA PRESENCE AND, AND WITH NO DISRESPECT TO ANYONE WHO'S DONE THIS FOR THE COUNTY IN THE PAST, A A, A VERY SAVVY MEDIA PRESENCE COULD, COULD BE HELPFUL.
AND I'M JUST THINKING LIKE WITH THE TAX INCREASE THAT WE, WE HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO PASS, BUT THERE WERE A LOT OF NARRATIVES OUT THERE, AND IT WAS VERY HARD TO CUT THROUGH THAT NOISE WITH, AND REALLY GET THE REASONS THAT WE WERE DOING.
AND, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE'S STILL NARRATIVES
[01:35:01]
AROUND ABOUT, YOU KNOW, CORRUPTION GOING BACK, YOU KNOW, FROM THINGS THAT HAPPENED YEARS AGO, UM, THAT HAVEN'T DIED OUT YET, EVEN THOUGH NONE OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE INVOLVED.YOU KNOW, SOME OF THOSE PEOPLE ARE IN JAIL, ET CETERA.
UM, AND THAT STILL COMES UP AGAIN, LIKE THE FAITH WAY PROPERTY TRANSACTION CREATED A LOT OF NEGATIVE BUZZ, YOU KNOW, UM, OR WHAT'S GOING ON WITH GARBAGE RATES.
YOU KNOW, WHY DID MY, WHY DID MY GARBAGE RATE GO UP IN THE TOWN? YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT.
IT WOULD BE HELPFUL TO GET THE MESSAGE OUT.
I THINK FOR FIRE AND RESCUE, WE HAVE STILL, WE, WE DID SOME GOOD PROGRESS.
WE HAVE A LONG WAY TO GO TO GET THEM REALLY WHERE THEY NEED TO BE.
AND WHETHER THAT MEANS, UM, A BOND REFERENDUM IN THE FUTURE OR OTHER SOLUTIONS, YOU KNOW, TO, TO, TO EXPLAIN WHERE WE'RE COMING FROM AND TO CUT THROUGH THE NOISE.
I THINK THIS COULD BE BENEFICIAL.
I, I WOULD ADD TOO, THIS NOT JUST, UM, DEFENSE AS OFFENSE.
I MEAN, THERE'S, UM, THE WHOLE TOURISM STUFF THAT WE WANT TO BE AS, AS OUT THERE, FORWARD AS POSSIBLE, PROACTIVELY.
UM, SO IT'S, THERE'S, THERE'S SOME DEFENSIVE ASPECTS.
THERE'S ALSO PROACTIVE ASPECTS.
UM, WELL, I I'M NOT SAYING THIS IS NOT A GOOD IDEA.
YOU KNOW, I'M JUST SAYING, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S THE, WHAT'S THE HIERARCHY? THE HIERARCHY ABOUT HAVING A A THIRD PARTY COME IN, YOU KNOW, WHO, WHO ARE THEY GONNA REPORT TO? AND, YOU KNOW, HISTORICALLY, THIS, THIS LOCAL CONSULTANT HAS WORKED WITH TODD AND WAS INSTRUMENTAL IN THE NEW WEBSITE SYSTEM.
SO THAT WOULD PERHAPS BE A NATURAL, UH, REPORTING POINT, BUT MAYBE, MAYBE IT'S A DEPUTY ADMINISTRATOR.
WELL, I KNOW WE'VE HAD DISCUSSIONS IN THE PAST.
I KNOW WE'VE HAD DISCUSSIONS IN THE PAST OF CREATING A, UM, YOU KNOW, A COMMUNICATIONS POSITION OR OFFICE OR, I, I DON'T THINK WE REALLY GOT OUR ARMS AROUND ROLLING WHAT THAT LOOKED LIKE.
SO MAYBE THIS IS THE BEGINNING THAT WE NEED TO, IT'S CERTAINLY A LOT CHEAPER.
START LOOKING AT IT AND FIGURE OUT WHAT'S THE RIGHT PLACE, YOU KNOW, TO PUT 'EM AND WHERE THE MONEY'S COMING FROM.
I'D SAY IT'D BE ABOUT A QUARTER OF THE COST OF, OF HIRING A PROFESSIONAL.
OH, NO, I HAVE NO ISSUES WITH IT AT ALL.
AGAIN, WE'RE NOT RAISING TAXES, YOU KNOW, WE GOTTA SOMEHOW ABSORB THIS.
I, I LOOK AT IT, UM, A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT WAY.
I, I THINK IT'S INCUMBENT ON ALL OF US TO DO OUR BEST TO COMMUNICATE AND EDUCATE OUR CONSTITUENTS.
AND, UM, WHEN I, WHEN I LOOK AT THIS VERSUS, UM, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT A GRANT WRITER FOR EVER SINCE I'VE BEEN ON THE BOARD.
AND IF I HAD TO CHOOSE BETWEEN A MEDIA CONSULTANT AND A GRANT WRITER, I'D RATHER GO, ESPECIALLY WHEN WE DON'T WANNA BE RAISING TAXES.
THIS IS GONNA BE A BURDEN ONE WAY OR THE OTHER WITH OR WITHOUT GRANT WRITER OR WHATEVER.
BUT I THINK WE GET A BIGGER BANG FOR OUR BUCK WITH A GRANT WRITER, BECAUSE I THINK WE'RE MISSING OPPORTUNITIES WHERE STAFF DOESN'T HAVE TIME TO DO THAT KIND OF THING.
UM, WE HAD ONE FOR A SHORT PERIOD.
IT DIDN'T WORK OUT TO ANY OF OUR EXPECTATIONS.
UM, SO WE'VE KIND OF, IT FELL OFF THE RADAR, UM, FROM BEING AT VACO THIS WEEKEND.
AND, UM, A LOT OF THE THINGS I LISTENED TO, UM, ESPECIALLY I WENT TO ONE ON SPORTS, UH, AND TOURISM.
AND THERE'S A LOT OF GRANT OPPORTUNITIES OUT THERE THAT I THINK WERE MISSING.
SO IF I, IF I HAD TO CHOOSE BETWEEN ONE OF THE TWO, I'D LEAN TOWARDS A GRANT WRITER.
I WOULD SAY THAT THEY BOTH MIGHT BE NEEDED.
A GRANT WRITER CAN THEORETICALLY PAY FOR THEMSELVES PRETTY QUICKLY.
UM, YEAH, WE DEFINITELY NEED A GRANT WRITER.
I, YOU KNOW, AND I, I'M JUST LOOKING AT, AGAIN, WE'RE ALL THINKING BUDGET.
WE, YOU KNOW, GOTTA REQUEST A NIGHT THAT WE GOTTA FIGURE OUT.
AND, UM, THERE'S ALWAYS SOMETHING THAT BREAKS IT.
YOU KNOW, WE'RE ALL HOLDING OUR BREATHS ON THE, UM, AIR CONDITIONING UNITS.
I'M ALMOST EVEN AFRAID TO SAY THAT ANYMORE.
UM, BECAUSE THEY'RE ON THEIR LAST LEGS, UNFORTUNATELY.
AND THEY'VE BEEN KICKING THEM TO KICKSTART 'EM FOR A WHILE.
WE HEAR THAT AT EACH OF OUR BUILDING COMMITTEE MEETINGS.
IT'S LIKE, WE WALK IN AND IT'S LIKE, PLEASE DON'T LET AN AIR CONDITIONING UNIT BE DOWN.
THERE'S, THERE'S NEW REGULATIONS NOW FOR HH.
THAT'S GONNA INCREASE ANY REPAIR COST OR, OR I THINK WE WERE TALKING ABOUT IT MIGHT BE BETTER FOR US TO
[01:40:02]
A LOT OF MONEY.SO THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHT ON IT.
WHEN I LOOK AT, IT'S LIKE MY HOUSEHOLD, YOU KNOW, YOU PLAN FOR THAT VACATION AND THEN THE FURNACE, THE WASHER, SOMETHING ELSE, THEY ALL GO ON THE BLINK AND THERE GOES YOUR VACATION MONEY.
SO, UM, I, I LOOK AT THE WHAT IFS AND, AND BEING ON THAT, UM, YOU KNOW, HEARING THE OPPORTUNITIES THAT I HEAR OTHER COMMUNITIES ARE TAKEN ADVANTAGE OF AND WE'RE MISSING THE VOTE ON.
SO, UH, THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHTS ON THAT.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS? SO MR. HAMS AT 95% LEVEL NOW, 95%? NO, 95%.
NO, HE'S GONNA, HE'S GONNA, THAT'S FINE.
IT IS DEFINITELY NOT IN THE STATUTE.
I JUST WANTED TO THROW IT OUT TO MAKE SURE WE'RE COVERING ALL THE OPTIONS TO MAKE EVERYBODY, WE CAN'T MAKE EVERYBODY HAPPY, BUT MAKE AS MANY HAPPY AS WE CAN.
SO, AND TO CUT DOWN ON, UM, THE CONTROVERSY OVER, OVER THINGS THAT WE KNOW ARE GONNA BE CONTROVERSIAL.
SO WE WILL, UM, HAVE OUR JOINT.
DO YOU WANT TO TALK ABOUT THE, YOUR RESEARCH ITEM FOR A COUPLE MINUTES? UM, DO YOU THINK THAT WOULD BE A GOOD TIME? I WAS THINKING WE MIGHT JUST GO AHEAD AND THROW IT OUT.
UM, I DID A LITTLE GOOGLING, WHICH FOR ME,
IS, UM, NOT THE MOST COMPUTER SAVVY PERSON IN THE WORLD, BUT, UM, WE, THE COMMUNICATION BETWEEN US AND THE TREASURER'S OFFICE HAS NOT BEEN OPTIMAL.
UM, AND I WAS, UM, ASKED ON ELECTION DAY WHY AS CHAIRMAN, I WASN'T MAKING THAT BETTER.
AND I SAID, THIS IS A CONSTITUTIONALLY ELECTED POSITION.
I HAVE NO, YOU KNOW, POWER OVER.
UM, AND THE QUESTION WAS, WELL, WHO DOES? SO I GOOGLED IT AND THERE IS A CODE, AND I PROBABLY CAN'T FIND IT RIGHT NOW, BUT THERE IS A CODE THAT ALLOWS, SO 58.1, SECTION 33, UM, I'M NOT SURE THE LAST TWO DIGITS.
UM, MR. HAM'S GONNA SEND YOU A MEMO ON IT THIS WEEK.
AND IT ALLOWS US TO FORM, UM, A FINANCE, A COUNTY FINANCE BOARD FOR OVERSIGHT.
SO, UM, I SENT, I SCREENSHOT IT, I SENT IT TO DR.
DALEY AND ASKED HIM TO HAVE, UM, MR. HAM LOOK INTO IT.
AND HE'S PRETTY SURE THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE CAN DO.
WELL, I THINK THAT THAT'S WHY WE HAVE THE FINE AUDIT COMMITTEE.
THIS IS FINANCE AUDIT COMMITTEE.
AND, AND WHATEVER THAT CODE IS, IF YOU JUST, WHATEVER THAT CODE IS, LOOK IN OUR BYLAWS AND MAKE SURE THAT'S NOT THE CODE.
THIS ONE HAS A JUDGE APPOINTED MEMBER.
SO IT'S, IT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE, UM, THIS COMMITTEE, ACCORDING TO MR. HAM THAN 58.1 33, SOMETHING IS CONSISTS OF THREE MEMBERS, THE CHAIR, THE TREASURER, AND A MEMBER APPOINTED BY THE JUDGE.
AND THEY HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DIRECT INVESTMENTS AND TO DIRECT REQUIRING SPECIFIC REPORTS.
SO, SO WHEN YOU SAY THE CHAIR, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE CHAIR HERE? MM-HMM.
SO IT, LIKE I SAID, I WILL GET THAT TO YOU.
UM, JASON 0.1 31 51, EXCUSE ME.
AND MR. HAM IS GONNA HAVE A MEMO TO YOU THIS WEEK ON IT.
SO THAT ONE OF THE THINGS YOU NEED TO BE THINKING ABOUT IS IF YOU DECIDE TO DO THIS, YOU WANT TO COME UP WITH NAMES OF INDIVIDUALS THAT YOU MIGHT NOMINATE TO THE COURT.
THE JUDGE MAKES THE APPOINTMENT.
BUT YOU CAN SUBMIT NAMES FOR HIS CONSIDERATION.
SO, SO THE JUDGE IS THE WAY WHO SELECTS THEM? YES.
WHEN YOU SAY NAMES, CITIZEN APPOINTMENTS OR BOARD MEMBERS YES.
AND IT WOULD GO TO THE JUDGE MAKES THE APPOINTMENT AS I, SO THE JUDGE, THE JUDGE APPOINTS ONE, ONE MEMBER.
AND THEN THE THIRD ONE IS APPOINTED BY TREASURER.
[01:45:01]
TREASURER.AND I BELIEVE IS IT FINANCE DIRECTOR AS WELL AS IN ON, I'M NOT SURE.
THEY CAN COME TO THE MEETINGS, BUT THEY'RE NOT MEMBERS.
WHICH JUDGE? I'LL CIRCUIT COURT.
JUDGE FUNK WOULD BE MAKING THE APPOINTMENT.
UM, THIS, AS I SAY, AND UNDER THE BZA, YOU HAVE SPECIFIC PROVISIONS FOR MAKING RECOMMENDATIONS TO THE JUDGE.
AND THEY ARE APPOINTED BY THE JUDGE.
IN THIS CASE, THAT PROVISION IS NOT THERE.
BUT JASON BELIEVES WE CAN STILL MAKE RECOMMENDATIONS.
THE JUDGE IS NOT BOUND BY, BY ANY MEANS.
AND YOU CAN GO FORWARD WITHOUT DOING THAT AND LET THE JUDGE APPOINT.
ALL, ALL IT HAS TO BE IS A CITIZEN OF WARREN COUNTY WHO HAS EXPERIENCE, FINANCIAL EXPERIENCE, I WOULD HOPE.
WELL, THAT WOULD BE THE CRITERIA, BUT THAT'S NOT IN THE CODE.
BUT I'M JUST HOPING THAT WHOEVER HAS, HAS SOMEBODY WHO KNOWS THE, UH, UNDERSTANDS THIS IS HOW THE VIRGINIA SNAP PROGRAM WORKS.
HOW PUT YOUR MONEY IN AND YOU GET IT OUT EVERY DAY.
I WOULD HOPE WE WOULD FIND SOMEBODY WITH SOME INVESTMENT OR PORTFOLIO EXPERIENCE TO BE AT THIS LEVEL.
AND YOU DON'T HAVE TO REMIND YOU AGAIN, YOU DON'T HAVE TO DO ANY OF THE INVESTING.
YOU PUT YOUR MONEY IN THE VIRGINIA SNAP PROGRAM.
DO WE NEED TO HAVE THIS BOARD? I THINK SHE BETTER HURRY UP.
'CAUSE YOU MIGHT DECIDE TO CONSIDER THIS PRETTY SOON.
I MEAN, IF SHE COMES, CAME BACK AND SAID, OKAY, WE, WE TAKE YOUR RECOMMENDATION THAT WE NEED TO SHIP OUR INVESTMENTS TO THE STATE.
DO WE NEED TO HAVE THIS BOARD? WELL, I THINK IF YOU WANT MONTHLY RECONCILING OF YOUR REPORTS AND YOU WANT TO KNOW HOW MUCH MONEY YOU HAVE, I SENT YOU AN EMAIL OVER THE WEEKEND, UH, ABOUT THE STATUS OF THE OCTOBER REPORTS.
AND I THINK IF YOU WANT THAT TO STOP, YOU NEED TO HAVE A BOARD, SOMETHING LIKE THIS THAT'S GOING TO REQUIRE HER TO DO THIS.
AND I THINK IT'D HAVE TO BE, IT WOULD HAVE TO BE DONE RATHER THAN SAYING, OKAY, WE WILL DO IT.
WELL, I GOT THAT AND I SENT AN EMAIL BACK REQUESTING HER IF SHE WOULD GET TOGETHER SO SHE CAN SHOW, UM, SHOW ME THE PROCESS OF HOW THEY BALANCE IT AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
AND I HAVE NOT YET RECEIVED AN ANSWER TO MY EMAIL, BUT OF SETTING UP, I MEAN, I THINK I GAVE HER THREE DAYS TO, TO BE, AND THE COMMITTEE, AND THAT WAS MY COMMITTEE SAID SEVERAL TIMES THAT SHE HAS AGREED SHE'S GOING TO INVEST THIS MONEY AND THAT IT HAS NOT HAPPENED.
I'M NOT AWARE OF HER AGREEING TO DO THAT, BUT I UNDERSTAND THE BOARD.
I UNDERSTAND WHERE YOU'RE GOING WITH, YOU'RE JUST TRYING TO FORCE THE MATTER ON HER TO CONSIDER OUR RECOMMENDATIONS SINCE SHE IS A CONSTITUTIONAL OFFICER.
I DIDN'T MEAN TO CUT YOU OFF, MA'AM.
I JUST, UH, I'VE, I DON'T LIKE DOING THIS, BUT I DON'T WANNA BE IN THE POSITION OF, UM, SITTING BACK DOING NOTHING AND THEN BEING HIT WITH WE SHOULD HAVE DONE SOMETHING.
DALEY'S ASSESSMENT OVER THIS, THAT BOARD, UH, THE FINANCIAL COMMITTEE HAS TALKED ABOUT THIS AND TALKED TO HER ABOUT IT, AND SHE'S PROMISED TO COME BACK AND EXPLAIN IT.
AND, AND THAT WAS MY IMPETUS TO, SO NO, I'M NOT ARGUING OR, YOU KNOW, THAT THIS IS NOT A RIGHT THING TO DO TO GET SOME TYPE OF RESPONSE FROM OUR TREASURER.
SO BECAUSE WE ARE, YOU KNOW, THE FINANCES IS VERY IMPORTANT.
YOU KNOW, WE DON'T GET THE BALANCE SHEETS.
AND, UM, YOU KNOW, WHEN YOU'RE COMING UP TO, YOU KNOW, THE BUDGET PROCESS, YOU KNOW, I I, I'D LIKE TO KNOW HOW MUCH I HAD IN MY CHECKING ACCOUNT.
SO, UM, I FEEL LIKE WE'D BE REMISS IF WE DIDN'T DO THIS.
HOW, HOWEVER, WE ARE ROLLING THE ICE A LITTLE BIT WITH WHO THE JUDGE APPOINTS AND, YOU KNOW, I, I DON'T KNOW.
WELL, I WILL SAY, UM, HOW THAT WOULD GO, YOU KNOW, JUDGE FUNK WAS BORN AND RAISED HERE, AND, UM, I FIND HIM TO BE A VERY LEVELHEADED AND LOGICAL MAN.
SO I, I THINK HE'S INVESTED ENOUGH THAT HE WANTS TO PUT SOMEBODY THAT'S GONNA DO A GOOD JOB THERE AS WELL.
IT REFLECTS BACK ON HIM AS WELL AS US.
SO MY EXPERIENCE WITH HIM IS LIMITED.
I'M GONNA SEE HIM TOMORROW WHEN MY TWINS GET THEIR DRIVER'S LICENSES.
BUT THE LAST TIME I DID THAT, HE WAS LEVELHEADED AND, AND RATIONAL.
SO
[01:50:01]
SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT, UM, THINK ABOUT AND WE WOULD LIKE TO GET ON NEXT WEEK'S AGENDA IF EVERYONE, UH, IS AGREEABLE TO THAT.DO YOU WANT TO GO BACK TO THE LIBRARY REPORT NOW? I THOUGHT HE SAID HE WAS DONE WITH THAT.
AND YEAH, NO, I THOUGHT, 'CAUSE YOU, WHEN HE
SO, UH, BUT IT WILL GO PUBLIC HEARING, SO THAT'S YES.
THIS WOULD BE A REQUEST FOR A PUBLIC HEARING.
SO, UH, WE ARE AT THE POINT, YES OR NO, SIR, IS THAT YES.
TO SCHEDULE A PUBLIC HEARING ON YOUR AGENDA NEXT WEEK? I WOULD HOPE SO.
SO THAT'LL BE, IT'LL BE A MOTION FOR YOU TO DIRECT US TO, TO ADVERTISE A HEARING IN DECEMBER.
AN AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE.
I WAS GONNA SAY, THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING.
THE HEARING WOULD BE IN DECEMBER.
JASON IS 95%, THEN STEVE MYERS, TWO, I'M, I'M FINE WITH THAT.
WE WILL DO, UNLESS HE COMES UP AND SAYS, OH, I'M A HUNDRED PERCENT AND THEN WE CAN DISCUSS IT AGAIN.
UM, WE ARE ABOUT EIGHT MINUTES, I GUESS SOMEWHERE.
SEVEN OR EIGHT MINUTES FROM THE SEVEN O'CLOCK, UH, JOINT MEETING.
SO IF EVERYONE WANTS TO TAKE A BREAK AND THEN WE'LL BE BACK HERE AT SEVEN.
AND WELCOME TO THIS JOINT MEETING OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION CALL, THE MEETING TO ORDER.
AND, UM, ROLL CALL MR. HENDERSON OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, PLEASE.
AND I'LL TURN IT OVER TO YOU, CHAIRMAN MEYERS, TO, UM, OPEN YOUR COMMISSION.
WE'LL CALL THE MEETING OF COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION TO ORDER.
UH, DO WE NEED THE DO THE ROLL CALL ALSO? NO IDEA? YES.
WE ALL HERE AGAIN? UH, MR. GORDON? HERE.
[ H. Discussion - Warren County Sheriff's Office Proposed Shooting Range]
CHAIRMAN MYERS, IF YOU, YOU WOULD INDULGE ME.I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE, UM, A RECOMMENDATION FOR YOUR CONSIDERATION.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO ASK IF YOU WOULD EXTEND THE TABLING OF THIS ITEM AND GIVE THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS A CHANCE TO DISCUSS HIRING A STUDY GROUP TO DO A STUDY OF WHERE THE BEST PLACE IN WARREN COUNTY WOULD BE TO HAVE THIS TYPE OF FACILITY.
AND WHEREVER, IF WE DECIDE TO DO THAT, WHEREVER THEY SAY PUT IT, IT GOES OKAY.
PROBABLY SHOULD COME AS A, AS A VOTE FOR US.
ANYONE WANT TO MAKE A MOTION TO THAT EFFECT? BEFORE, BEFORE.
SO, I'M SORRY, I'M, I'M CONFUSED.
SO WE'RE NOT DOING A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
WE'RE GOING INTO THE FIRING RANGE.
THAT'S WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT RIGHT NOW.
AND THAT WAS FIRST ON THE AGENDA.
YES, I I WAS STEP AHEAD OF MYSELF.
SO YOU'RE AT, YOU'RE REQUESTING FOR US TO TABLE THIS DISCUSSION TO EXTEND THEY'VE TABLED IT.
SO, SO I THINK ONE THING, UH, TONIGHT'S A WORK SESSION, SO I DON'T THINK WE CAN TAKE ANY ACTIONS TONIGHT.
UH, BUT FOR OUR CONSIDERATION TOMORROW, BUT TO CONSIDER THAT, THAT'S YES.
THAT'S WHY I SAID JUST WANTED TO CLARIFY.
THAT'S WHY I SAID TAKE IN CONSIDERATION TO THAT.
SO THEN THAT'S DULY WE DIDN'T NEED TO VOTE ON THAT THEN I WOULDN'T THINK WOULD WE? NO.
SO WE'RE REALLY POSTPONING, WE'RE POSTPONING THIS WORK SESSION TO DO A STUDY.
I'M ASKING THEM AT THEIR MEETING TOMORROW NIGHT TO CONSIDER EXTENDING THE TABLING THAT THEY HAVE CURRENTLY IN ORDER FOR US TO DISCUSS AND CONSIDER IN OUR MEETING NEXT WEEK TO HIRE A STUDY GROUP.
MY REASONING HERE IS IF THIS IS, NO ONE WANTS THIS IN THEIR BACKYARD.
SO WE'VE BEEN AT THIS, WHAT, SIX MONTHS OR BETTER.
AND WE ARE STILL NOT AT A PLACE OF, IS THIS THE BEST PLACE OR IS IT NOT? THEN WE'RE LOOKING AT THE ESA LANE.
I REMEMBER BACK IN 2019 WHEN THERE WAS, UM, A PUBLIC HEARING FOR A BURN FACILITY THERE, AND
[01:55:01]
THIS ROOM WAS FULL.SO MY THOUGHT IS WE'RE JUST GONNA HAVE THE SAME SIX MONTHS OF DEALING WITH THIS AND THEN WE GO TO CATLAND MOUNTAIN AND THERE WE ARE AGAIN.
SO INSTEAD OF WASTING SO MUCH TIME, AND EVERYBODY KNOWS I'M A PENNY PINCHER, I DON'T LIKE SPENDING MONEY ON STUDIES THAT WE DON'T NEED.
BUT I THINK IN ORDER FOR THE COMMUNITY TO ACCEPT THIS, THAT WE NEED AN OUTSIDE AGENCY TO COME IN, MUCH LIKE WE'RE DOING WITH THE FIRE DEPARTMENT TO LOOK AT AND EVALUATE AND THEN COME BACK TO US AND SAY, THIS IS THE BEST PLACE.
SO YOU'RE RECOMMENDING TO DO A THIRD PARTY ASSESSMENT? CORRECT.
AS PLANNERS WORK SESSIONS BE OKAY.
IF WE DISCUSS THAT? THAT'S, I THINK THAT'S THE, THE GOOD THING ABOUT A WORK SESSION THAT WE, WE CAN, WE'RE ALL HERE, WE CAN ALL HEAR BACK AND FORTH AND THEN AT OUR MEETINGS WHERE WE CAN ACTUALLY VOTE ON IT.
MR. CHAIRMAN, MADAM CHAIR, MAY I SPEAK A LITTLE BIT? PLEASE? CERTAINLY.
OH, I HAVE HAD THE, UH, ALL OPPORTUNITY OF WORKING WITH SHERIFF PLAN A LITTLE BIT.
ALL MAYBE A LITTLE PRIVILEGED THAT WAY.
'CAUSE I KNOW HER ON MORE PERSONAL LEVEL, SO IT'S EASIER FOR ME TO COMMUNICATE WITH HER THAN, UH, YOU KNOW, SHE'S A LITTLE MORE TO ME IN JUST THE DEPARTMENT HEAD, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS BEING ABLE TO COMMUNICATE, UH, FRIENDS WITH HER HUSBAND PRIMARILY ALL.
SO WE HAVE AN OPEN LINE OF COMMUNICATION ALL WE'VE LOOKED AT SOME STUFF ON THE BENTONVILLE SITE.
UH, IT'S DEFINITELY HAD SOME STICKING POINTS.
UM, BESIDES IT'S POLITICAL ONES, UH, THAT, THAT NEED TO BE LOOKED AT.
I THINK SHE'S WORKING AT A TABLE AND MAYBE A GREAT IDEA.
'CAUSE UH, SHE'S INDICATED TO ME THAT SHE'S ACTUALLY WORKING ON A DIFFERENT DESIGN TO ALLEVIATE SOME OF THE CONCERNS.
UM, MAINLY STEP BACK TO THE BAG PROPERTY PROPERTY.
UH, AND THEN WE'VE ALSO LOOKED AT THE SA PROPERTY.
UH, MY BACKGROUND, UH, FOR SOME OF THE BOARD MEMBERS THAT DOESN'T, DOESN'T KNOW ME VERY WELL AND I'M PRIMARILY AN EXCAVATING CONTRACTOR, LIFELONG RESIDENT, AND SECOND GENERATION CONTRACTOR, I AM VERY COMFORTABLE GOING OUT IN A FIELD OR ON A SITE AND GIVING YOU A GENERAL EVALUATION OF, YOU KNOW, HOW TO BUILD A PAD.
YOU KNOW, BUILDING PAD, SHOOTING PAD, YOU KNOW HOW TO CONSTRUCT A PARKING LOT.
UM, I'M ALSO A SHOOTER, UH, NOT AN EXPERT SHOOTER.
I AM A PROFESSIONAL EXCAVATING CONTRACTOR, BUT I'M NOT A PROFESSIONAL SHOOTER.
BUT I DO HAVE BASIC UNDERSTANDING FIREARMS AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
UH, DOES IT MAKE ME THE SOLE EXPERT ON THE MATTER? BUT I DO FEEL VERY COMFORTABLE IN LENDING MY PERSPECTIVE AS A CONTRACTOR.
ALL THE BIGGEST CONCERN THAT I HAD WITH THE BENTONVILLE SITE.
BUT CABLING MAY BE A GOOD IDEA.
I'M LIKE YOU ON THE PENNY PITCH SIDE, ESPECIALLY AFTER Y'ALL TALKING ABOUT O BUDGET CONCERNS EARLIER IN THE MEETING AT.
BUT DEFINITELY HAVE TO SEE THE COSTING ON THAT BEFORE I SPENT THAT MONEY.
BUT, UH, THAT'S YOUR DECISION, NOT MINE, OF COURSE.
IT WAS A SETBACK TO THE BAGLEY.
SO I MEAN, THEY HAD SOME SAFETY CONCERNS.
UH, VERY SAFE BUILD EARTH AND BURN.
UH, PEOPLE MAY FEEL DIFFERENT ABOUT IT.
MY PROFESSIONAL, MY PERSONAL OPINION, UH, EVEN WITH A 30 FOOT TALL BERM, IF THAT WAS THE WALL, I WOULDN'T STAND ON THE OTHER SIDE OF IT UNLESS YOU SHOOT AT ME AT 67 FEET OR WHATEVER IT WAS.
I'M NOT COMFORTABLE WITH THAT.
OH, I'VE SEEN WEIRD STUFF HAPPEN WITH GUNS.
OH, I DON'T THINK THAT'S ENOUGH SETBACK.
THE OTHER THING THAT WE LOOK AT, OH, THEY DID A SOUND TEST, WHICH SCORED VERY WELL AT THE CLOSEST HOME.
ALL BUT THE BAG RIDGE PROPERTY ADJOINING IS NOT DEVELOPED ALL.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR CURRENT PLANS IN IT.
I'VE HEARD EVERYTHING FROM HOUSE DEVELOPMENT TO A HUNTING CLUB ALL AND I THINK ALL THAT'S TO BE CONSIDERED.
BUT TRUTH BE NONE, THAT'S NONE OF OUR BUSINESS WHAT MR. BAGLEY'S GONNA DO WITH HIS PROPERTY.
ALL THE FACT REMAINS THAT 67 FEET IS TOO CLOSE.
IF YOU DID TO STAY ON TEST AREA, IT WOULD OBVIOUSLY FAIL.
UH, SO A NEW DESIGN, YOU KNOW, IT'S A LOT OF LAND THERE.
UH, UH, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING SOME OF THE OTHER COUNTIES ARE USING A LANDFILL AS A, UH, AS A GOOD SPOT.
'CAUSE UH, WHEN I PICTURE A SHOOTING RANGE, ALL IF YOU THINK AS AN AIRPORT RUNWAY, ALL YOU'VE GOT
[02:00:01]
THE RUNWAY VERY DEFINED, WHICH YOU ALLOW A LITTLE BIT IN FRONT OF THE RUNWAY AND A LITTLE BIT OUT OF THE RUNWAY IN CASE THE PLANE CRASHES.IT'S PROBABLY NOT GOING TO CRASH ALL.
BUT YOU STILL HAVE TO ALLOW THAT SAFETY, THAT SAFETY NET IN THERE.
UM, AND THEN, AND THEN THE SOUND FOR THE PIECE TOO.
SO IF SHE'S GOT A NEW PLAN THAT THAT SETS IT AWAY AND IT'S NOT POINTED AT THEM.
THE ESA SITE, I DID GO UP AND WALK IT MYSELF, UH, WITH THE SHERIFF.
UH, I FOUND WHAT I THINK IS TWO PRETTY GOOD SITES.
UH, THE, THE BIGGEST CONCERN WOULD BE THE SOUND TEST.
UH, THE PROBLEM WITH THE BENTONVILLE SITE, UM, I KNOW THAT, I KNOW YOU COULD DO A LOT OF WORK WITH GIS AND SITTING ON THE COMPUTER, WHICH I'M NOT VERY GOOD AT, I'LL GLADLY ADMIT.
UM, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE HOUSING AROUND THE BENTONVILLE SITE, IT WAS ONLY 67 HOUSES OR SOMETHING IN A MILE RADIUS.
BUT THE PROBLEM IS THE SHOTGUN SPLATTER.
OH, THE ESA SITE HAD A MUCH HIGHER DENSITY, BUT ALL THE HOUSES ARE ON ONE SITE AND YOU'D BE SHOOTING AWAY FROM IT.
AND, UH, AFTER WALKIN'S SITE PERSONALLY, IT'S NOT OPEN AND FLAT.
THE ACTUAL SITE THAT I STEPPED INTO, UH, FROM WHERE I WAS STANDING, IT WAS LITERALLY UPHILL ON THREE SIDES OF ME.
IT WAS PROBABLY 28 FEET ELEVATION BEHIND ME AND 30 PLUS TO THE RIGHT INTO THE SHOOTING RANGE.
UH, IT WAS A LITTLE BIT OF AN OPEN HOL POINTED OVER TOWARDS HIGH KNOB, WHICH I THINK IS A MILE AWAY.
THE, UH, THE PART THAT I WAS UPSET ABOUT IS, UH, YOU KNOW, I CAN'T, IS IT'D BE ILLEGAL FOR ALL FIVE OF US PLANNERS TO GO UP AND, AND LOOK AT IT TOGETHER UNLESS IT'S A PUBLIC THING.
BUT I DID REACH OUT TO KAYLEE 'CAUSE UH, SHE HAD A LOT OF CONCERN BECAUSE THE BENTONVILLE SITES IN HER DISTRICT IS VERY HOT TOPIC.
SO I THOUGHT IT WAS IMPORTANT TO NOTIFY HER, ACTUALLY CALLED MS CALL.
UM, SHE SAID SHE WAS GONNA REACH OUT TO MR. BUTLER.
I'M GLAD TO SEE SHE'S HERE AND, AND FEELING MUCH BETTER.
DALEY TO SEE ABOUT BUSH HOG IN SIGHT AND I WAS TERRIBLY DISAPPOINTED THAT I WAS KIND OF STONEWALLED AT ALL.
WE'VE HAVE OFFERED THAT SERVICE FOR FREE.
UH, I HAVE ALL THE INSURANCES.
I WORK AT THE SANITARY DISTRICT, UH, PUSHING SNOW.
I'D BE WILLING TO OFFER FRESH VOUCHERS.
UH, ME GOING UP TO, YOU KNOW, UH, IN OTHER WORDS, I WAS GLAD I WENT FIRST AND THEY DIDN'T COME BECAUSE I WALK IN IT EVERY DAY.
YOU KNOW, IT'S, IT'S PART OF MY JOB TO EVALUATE SITES TO DO EXCAVATING CONSTRUCTION WORK.
I DON'T THINK IT'S FIT FOR THEM TO BE WALKING IN WAIST HIGH BRIERS AND WEEDS ALL.
DALEY THOUGHT IT WAS INAPPROPRIATE FOR ME TO, TO DO THAT WORK.
BUT I WOULD LIKE TO ASK THE BOARD'S PERMISSION TO GO UP AND DO SOME OF THE PRELIMINARY WORK ALL.
AND I'M NOT AGAINST THE STUDY PERIOD, YOU KNOW, OR HAVING A THIRD PARTY COME IN AND LOOK AT IT.
BUT I, I SAY BEFORE YOU SPEND THE MONEY, WE DO A LITTLE MORE EVALUATION OURSELF.
AND THEN THE MOST CRITICAL THING THAT YOU CAN DO WITHOUT A STUDY THAT I THINK THE STUDY PEOPLE WOULD NEED TO MAKE A CONCLUSION IS THE SOUND TEST.
UM, SO IF WE GO UP AND WE BUSH HOG AND CLEAN THE ES, UH, ESA SITE UP WHERE WE CAN WALK THROUGH IT, I CAN STAKE OUT A COUPLE, COUPLE PLOTS THAT I THINK WILL WORK.
OH, I THINK MR. BROGAN OFFERED HIS SERVICE.
HE COULD GO UP AND PIN IT DOWN FOR US SO THAT YOU COULD PUT IT ON A PLAT AND EVERYBODY COULD SEE IT FOR THOSE THAT DIDN'T WANNA GO ON THE SITE.
BUT I WOULD, UH, I GUESS I NEED PERMISSION TO DO THAT FROM THE BOARD.
DALEY FELT THAT, I'M NOT SURE WHAT HE FELT.
HE DIDN'T REALLY GIMME A REASON, BUT I THINK IT'D BE MORE APPROPRIATE WHY WE'RE HERE TO DISCUSS THAT AND SEE HOW Y'ALL FEEL ABOUT IT.
WELL, I, I, YOU KNOW, BOTH OF THOSE SITES ARE IN SOUTH RIVER DISTRICT AND, AND I'M MORE THAN WILLING, I HATED, WELL I HATED BEING SICK 'CAUSE I DON'T LIKE BEING SICK.
BUT, UM, THAT IT DIDN'T WORK OUT FOR ME TO GET UP THERE.
AND I DON'T CARE ABOUT TRAVIS AND THROUGH BRIERS.
I DO IT ON THE FARM ALL THE TIME.
BUT, UM, I DO WANT IT TO LET YOU KNOW THAT, UM, I ACTUALLY WENT TO THE GEORGE WORTON NATIONAL FOREST HEADQUARTER TODAY TO ASK THEM DIRECTLY IF THERE WAS ANY WAY WE COULD ACCESS THE NATIONAL FOREST PROPERTY AS, UH, AN AREA.
'CAUSE I, I WANNA KNOW, I'VE DONE MY DUE DILIGENCE OF TRYING TO FIGURE OUT ANYTHING, ANYWHERE THAT COULD WORK BEFORE SPENDING ANY MONEY ON A STUDY.
'CAUSE I DON'T LIKE DOING THAT.
UM, THEY'RE A HARD NO, I REACHED OUT TO THE SHENANDOAH NATIONAL PARK.
UM, I DID ASK, BECAUSE THE QUESTION HAS COME UP IN THE PAST ABOUT, UM, WHETHER THE PARK WOULD
[02:05:01]
HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE BENTONVILLE SITE BECAUSE OF THE AESTHETICS OF BEING UP ON THE DRIVE.UM, HE'S GOTTA GET BACK WITH ME ON THAT AND, UM, BECAUSE IT'S DOESN'T TOUCH THEIR PROPERTY LINE.
SO, UM, THAT I CAN'T GIVE YOU AN ANSWER TO.
UM, AND I JUST, YOU KNOW, THE SHERIFF NEEDS THIS AND WE'VE KICKED IT DOWN THE ROAD AND WE'VE KICKED IT DOWN THE ROAD.
AND I, YOU KNOW, WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH THIS FOR SIX PLUS MONTHS AND I JUST THINK WE'RE GONNA BE ANOTHER YEAR AND WE'RE STILL TRYING TO FIGURE THIS OUT.
SO, AND IT'S BEEN MENTIONED THAT THERE'S, I MEAN, MR. JENKINS THOUGHT I WAS COLLUDING BECAUSE I WENT UP, I DO MY, THAT DUE DILIGENCE FOR EVERYTHING.
BUT IF THE, IF THE PERCEPTION OF THE COMMUNITY IS THAT WE ARE SOMEHOW FRIENDS AND WE ARE JUST, YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE WE'RE FRIENDS, WE'RE GIVEN INTO THIS, THEN THAT NEEDS TO BE WIPED OFF THE BOARD.
AND THAT'S WHY I THINK GETTING AN OUTSIDE STUDY WILL ALLEVIATE THAT.
IT'S SOMEONE THAT HAS NO DOG IN THE FIGHT, EXCEPT THAT'S THEIR JOB.
THEY COME IN, THEY EVALUATE AND THEY SAY, WE'VE LOOKED AT EVERYTHING.
AND THAT TAKES ALL THAT, WHO KNOWS WHO, WHO'S DOING WHAT FAVORS AND ALL THAT OFF THE TABLE.
SO, UM, AND, AND YOU KNOW, I, I'M OPEN FOR, I MEAN THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.
IT'S NOT CHERYL HAVING HER WAY JUST 'CAUSE IT'S HER DISTRICT.
I JUST FEEL LIKE THAT TO ME IS THE FAIR AND EASIEST WAY FOR EVERYONE TO ACCEPT WHATEVER THE FINAL RESULT IS.
AND I TELL YOU, I HAVE, I'VE, YOU KNOW, CAMP SEVEN, I WISH WE HAD KNOWN CAMP SEVEN WAS GONNA BE UP FOR SALE.
THAT WOULD'VE BEEN THE PERFECT PLACE FOR IT.
BUT THAT'S WATER UNDER THE BRIDGE AND THE, AND THE FINAL RESULT IS THE SHERIFF STILL HAS TO GET THESE GUYS QUALIFIED.
SO WE CAN'T KEEP KICKING IT DOWN THE ROAD FOREVER.
IF I, IF I MAY, UM, EVEN IF WE PAY FOR STUDIES, WELL, THEY'RE NOT GONNA BE HAPPY.
NO, THERE WILL BE NO ACCEPTANCE BY, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER, WHEREVER IT ENDS UP.
NOW I HAVE, UH, TO, TO, UM, RESPOND OR TACK ONTO, TO MR. HENRY'S COMMENTS.
FIRST OF ALL, WHAT WOULD IT COST? SECONDLY, WHAT WOULD THEY DO? AND IF WE KNOW WHAT THEY WOULD DO, THEN CAN WE DO THAT? I MEAN, MY, MY COST IS ZERO, RIGHT? THERE IS NO COST.
WELL, I MEAN, WHAT WOULD, IT'S JUST INFORMATION.
WHAT WOULD, WHAT WOULD A A, A THIRD PARTY THAT WAS PAID TO DO A STUDY, DO NOTICE IF WE COULD, IF WE HAD THAT INFORMATION ROUGHLY OR, OR MAYBE NOT ROUGHLY, MAYBE ACCURATELY, THAT THEN ASSESS AS A COMMISSION, AS A PLANNING COMMISSION, IS THE CAPABILITY THERE TO DO THAT LEVEL OF WORK? BECAUSE I THINK IT'S A MATTER OF, UM, THE, THE STRUCTURE BEING KNOWN BY EVERYBODY AT THE OUTSET.
ALL THE PARAMETERS BEING KNOWN BY EVERYBODY AT THE OUTSET.
THAT THE, YOU KNOW, THE VALUATION BA CRITERIA FOR EACH ITEM BEING AT THE OUTSET.
SO IF, IF IT'S TOO, AND, AND THIS IS NO SLIGHT ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION OR THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, BUT IF IT'S TOO MUCH WORK FOR A VOLUNTEER PLANNING COMMISSION TO DO, THEN MAYBE IT MAKES SENSE TO HIRE A PROFESSIONAL FIRM TO DO IT.
BUT WITHOUT KNOWING, LIKE HOW WOULD THEY STRUCTURE IT? WHY DON'T WE STRUCTURE IT LIKE THEY STRUCTURE IT? I MEAN, UM, TO, BUT WHAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS ON THE GROUND STUFF HAPPENING AT AN ALTERNATIVE.
I MEAN, JUST A SIDE EVALUATION.
JUST, JUST BUSH HOS SOME WEEDS DOWN.
TAKE A FEW MEASUREMENTS, A FEW ELEVATIONS, PUT IT ON A PIECE OF PAPER, WHOEVER'S DOING EVALUATION, YOU CAN HAND IT ON TO THEM ALL.
AND, AND THE, THE, THE, THE FREE STUFF THAT YOU COULD DO ON THE FRONT END, LIKE THE SOUND TEST ALL, I MEAN, I THINK THAT'S GONNA BE A VITAL PIECE OF INFORMATION FOREVER TO DO ON THE STUDY.
'CAUSE IF WE GO UP THERE AND BUSH HOG IT, AND I THINK IT'LL, I THINK IT'S GONNA BE GREAT BECAUSE OF THE TOPOGRAPHY, YOU KNOW, THE, THE WAY THE HILLS ARE.
BUT YOU NEVER KNOW FOR SURE UNTIL YOU DO IT.
WHAT, WHAT HOLLOW'S GONNA CREATE AN ECHO AND THE SOUND'S GONNA BOUNCE OVER.
SO IF THE CLOSEST HOUSE TO SOUND IBLE IS, YOU KNOW, BELOW 50 AGAINST AN ACCEPTABLE LEVEL, I THINK YOU COULD MOVE FORWARD WITH PAYING SOMEBODY MORE PROFESSIONAL.
IF WE DO THE SOUND TEST AND IT'S A HUNDRED DECIBELS, I WOULDN'T WASTE MY MONEY.
I MEAN THAT'S JUST, YOU KNOW, I I JUST WANT TO DO THE FREE STUFF FIRST.
[02:10:01]
I I I THINK THERE'S, THERE'S, THAT MAKES SENSE TO ME.I, AND I, THERE'S NEWS SHINE ON THAT.
I THINK PEOPLE AREN'T CAPABLE IN OUR SYSTEM, BUT MY PERCEPTION IS NOT THE PERCEPTION OF THE COMMUNITY NECESSARILY.
AND THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO BRIDGE HERE, TO BE RESPECTFUL OF THEM.
UM, AND I GOTTA SAY IT, MR. JENKINS, IT'S NOT BECAUSE YOU COME UP HERE AND GAVE ME A HARD TIME, I CAN TAKE IT.
UM, I'M JUST, I, I WANNA BE FAIR.
SO I WILL JUST TELL YOU, COMING UP HERE, ACTING LIKE YOU DID, DIDN'T DO YOU ANY GOOD.
EVEN IF YOU'VE NEVER SET FOOT IN THE ROOM, SIR.
UM, AND I'M, I'M GOOD WITH, YOU KNOW, THAT'S MAJORITY OF THE VOTE HERE, BUT I JUST, I NEED TO HAVE MY PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT.
AND I'M TRYING TO MEET IN THE MIDDLE HERE OF WHAT I'VE HEARD THAT, UM, THEY WOULD FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE IF THERE WAS AN OUTSIDE LOOKING IN DOING THIS VERSUS THE INSIDE DOING IT.
AND, AND I DIDN'T MEAN TO STEP ON THAT, SAY THAT'S ON.
I WASN'T TRYING TO SAY OH NO, I'M JUST SAYING IF THERE'S A RE ON RAMP TO THAT, WHICH ABSOLUTELY.
AND I, AND I RESPECT EVERYBODY.
HAVE HEALTHY CONVERSATION WHERE WE RESPECT EACH OTHER'S THOUGHT PROCESS AND COME OUT AT THE END WITH SOMETHING HOPEFULLY WE CAN ALL LIVE WITH AND STILL BE ABLE TO HAVE QUALIFIED OFFICERS AT THE END OF THE YEAR.
AND, AND ONE OF THE THINGS IS THE, THAT'S, THAT'S A CHALLENGE I RECOGNIZE IT, IS THAT, UH, MANY, MANY QUESTIONS COME UP THAT, THAT ARE RATIONAL.
THAT, YOU KNOW, I HAVE QUESTIONS FROM CONSTITUENTS THAT NOT NECESSARILY MY DISTRICT, THEY'RE JUST PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY THAT HAVE QUESTIONS AND THEY'RE VERY DETAILED AND THEY'RE VERY WELL RESEARCHED, AND I DON'T HAVE THE ANSWERS.
AND, AND IT'S, I CAN'T, I THINK THEY, THEY SOMEHOW ANSWERS HAVE TO BE PROVIDED.
UM, THEY CAN'T BE JUST, WELL, I, WE NEVER GOT AROUND TO THAT, OR WE DIDN'T HAVE TIME OR, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER.
SO IT'S DIFFICULT PROCESS BECAUSE IT'S A HARD HIGH VOLUME OF RESEARCH AND FACTORS AND ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF, WHICH MAY BE TILTING US BACK TOWARDS THE, THE CONSULTANT.
BUT, UH, I DON'T, I DON'T, I JUST, I'M SORRY I'M TALKING TOO MUCH, BUT, BUT JUST WANT TO END WITH THE IDEA THAT HIRING A CONSULTANT DOESN'T NECESSARILY SOLVE A PROBLEM.
I'M NOT, I'M NOT, AND I'M NOT SAYING YOU THINK IT DOES.
BUT JUST FOR US ALL TO BE, HAVE OUR EYES OPEN ON, ON THAT.
AND I DO RESPECT THE WORK THAT THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, UH, THE SHERIFF AND, AND EVERYONE THAT WAS INVOLVED WITH, YOU'VE DONE A LOT OF WORK.
WELL, WELL, I UNDERSTAND WHERE MS. KOHLER'S IS COMING FROM BECAUSE SHE WANTS TO MAKE SURE THAT, THAT, UH, PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THAT IF, IF WE DO HAVE A, A PROFESSIONAL FIRM COMING IN, THAT, UH, SHE WANTS TO NOLL OUT ANY BIAS THAT THERE, THAT THERE MAY BE.
SO THE, UH, SO THAT PEOPLE FEEL THAT WELL, EVERYBODY GOT THE, THE SAME LOOK AND THAT THERE WAS NOBODY WHO WAS, UH, UH, FAVORED OVER ANYBODY ELSE BECAUSE THESE PEOPLE THEY DON'T KNOW WAS FROM BOO.
IF, IF WE DID THE CONSULTANT, YOU HAVE THE PROCESS OR THE QUESTIONS.
HOW DID YOU PICK THE CONSULTANT? DID SOMEONE KNOW THEM? YOU KNOW,
BUT I, I WANTED TO ALSO SAY, I THINK EVERYONE ON ALL SIDES OF THIS HAVE DONE A LOT OF WORK AND I APPRECIATE THE PLANNING COMMISSION HAS DONE A TON OF WORK.
THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE HAS DONE A TON OF WORK, AND THE OPPONENTS OF THIS HAVE DONE A TON OF WORK.
UM, SO IT, IN A WAY, IT BRINGS US BACK TO WHERE WE ARE, WHICH IS, YOU KNOW, THERE, THERE'S NO EASY ANSWER TO THIS RIGHT NOW.
I DO THINK, UM, IT'S WORTH LOOKING MORE AT ESA LANE.
I MEAN, I, I KNOW IT MIGHT COST MORE TO BUILD A RANGE THERE AND THAT, THAT IS A ISSUE WE HAVE TO CONSIDER.
SO THAT'S SOMETHING WE NEED TO, WE NEED NUMBERS FOR THAT.
I DIDN'T INTERRUPT YOU BEING ON THE CONSIDERABLY LESS DIRT THERE.
UH, KEEPING ME HONEST ON THAT.
UM, THESE ARE ALL THE DATA POINTS WE NEED.
WHAT WE NEED IS A RIGOROUS COMPARISON AND THE, THE SHERIFF'S OFFICE HAS DONE SOME GOOD WORK COMPARING THINGS, BUT WE WEREN'T NECESSARILY THERE ALONG FOR THE JOURNEY OF THAT.
AND I THINK SOME OF THE BACK BACKGROUND TO SOME OF THOSE DATA POINTS, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT MORE THAT WE WOULD WANT TO KNOW.
UM, I COULD SEE THE CONSULTANT IDEA WORKING IF WE HAVE AN OFFER ON THE TABLE TO, TO TIDY UP ESA SO IT'S FIT FOR A SOUND TEST AND, AND, YOU KNOW, SOME BETTER KIND OF
[02:15:01]
ENVISIONING OF HOW IT ALL MIGHT LAY OUT THAT, THAT MIGHT BE HELPFUL IF HE'S BONDED, INSURED AND READY TO ROLL WITH THAT FOR FREE.I, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH THAT.
UM, SO, SO THE PLANNING COMMISSION, EACH MEMBER AND THE BOARD, EACH MEMBER ARE THE JURY, NOT THE PROSECUTOR.
IF YOU WOULD, LIKE, IF THE JURY SAYS WE WOULD LIKE TO LOOK AT ESL LANE SITE, WE WILL GET THAT CLEAN AND WE WILL HAVE THAT READY FOR YOU TO GO LOOK AT.
IF I MAY, I, I, I'VE BEEN AT THE SITE, 'CAUSE, UM, TWO YEARS AGO WHEN THE FORMER SHERIFF CAME IN AND WANTED TO, TO BUILD THE, THE TRAINEE, YOU KNOW, HE WENT THROUGH THE WHOLE THING AS WELL.
CAME TO BETTONVILLE AND THEN THE THEN BOARD AT THAT TIME DID NOT WANT TO PURSUE BECAUSE OF ALL THE ISSUES THAT HAVE BEEN BRINGING UP.
YOU KNOW, WE NEVER GOT THAT FAR.
I THEN I WENT BACK AND WATCHED THAT MEETING AND THAT, THAT'S NOT CORRECT.
WE GAVE DIRECTIVE OF BRINGING US MORE.
ONE OF THE THINGS WAS WHO OWNS CAT LIT MOUNTAIN BECAUSE IT'S A TOWN COUNTY AND I'M NOT SURE WHY, BUT IT WAS NEVER BROUGHT BACK.
SO IT JUST DROPPED OFF THE MAP.
WE NEVER VOTED ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
IT WAS ALL DONE THROUGH WORK SESSIONS AND DISCUSSIONS.
SO ANY EVENT, SO WHEN THAT, WHEN, WHEN THE DISCUSSION WENT AWAY FROM THE BENTONVILLE SITE, IT WAS ESLA AND IF I RECALL CORRECTLY, WHEN THAT WAS BROUGHT TO US, THERE SEEMED TO BE SOME, UM, AGREEMENT TO PURSUE TO LOOK AT THAT SITE.
AND THEN, AND THEN IT NEVER CAME BACK.
YOU KNOW, IT DIDN'T COME BACK TO US.
UM, I HAVE NO PROBLEM WITH MR. HENRY GOING OUT THERE AND LOOKING AT THE SITE.
I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, I, I KNOW THERE'S GONNA BE NOT IN MY BACKYARD, BUT, UM, BUT I THINK WITH THE OPTIONS THAT THE SHERIFF HAD PRESENTED AS YOU, WHEN YOU DID THAT LITTLE MATRIX, YOU KNOW, UM, WHERE IT WAS BENTONVILLE AND THEN YOU HAD ESL AND THEN I THINK YOU DID BEHIND THE, UM, RSWI MEAN, THERE WERE DIFFERENT SITES.
I I, I'M SORRY I DON'T REMEMBER ALL OF THEM.
YOU KNOW, THAT THAT WOULD, THAT WAS THE NEXT SITE TO LOOK AT.
AND I THINK WE SHOULD AT LEAST, YOU KNOW, UM, YOU KNOW, TO SAVE SOME MONEY.
YOU KNOW, I HAVE TOTAL CONFIDENCE IN MR. HENRY'S ABILITY TO GO OUT AND, AND LOOK AT IT.
AND, AND, AND, AND HE HAS A VERY GOOD POINT WITH THE DECIMAL READING, YOU KNOW.
BUT, UM, SO ANYWAY, THAT, THAT I, I, I HAVE NO PROBLEM OF PURSUING TO SEE IF THAT'S A VIABLE OPTION, YOU KNOW, INTERNALLY, I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW HOW THE COMMUNITY FEELS ABOUT THAT.
WE NEED TO HAVE A THIRD PARTY TO DO ALL OF THIS, BUT THE, THIS IS MY 2 CENTS, YOU KNOW, SO I I I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, WE CAN CONTINUE ON AND, AND DOCTORS DALEY SEEN AS INDICATED TWICE NOW THAT, THAT THEY WOULD GET IT TAKEN CARE OF.
I DON'T CARE IF THE COUNTY BUSH OFFS IT, BUT I'M GONNA HAVE TO GO UP AND SHOW 'EM WHERE YEP.
AND I MEAN, IT'S AN IDEAL SITE BECAUSE YOU HAVE THE, UM, FIRE AND RESCUE HAS THEIR LITTLE CAN, UH, BUILDING OUT THERE THAT THEY DO THERE.
I MEAN, I THINK, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, MS. MEADOWS GAVE US A LONG TERM, UM, GOALS, AND ONE OF IT WAS IN FIVE YEARS TO HAVE AN, A TRAINING FACILITY IN FIVE YEARS THAT WAS BETWEEN THE, YOU KNOW, THE SHERIFF AND THE FIRE AND RESCUE.
SO THIS WOULD BE THE FIRST STEP, YOU KNOW, IF IT TURNS OUT TO BE A GOOD LOCATION, YOU KNOW, TO EXPAND ON OUR, OUR LONG-TERM GOAL, YOU KNOW, OF EVENTUALLY HAVING A, UM, INTEROPERABLE, YOU KNOW, TRAINING FACILITY.
SO, SO ANY EVENT, SO I, I, YOU KNOW, I HAVE NO ISSUE WITH, UM, MR. HENRY GOING OUT THERE AND, AND TAKING A LOOK WITH THE SHERIFF AND EVERYONE ELSE TO SEE IF THAT'S A, A VIABLE, UM, LOCATION.
I'LL GO WHEREVER IS SUGGESTED.
UM, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE DO OUR, OUR DUE DILIGENCE TO THE, THE END.
AND, AND THAT'S ALL I THINK WE HAVE EV EVENTUALLY WE END UP WITH THE FACILITY THAT'S GONNA BE SERVING THE COUNTY FOR 20, 30, 40, 50 YEARS.
SO IN THAT SENSE, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S WORTH THE TIME.
BUT ON THE OTHER HAND, SHERIFF HAS
[02:20:01]
DEPUTIES THAT AREN'T GETTING TRAINED.SO, UH, THERE'S, IT'S VERY FRUSTRATING.
THERE'S NO, THERE'S NO TIMELINE THAT WORKS APPARENTLY.
BUT YEAH, TIMELINE IS IMPORTANT MORE THAN YOU THINK.
ALL THE, UH, THE, THE SITE THAT WORKS, THE, THE TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT IS VERY BASIC.
IT, I MEAN, IT'S A VERY BASIC NEEDS.
I MEAN, REALISTICALLY, IT WOULD BE NICE TO HAVE AN INDOOR FACILITY THAT MAYBE YOU COULD RENT OUT TO OTHER MUNICIPALITIES OR COUNTIES, SEVEN TO $10 MILLION.
IF, IF, IF WE AGREED TO DO THAT TODAY AND WE HAD THE MONEY, YOU STEAL THREE TO FIVE YEARS OUT TIME, YOU GET ALL THE ENGINEERING AND PICK A SITE AND ALL THAT STUFF.
OH, ALL EITHER SITE BENTONVILLE OR ESA, IT'S JUST MOVING SOME DIRT.
YOU KNOW, THAT ESA SITE, YOU KNOW, 10 YEARS FROM NOW, OH MAN, THAT'S WHERE WE SHOULD HAVE PUT THIS SCHOOL.
YOU JUST, YOU KNOW, IN OTHER WORDS, THE SITE WILL NOT BE DISTURBED TO THE POINT THAT IT'D NEVER BE ABLE TO USED FOR ANYTHING ELSE.
OH, NOW, LATER, I'M NOT SAYING YOU COULDN'T PUT THAT INDOOR FACILITY UP THERE, SOMETHING WITH THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, BUT, UH, MS. CLAN HAS WORKED VERY HARD.
UH, SHE MAY HAVE EVEN TWISTED HER HUSBAND'S ARM JUST A LITTLE BIT AS HE'S AN EXCAVATING CONTRACTOR.
AND, UH, HE'S, HE'S AGREED TO DONATE A GOOD BIT OF THE WORK, AND I'VE AGREED TO HELP.
UM, THE BIGGEST RE I WASN'T REALLY, WASN'T TOO BIG A CONCERN ALL BUT AFTER THE PRESENTATION, AND THEN I FOLLOWED UP WITH SOME QUESTIONS WITH HER, THE Y'ALL, THE GOING TO HARPER FERRY AND SHOOTING AT THE TARGET DOES MEET THE MINIMUM QUALIFICATIONS, BUT THAT IS NOT THE SAME THING AS TRAINED OR, SO, YOU KNOW, IF, IF YOU WERE GOING TO TRAIN A HOT SCENE, IN OTHER WORDS, YOU KNOW, YOU WERE GONNA HAVE TO GET OUTTA THE CAR AND USE THE CAR AS A SHIELD AND SHOOT OVER THE CAR AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
IT'D BE STUFF THAT WE COULD, THEY COULD DO TO.
WHEREAS RIGHT NOW THEY'RE WALKING UP TO A SHOOTING RANGE AND SHOOTING AT A, A PAPER TARGET ON IS WHERE THAT GETS TO BE SERIOUS.
GOD FORBID WE'D GET AN ACTIVE SHOOTER AT A SCHOOL OR AT ONE OF THESE BUILDINGS, AND THESE PEOPLE HAVE NO OVERLAP TRAINING WITH THE SWAT TEAM AT THE COUNTY AND THE STATE IN THE, UH, LOCAL POLICE DEPARTMENT.
YOU KNOW, I COULD SEE EVERYBODY TRYING TO RESPOND WITH NO CROSS TRAINING.
UH, AT THAT POINT, YOU'RE NO LONGER SHOOTING AT A PAPER TARGET.
UM, SO AT SOME POINT, Y'ALL, AND THIS, AND I'D ALSO, AS FAR AS TIME, THIS WOULD BE THE THIRD SHERIFF THAT HAS MENTIONED THE SHOOTING RANCH.
UH, I'D SAY IN MR. MCKEE'S TERM, IT WAS A NEED, BUT NOT AS BIG A NEED.
NOW, I, I HATE TO BE THIS WAY, BUT THE WORLD IS CHANGING FOR THE WORST, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, 15 YEARS AGO, I, I'D NEVER HEARD THE NEWS GUY ON NEWS TV SAY ACTIVE SHOOTER AT A SCHOOL.
RIGHT? I MEAN, I'D NEVER HEARD THOSE WORDS BEFORE THERE BEFORE, BUT NOW THAT'S, I'M FEARFUL TO SAY THAT WE HEAR THAT ONCE IN A WHILE.
SO THE, UH, THE NEED HAS INCREASED.
UM, AND THEN I THINK WE'RE GETTING A LITTLE YOUNGER FORCE.
SOME OF THE GUYS LESS EXPERIENCED ARE PROBABLY MOVING ON.
UH, THAT ALSO MAKES TRAINING MORE CRITICAL.
AND THEN, UH, IF WE KICK A CAN DOWN THE ROAD TOO FAR, AND WE, WE'D ALL BE A LITTLE GUILTY, A LITTLE LIABLE FOR NOT PUSHING HARD ENOUGH TO GET THIS DONE.
SO I, SO TIME, TIME IS, IS VERY IMPORTANT.
IF, IF WE, IF WE GET THIS APPROVED, I MEAN, IT COULD EVEN BE TREATED AS A TEMPORARY 'CAUSE WE'RE JUST MOVING A LITTLE DIRT.
ONE, IT'S SAFE, ONE IT FUNCTIONAL, BUT WE DON'T NEED $10 MILLION IN BELLS AND WHISTLES TO GET REASONABLY TRAINED ALL, AND THEN WE GET THAT MUCH IN PLACE.
AND THEN A BETTER PLAN GOING FORWARD IS BETTER, YOU KNOW, AT, AT THAT TIME, YOU KNOW, FINANCE IS AVAILABLE, YOU KNOW, AND MAYBE, MAYBE THE NEED INCREASES AS TIME GOES ON TOO.
SO I, I JUST THOUGHT I'D MENTION TIME AS A, AS A LITTLE BIT OF A FACTOR.
LIKE A PHASE I, I KNOW, I KNOW I'M KIND OF LIKING WHAT I'M HEARING ABOUT.
IF HE WAS WILLING TO GO UP AND BUSH HOG THE AREA SO WE CAN SEE WHAT WE HAVE, AND THEN GET A BASIC LAYOUT, THEN DO SOME OF THE THINGS WE CAN DO, LIKE A SOUND CHECK AS FAR AS A CONSULTANT, THEY WOULD BE AN UNBIASED DECISION.
AND I REALIZE THERE'S SOME MONEY TO SPEND, BUT WHEN YOU PRORATE THAT OVER A 40, 40 TO 50 YEAR LIFE EXPECTANCY OF THIS, YOU'RE NOT TALKING A LOT.
TO THE POINT, THERE'S A COUPLE THINGS THAT WERE BROUGHT UP THAT I, I FEEL ARE IMPORTANT.
FIRST OF ALL, MY BACKGROUND, I'M A RETIRED INFANTRY OFFICER, UH, SPECIAL OPS TRAINING IN ANTI-TERRORISM.
I HAVE, WE USED TO GO TO THE RANGE AND FIRE, WE DIDN'T TAKE 40 ROUNDS WITH US.
WE TOOK 10,000 ROUNDS FOR 36 GUYS.
SO I GOT A LOT OF EXPERIENCE ON RANGES ACROSS EUROPE AND THE EASTERN UNITED STATES.
I ALSO WAS PICKED AT ONE POINT TO BE IN MANEUVER IN TRAINING, UH, UH, PART OF THE COMMAND FOR
[02:25:01]
DESERT STORM, WHERE EVERY SINGLE COMBAT ARMS UNIT WENT, WAS GOING OVER TO DESERT STORM, HAD TO BE EVALUATED BY OUR UNIT.SO WITH THAT BACKGROUND, I THINK WE'RE LOOKING TOO SMALL.
THIS IS A START, IS WHAT YOU'VE HEARD HERE.
BUT WHEN YOU GO ONLINE AND YOU LOOK AT, UH, LIFE SAFETY AND LAW ENFORCEMENT, JOINT TRAINING, YOU KNOW, LET'S GO BACK TO 1981, WHEN THE ARMY FINALLY REALIZED THAT COMBINED ARMS TRAINING WAS NEEDED BECAUSE THE INFANTRY WASN'T TRAINING WITH ARMOR.
SO CONSEQUENTLY, WHEN WE GOT OUT THERE ON THE FIELD, WE DIDN'T KNOW WHAT THE ARMOR WAS GONNA DO, AND THEY DIDN'T KNOW WHAT WE WERE GONNA DO.
CONSEQUENTLY, WE LOST SOLDIERS ON BOTH SIDES, BECAUSE TANKS HAVE A CHANCE, UH, WHEN THEY RUN OVER BODIES, THEY KIND OF FLATTEN YOU OUT, UH, AND BELIEVE IT.
THE, UH, WHEN YOU GO TO, WHEN DOING THE RESEARCH, RICHMOND, INDIANA HAS A COMBINED TRAINING SITE, RALEIGH, NORTH CAROLINA.
NOW ATLANTA HAS GOT A LOT MORE MONEY THAN WE DO, BUT THEY HAVE A TRAINING CENTER AS WELL.
AND THESE TRAINING CENTERS ARE WHERE FIRE AND POLICE AND LAW ENFORCEMENT CAN WORK TOGETHER ON A BURN BUILDING THAT IS NOT A CONEX BOX, BUT A REAL BUILDING.
UH, WE DON'T HAVE THAT KIND OF MONEY, BUT WE HAVE NEIGHBORING COUNTIES THAT HAVE THE SAME ISSUE WE HAVE.
WHY DON'T WE REACH OUT TO THEM TO WHERE WE CAN GET A TRAINING SITE WHERE THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT AND THE POLICE DEPARTMENT OR, UH, FIRE DEPARTMENT CAN DO EVASIVE TRAIN, UH, EVASIVE DRIVING ON A, UH, A, A TRAINING COURSE.
SO THEIR DRIVE, THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT, THEY NOW KNOW WHAT THE EXTENT OF THE CAPABILITY OF THEIR VEHICLES ARE.
NOW, I DID A LITTLE BIT OF CAR RACING, AND IT'S AMAZING.
YOU KNOW, YOU GET OUT THERE ON THE TRACK, YOU REALIZE WHAT THE LIMITS OF YOUR CAR ARE.
WHEN YOU GET OUT ON THE ROAD, YOU DRIVE SLOWER BECAUSE YOU REALIZE THOSE AROUND.
YOU DON'T KNOW THAT, UH, THE, THE AREAS, RICHMOND, INDIANA HAS 40 ACRES.
UH, THEY SPENT $20 MILLION IN 2002.
HOWEVER, IT'S A REVENUE PRODUCER TODAY BECAUSE THEY'VE ADVANCED IT TO WHERE OTHER COUNTIES ARE USING.
WHAT I'M SUGGESTING IS WE, WE GO TO OUR NEIGHBORING COUNTIES, SEE WHAT THEIR INTEREST IN IS THIS.
THEN NOW WE ARE NOW TRAINING TOGETHER.
THERE'S OPPORTUNITIES WHERE WARREN COUNTY CAN BE TRAINING WITH FREDERICK COUNTY, BECAUSE THERE'S GONNA BE A TIME, AND I THINK WE ALREADY HAD ONE AT THE, UH, TARGET, UH, HOSTAGE SITUATION.
THE, UH, WHERE WE HAD MORE THAN JUST WARREN COUNTY.
WE HAD, UH, THE POLICE, THE CITY POLICE WERE THERE, TOWN POLICE.
AND WE, I KNOW WE HAD STATE, AND I DON'T KNOW WHO ELSE WAS THERE, BUT IT GIVES THEM AN OPPORTUNITY TO TRAIN TOGETHER.
BECAUSE WHAT HAPPENS WHEN THERE IS A SCHOOL SHOOTING OR SOMETHING OF THAT SORT WHERE THERE'S MASH CASUALTY, WHERE NOW THE FIRE DEPARTMENT'S GOTTA WORK WITH POLICE DEPARTMENT AND OUR SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT AND TOWN POLICE ARE PROBABLY TOO SMALL TO HANDLE THAT.
SO WE HAVE NOW OTHER JURISDICTION COMING IN.
DO WE KNOW THE FREQUENCY OF THEIR RADIOS? CAN THEY TALK, CAN WE TALK TO THEM? CAN THEY TALK TO US? OR ARE WE BACK IN THE SITUATION WITH THE HOSTAGE, UH, ATTEMPT IN 1978 WHERE THE NAVY WAS FLYING ARMY CHOPPERS AND THE, UH, AIR FORCE, AND NO ONE HAD ANY COMMUNICATION TOOL WITH ACROSS THE BOARD, BECAUSE NO ONE, NO ONE FIGURED THAT OUT THAT THE AIR FORCE DOESN'T USE THE SAME COMMUNICATION FREQUENCIES AS THE ARMY DID.
SO THAT'S THE KIND OF THING THAT I THINK THIS WOULD HELP.
THE ATLANTA, UH, FIRE DEPARTMENT AND LAW ENFORCEMENT HAVE ACTUALLY HAS A NONPROFIT, UH, ORGANIZATION THAT HELPS, UH, COUNTIES LIKE US TO DEVELOP A TRAINING PROGRAM, OR NOT A TRAINING PROGRAM, BUT A TRAINING SITE THAT IS GONNA BE MEANINGFUL AND HELP THE, THE, THE ENTITIES, BECAUSE YOU DON'T WANT TO TRAIN FOR THE,
[02:30:01]
TO THE MINIMUM STANDARD.YOU WANT TO TRAIN THE, THE OFFICERS IN THE FIRE DEPARTMENT, UH, YOU WANT TO TRAIN THEM TOGETHER FOR THE WORST CASE SCENARIO.
SO WHEN SOMETHING DOES HAPPEN, THEY CAN THINK INDEPENDENTLY AND ALREADY KNOW WHAT THEY NEED TO DO.
IT'S JUST LIKE, HOW MANY OF YOU PLAY PAINTBALL? YEAH.
IF YOU HAVEN'T PLAYED PAINTBALL, IF YOU'RE FIRING BEHIND A, A TARGET OR FIRING AT SOMEBODY FROM BEHIND A CONCEALMENT, AND YOU DON'T MOVE TO THE OTHER SIDE OF THAT, GUESS WHAT? THE NEXT TIME YOU POKE YOUR HEAD OUT, SOMEONE'S GOT A BEAT ON YOU AND YOU GOT A RED.IN THE MIDDLE OF YOUR HEAD.
SO, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT KIND OF THING DOESN'T COME FROM STANDING AT A RANGE SHOOTING AT A PAPER TARGET THAT COMES FROM DOING IT, UH, IN REAL PRACTICE, HARD PRACTICE.
AND I THINK THAT WE'RE MISSING AN OPPORTUNITY.
WE GOT THE REGIONAL JAIL THAT'S WORKING OUT FINE.
WHY CAN'T WE DO MORE WITH OUR NEIGHBORS AND CREATE SOMETHING THAT IS GONNA MAKE IT BETTER FOR EVERYONE AND SAFER.
AND I'M WILLING TO HELP OUT IN ANY WAY.
I THINK THAT'S A GOOD LONG TERM PLAN.
SCOTT, BASED ON YOUR SHOOTING EXPERIENCE, IF I GET THIS BUSH HO DOWN, I'D LIKE TO BRING YOU UP FOR REAL, OR WHO? OH,
AND FOR CLARIFICATION, IF, IF, IF Y'ALL WANT ME TO DO THE SA SITE, DO YOU WANT ME TO BUSH HOG IT OR DO YOU WANT DR. BAILEY HAS COUNTY DO IT? I I, I DON'T CARE.
IT DOESN'T, IT'S, IT'S TWO HOURS WORTH OF WORK.
I, I PERSONALLY DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH YOU DOING IT.
AND I HAVE REACHED OUT, UM, THE ONLY COUNTY I HEARD BACK FROM WAS RAPPAHANNOCK COUNTY AT THIS TIME, AND THEY WOULD BE INTERESTED IN CONVERSATION ON A REGIONAL, IF THAT'S WHERE WE GOT TO.
WELL, WE START WITH THEM AND MOVE ON TO OTHERS.
I THINK THIS THING ABOUT THE BUSH HOGGING STUFF IS, IS, IS LOW LEVEL.
DALEY IS JUST CONCERNED ABOUT SOME, SOME PROTOCOL.
I MEAN, TALKING ABOUT THE JURY AND THE, ALL THAT STUFF.
I MEAN, IT'S JUST, YOU'RE JUST THINKING ABOUT PROTOCOL.
SO YOU WANT THE, THE COUNTY TO DO IT.
PERCEPTION, PERCEPTION AND PROTOCOL.
SO I'D SAY JUST LET'S HAVE THE, HAVE THE COUNTY TAKE CARE OF IT TO, TO, TO THE RECOMMENDATIONS OF WHERE HE WANTS IT DONE.
NO, WELL, YOU KNOW, MY OPINION HE HAS TO GET IT DONE.
MIGHT BE GOOD TOO, BECAUSE THEN IF THERE'S MULTIPLE LOCATIONS, THEY COULD GO AHEAD AND BUSH HOG MULTIPLE.
AND THEN HONESTLY, IF WE'RE DOING A SOUND TEST ANYWAYS, IF THERE ARE MULTIPLE LOCATIONS, WE COULD MOVE AROUND AND WE'RE GONNA PROBABLY GET THE MOST ACCURATE SOUND TEST POSSIBLE BECAUSE THE LEAVES BEING DOWN RIGHT NOW.
SO I WOULD NOT BE OPPOSED IF, UH, IF YOU WANT THE COUNTY TO DO IT, MIKE BERRY'S THE CONTACT.
I WILL TALK TO MR. BERRY SOON.
YEAH, IF YOU'LL HAVE HIM REACH OUT, I'LL GLADLY UH, WELL, I, I'LL SEE WHAT HIS SCHEDULE IS.
IF HE'S OVERWHELMED, I'LL BE GLAD THAT I'VE GOT ALL THE INSURANCE.
I'LL SEND FRESH VOUCHERS SO THERE'D BE NO LIABILITY ON THE COUNTY AND THE CHARGE OF COURSE.
OH, IF HE'S GOT TIME, I, I'LL SHOW HIM THE AREAS AND HE CAN TAKE CARE OF IT.
AND IF HE'S, HE'S REALLY BUSY OR SHORT STAFFED, I'LL CATCH IT ONE AFTERNOON, WHATEVER, WHATEVER'S EASIER FOR EVERYBODY.
I, I'M, I'M APPLICABLE EITHER WAY, AS LONG AS IT GETS DONE.
UM, IF WE, IF WE'RE GONNA HAVE THE COUNTY BUSHWA, UH, TO OPEN UP SOME OPTIONS FOR EVERY, FOR THE REST OF US TO SEE AND VISUALIZE, SHOULD THE SHERIFF, IF SHE'S INTERESTED, ALSO HAVE A SAY IN WHERE THAT CUTTING HAPPENS, YOU KNOW, UH, TO NOT AT ALL, TO, UM, TO DISPARAGE YOUR EXPERTISE, BUT, UM, I THINK HER INPUT IS PRETTY IMPORTANT ON THIS.
SO HE SAYING YOU HAD SWITCHED, LIKE FROM WHAT MR.
I THINK IT'S COMPLETELY PEACEFUL.
IT'S A LITTLE CLOSER TO THE NEIGHBORHOOD THAN BEING FAR TO THE EAST.
BUT, UM, I'M AMENABLE TO ANY COUNTY PROPERTY.
YOU JUST NEED A FACILITY, YOU JUST NEED A LOCATION MEANT THAT I'M GOING AFTER AND ONLY ONE SHORTSIGHTED AND ONE SIDED.
I'VE TALKED TO OTHER AGENCIES AS WELL, INCLUDING OUR STUDY, UM,
[02:35:02]
IN FRONT POLICE DEPARTMENT MANAGER ABOUT LONG TERM, UM, WHICH WE NEED GOAL IS BEST FOR THE COMMUNITY, BEST FOR OUR AGENCY, AND BEST FOR OUR STAFF.UM, THOSE ARE MY THREE PRIORITIES.
I HAVE NOTHING MORE THAN THAT.
DALEY, AND WE'LL CONTACT MR. BERRY AND GET THINGS GOING IF I HEAR THAT THAT'S SO, SO THERE IS A, UH, A OR YOU'VE ASKED THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO, TO CONSIDER UNDERTAKE A CONSIDERATION OF EXTENDING THE TABLE ONE.
AND WE'VE HAD A LOT OF DISCUSSION, BUT THAT'S THE MAIN THING.
WE'LL TAKE IT INTO CONSIDERATION.
UM, AND IF THERE'S NO MORE DISCUSSION ON THAT, THEN I GUESS WE WILL MOVE ON TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
DO YOU WANT A NOISE TEST? E ESA I MEAN, I HAVE A TIMELINE WHEN WE DO THAT.
AM I ON HOLD? I DUNNO WHAT MY NEXT STEPS ARE.
DO YOU HAVE A DATE SCHEDULED? OOPS, SORRY.
I WOULD THINK ONCE YOU CLEAR IT, THAT WE WOULD DO THE, YOU KNOW, THE SAME THING THAT YOU DID IN, UM, THE TRANSFER STATION, YOU KNOW, DO THE SOUND TEST.
UM, AND LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, LET ME KNOW WHEN, YOU KNOW, I WAS THERE THE LAST TIME.
I'LL BE GLAD TO GO UP THIS TIME.
AND, UM, WE HAVE TO BE CAREFUL OF THAT NO MORE THAN THREE BECAUSE IT MAKES A MEETING.
BUT WE, UM, WE CAN, YOU KNOW, WORK THAT OUT WITH YOUR SCHEDULE.
JUST LET ME KNOW THE PUBLIC AS WELL, THAT IS AROUND THAT SITE.
YOU GET THAT INFORMATION, WE NEED TO LET THEM KNOW.
I WOULD, UM, I WOULD SUGGEST DOING THE SAME THING LIKE YOU DID IN BENTONVILLE, KNOCK ON SOME DOORS.
I THINK THAT'S, UM, WAS, YOU KNOW, MAKING THAT PERSONAL CONTACT MEANS WERE THERE, OH, I'M SORRY.
WERE THERE ANY, UM, QUESTIONS OR OBJECTIONS ABOUT THE WAY THE SOUND TEST WAS DONE THAT, THAT, UM, YOU WOULD KNOW ABOUT THAT YOU COULD, THAT IF THERE WERE, THAT YOU RESPOND TO? SO THAT ANOTHER, WHAT I'M GETTING AT IS, UH, IS THE, IS THE PROCEDURE USED? WAS THAT A, WAS THAT AN ISSUE? AND IF IT WAS AN ISSUE, THEN MAKE SURE THAT WE ADDRESS THE ISSUE BEFORE WE DO ANOTHER SOUND TEST.
LIKE, MAKE A, AN, I DON'T KNOW.
THE NUMBER ONE THAT I THINK WE WENT TO SEVERAL AREAS, ESPECIALLY THOSE THAT SPOKE UP AT THE, UM, MEETING TO MAKE SURE THAT WE WENT TO THOSE RESIDENTS.
SO THAT'S ALL I'M SAYING IS IF, IF THE RIGHT, WHATEVER OBJECTIONS THERE WERE TO HOW IT WAS DONE, MAKE THOSE, MAKE CONSIDERATION OF THAT SO THAT WE CAN'T, WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME STORY AGAIN.
YEAH, YOU DID SOUND TEST, BUT IT WASN'T GOOD ENOUGH, OR IT DIDN'T, YOU DIDN'T DO THIS OR YOU DIDN'T DO THAT.
SO IF THAT HAPPENED, LET JUST TRY TO INCORPORATE WHATEVER THOSE MAY HAVE BEEN.
I DON'T EVEN KNOW IF THERE WERE ANY, BUT, OKAY.
I THINK, UH, I SAW A FACEBOOK COMMENT ONE TIME QUESTIONING, UM, THE EQUIPMENT THAT WAS USED, AND THEY ARE CALIBRATED.
THEY WEREN'T, THEY WEREN'T A PIECE OF JUNK OR SOMEBODY'S CELL PHONE.
AND I KNOW WE HAD SEVERAL RESIDENTS, UM, THAT STOOD THERE AND WATCHED THE TESTING WITH US.
UM, AND I WAS GLAD FOR THAT BECAUSE I, I WANTED TO, TO BE AS TRANSPARENT AND OPEN.
AND SO IF PEOPLE WANNA COME AND, AND LOOK AT THE METER AS IT'S BEING DONE, THAT'S FINE WITH ME.
WELL, ONE THING WITH THAT SITE, AS THE RANGE IS BUILT GOING INTO THE GROUND, THE SOUND WAVE IS MOVING FORWARD.
AS WE NOTICED, WE TOOK A SOUND TEST WHEN YOU FIRED RIGHT BEHIND YOU, AND IT WAS LOWER THAN IT WAS WHEN I WAS UP ON THE HILL.
SO THAT BARE, THAT BERM IS GOING TO CAPTURE SOUND.
SO ANYWHERE WHERE WE HAVE A SOUND TEST, IT WILL BE LOWER ONCE THE RANGE IS PROPERLY.
I JUST WOULD LIKE TO MAKE A POINT, UM, THE SMITHSONIAN PROPERTY IS A DIRECTLY ADJACENT TO THE EAST LANE PROPERTY.
AND, UH, SHERIFF PLAN MAY WANT TO REACH OUT TO THEIR DEPARTMENT THERE TO INVITE THEM.
JUST THAT'S A GOOD IDEA, BECAUSE THEY'LL BE GETTING A, A LETTER IF THIS DOES GO FORWARD, THE CCP.
SO JUST, YEP, THAT'S ONE OF THOSE DOORS WE NEED TO
[02:40:01]
KNOCK ON.[I. Discussion - Warren County Comprehensive Plan]
MOVE ON TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.I'M GONNA DO A BRIEF INTRODUCTION, AND THEN I'M GONNA MOVE OVER AND, UH, OUR KELLY TAKE OVER, UH, PRESENT OUR, OUR POWERPOINT.
UM, WELL, WE'VE, WE'VE BEEN, UH, WORKING ON THIS FOR QUITE SOME TIME AND, UM, WE'VE GOT A, A TIMELINE IN OUR POWERPOINT, BUT, UH, WE'VE REACHED A POINT WHERE WE FEEL LIKE, UM, WE'VE DONE AS MUCH AS WE CAN WITH WHAT WE'VE RECEIVED IN CITIZEN SURVEY, WHAT WE'VE GOT FROM OUR STRATEGIC PLAN FOR 2018.
AND, UM, YOU KNOW, BASICALLY WHAT WE'VE BEEN BRINGING FORWARD FROM PREVIOUS, UH, COMPREHENSIVE PLANS.
UH, I'LL JUST SAY THIS ONE WAS KIND OF BUILT ON THAT, AND, UM, IT'S, IT'S SOMEWHAT OF AN UPDATE TO THAT.
OUR PLANNING COMMISSION HAS WORKED HARD AND DONE WORK SESSIONS REGARDING THE REVIEW OF THE CHAPTERS THIS YEAR.
AND, UM, CERTAINLY STAFF HAS BEEN WORKING VERY, VERY HARD ON GETTING THIS DOCUMENT TO THIS POINT IN TIME.
UM, WE HAVE AUTHORIZED IT FOR A PUBLIC HEARING AT TOMORROW NIGHT'S PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING.
UM, AGAIN, THEY WILL HAVE AN OPTION TO TABLE IT IF THEY FEEL THAT IT NEEDS ADDITIONAL INFORMATION.
UM, BUT WE FEEL FAIRLY CONFIDENT THAT WE'VE COVERED EVERYTHING.
WE DO PLAN ON TAKING THE COMMENTS THAT WE RECEIVED THIS EVENING WITH THE COMMUNITY OUTPUT SESSION THAT WE RECENTLY JUST HAD THIS EVENING.
AND THEN FROM ANY, UM, COMMENTS YOU HAVE AS THE BOARD AND AS THE PLANNING COMMISSION, UH, WE'LL ADDRESS THOSE.
I WOULD SAY AFTER THE PLANNING COMMISSION PUBLIC HEARING, IF THERE NEEDS TO BE MODIFICATIONS OR ANY UPDATES OR CHANGES, WE'LL MAKE THOSE CHANGES.
UM, IT WILL ALL BE DONE PRIOR TO COMING TO THE BOARD FOR THEIR PUBLIC HEARING.
UM, IF THE PLANNING COMMISSION FEELS WE NEED MORE TIME, WE'LL WE, THEY'LL HAVE THAT OPTION TO TABLE THIS.
UM, THE GOOD THING IS, AND, AND, UH, MS. WALL WILL GET INTO THIS, WE HAVE RECEIVED, UH, BEEN WORKING WITH VDOT TO GET THEIR FINAL COMMENTS ON, ON IT, AND THAT'S KIND OF A BIG DEAL.
SO, UM, WITH THAT, I DO WANT TO THANK, UM, BOTH, UH, MS. WALL AND MS. MUTTER FOR THE DILIGENT WORK THEY'VE DONE IN, IN, UH, PUTTING THIS TOGETHER AND ASSISTING ME WITH THIS.
AND THEN ALSO OUR CO, CORY GRIFFITH, OUR GIS COORDINATOR, AND DOING, UH, THE MAPS.
WE REALLY FEEL THAT, UH, THOSE TELL A HUGE PART OF THE STORY OF WHERE WE'RE GOING AND WHERE WE'RE AT WITH, UH, WARREN COUNTY.
SO WITH THAT, I'LL, UH, LET TAKE OVER AND SHE'S GOT A POWERPOINT.
CAN EVERYBODY HEAR ME ALL RIGHT? OKAY.
SO I JUST WANTED TO START WITH WHAT IS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, JUST TO KIND OF REMIND EVERYBODY I KNOW WE ALL KNOW, BUT, UM, A CONFERENCE PLAN IS A LONG TERM DOCUMENT THAT OUTLINES THE COMMUNITY'S VISION AND GOALS FOR FUTURE DEVELOPMENT.
THEY'RE DESIGNED TO PLAN FOR THE NEXT 20 OR SO YEARS.
UM, PROVIDE AN OUTLINE FOR ADDRESSING THE COUNTY'S MOST PRESSING ISSUES BY STATING POLICIES, GOALS, AND IMPLEMENTATION STEPS.
SO WHY HAVE A PLAN? WELL, FIRST AND FOREMOST, THE STATE REQUIRES IT.
UM, SECONDLY, WE WANT A GUIDANCE FOR THE FUTURE OF THIS COUNTY.
UH, WE WANT A PLAN TO PRESERVE RURAL AND HISTORIC CHARACTER.
WE WANT THE COMMUNITY TO BE INVOLVED, AND WE WANT A CLEAR DIRECTION FOR THIS COUNTY.
SO I DID, UM, ILLUSTRATE A TIMELINE OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
THE MAJOR UPDATE BEGAN IN 2018 WHEN, UH, PLANNING STAFF BEGAN ORGANIZING UPDATES TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
AND IN 2019, THE, UH, CREATION OF A STRATEGIC VISION WAS ADOPTED, OBVIOUSLY, DUE TO THE COVID PANDEMIC, THERE WERE SOME SIGNIFICANT DELAYS IN THE UPDATE OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
AND JUST TO REITERATE, THIS IS AN UPDATE TO THE 2013 ADOPTED COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, NOT A COMPLETE REWRITE IN 20 21, 13 OR 18.
THIS IS A, THIS IS AN UPDATE TO THE 2013 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
YEAH, BUT THE, THE UPDATE STARTED IN 2018 BECAUSE THE STATE WOULD LIKE TO SEE AN UPDATE AT LEAST EVERY FIVE YEARS TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
UM, SO THE COUNTY DID TRY TO START IN 2018, BUT THERE WERE A LOT OF UNFORESEENS MOVING FORWARD.
A LOT OF, UH, STAFF CHANGES, NEW PLANNING, COMMISSION MEMBERS, NEW BOARDS, YOU KNOW, NEW SUPERVISORS.
[02:45:01]
UM, IN 23 PLANNING STAFF BEGAN WORK SESSIONS WITH PLANNING COMMISSION, UH, FALL OF 2024.JUST, UH, WE'VE BEEN WORKING BACK AND FORTH WITH VDOT FOR THE LAST COUPLE OF MONTHS.
UM, IT IS REQUIRED BY A STATE LAW THAT VDOT REVIEW AND GIVE US AN APPROVAL LETTER FOR OUR INFRASTRUCTURE CHAPTER ON TRANSPORTATION.
SO THEY HAVE REVIEWED, UM, OUR ENTIRE TRANSPORTATION, UH, PLAN IN CHAPTER SEVEN, AS WELL AS OUR LAND USE CHAPTER, CHAPTER FOUR.
SO, OBVIOUSLY, CURRENTLY, UM, MAKING AND FINALIZING THE UPDATES TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ARE CRUCIAL.
UM, AND HOPEFULLY WE CAN HAVE THIS A PLAN ADOPTED BY THE BEGINNING OF 2025.
I KNOW THE INITIAL GOAL WAS BY THE END OF 2024, BUT, YOU KNOW, THINGS ARE MOVING SLOWLY.
WE DID, UM, INCLUDE PUBLIC INPUT.
AS MATT SAID, WE HAD THE COMMUNITY OUTREACH THIS EVENING, WHICH I THINK WENT REALLY, REALLY WELL.
UM, SO HEARING FROM THE PUBLIC IS A CRITICAL PIECE IN PUTTING TOGETHER A SUCCESSFUL COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
WE BEGAN CITIZEN SURVEYS IN 2018, AND AGAIN, IN 2024, THOSE WILL BE INCLUDED.
THE RESULTS WILL BE INCLUDED AS AN APPENDIX ITEM IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
SO, UH, WE, AGAIN, WE DID NOT COMPLETE A REWRITE, RATHER AN UPDATE TO THE 2013 PLAN.
UH, DATA THROUGHOUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN HAS BEEN UPDATED TO REFLECT THE MOST RECENT STATISTICS.
MUCH OF THE 13 PLAN WAS INCORPORATED INTO THIS UPDATED PLAN, BUT ADDITIONAL SOLUTIONS TO LAND USE ISSUES, HOUSING AND TRANSPORTATION HAVE BEEN INCLUDED IN THIS VERSION.
UM, WE DID NOT INCLUDE ANY UPDATES REALLY TO CHAPTER ONE.
NOT MUCH TO REPORT IN ANY CHANGES TO OUR HISTORY.
UM, SO OUR DEMOGRAPHICS AND GROWTH TRENDS IS CHAPTER TWO.
UH, WE USED DATA FROM THE AMERICAN COMMUNITY SURVEY THROUGH THE US CENSUS BUREAU, WELDON COOPER CENTER, AND THE VIRGINIA EMPLOYMENT COMMISSION.
IN THIS CHAPTER, WE ANALYZE THE CURRENT POPULATION AND DEVELOPMENT PATTERNS WITHIN OUR COMMUNITY TO PREDICT THE GROWTH TRENDS AND DEVELOPMENT STRATEGIES TO MANAGE THE GROWTH IN A DESIRED WAY.
LOOKING AT OUR POPULATION INCOME, HOUSING AND EMPLOYMENT IN 2030, WARREN COUNTY'S POPULATION IS EXPECTED TO GROW FROM 40,727 TO 43,250.
AND OUR MEDIAN ANNUAL HOUSEHOLD INCOME IN 2020 WAS 70,109.
WE DO NOT HAVE ANY MORE RECENT STUDIES ON THAT.
THEY DO THAT IN A SIX YEAR PERIOD.
SO 2014 TO 2020, THEN IT'LL BE 2020.
2026 WILL BE THE NEXT, UM, UPDATE ON THAT DATA.
UH, CHAPTER THREE IS OUR NATURAL RESOURCES.
THERE WEREN'T MANY UPDATES IN THIS, UM, AS OUR NATURAL RESOURCES HAVE NOT CHANGED.
BUT WE OUTLINED HOW OUR COMMUNITY WILL PROTECT ITS NATURAL RESOURCES AND ENSURE THAT GROWTH OCCURS IN HARMONY WITH THE LUS, THE LAND'S ABILITY TO SUSTAIN DEVELOPMENT.
THERE WERE SOME CHANGES TO THE FLOODPLAIN.
MATT, DID YOU WANT TO DISCUSS ANY OF THE FLOODPLAIN UPDATES? WELL, BA BASICALLY THE UPDATES FOR THAT, WE WERE, UH, ACCEPTED INTO FEMA'S COMMUNITY RATING SYSTEM.
UH, I THINK CHASE FOR, UH, GETTING US OVER THE LINE ON THAT.
I HAVE BEEN WORKING ON THAT SINCE 2016.
SO THE CRS PROGRAM, UH, THE COUNTY WAS ACCEPTED INTO LAST YEAR.
UM, I HAD BEEN WORKING ON IT SINCE 2016 WHEN THAT THEN BOARD PASSED THE RESOLUTION THAT THE COUNTY DID WANT TO, UH, WORK ON THAT AND, AND BE, UH, A PART OF THAT PROGRAM.
SO, UH, THERE WAS A REWRITE THAT I DID OF THE ORDINANCE, UM, AND INCLUDED SOME OF THE HIGHER STANDARDS THAT ARE REQUIRED FOR THE, UH, PARTICIPATION INTO THAT.
AND SO SOME OF THOSE WERE, UH, ELEVATING THE BFE FOR HOUSING.
UH, A HOUSE, UH, LOWEST FLOOR ELEVATION FOR NEW CONSTRUCTION.
AND, UH, ALSO, UH, DECREASING THE, UM, AMOUNT, UH, PERCENTAGE FOR SUBSTANTIAL DAMAGE AND SUBSTANTIAL IMPROVEMENT.
UM, A LOT OF THIS WAS IN ORDER TO HELP CITIZENS WHO ARE CURRENTLY PAYING FLOOD INSURANCE TO GET A DISCOUNT AS PART OF THAT CRS PROGRAM AND PARTICIPANTS IN IT.
UH, THEY ARE GIVEN THAT DISCOUNT, UH, BASED ON THE CLASS THAT WE ARE IN.
AND ONE OF THE GOALS THAT WE DO HAVE, AND, AND CHASE HAS BEEN WORKING ON THIS IS, UH, TO GET OURSELVES TO A CLASS EIGHT, WHICH WILL GIVE US, UH, RIGHT NOW I THINK IT'S A 5% DISCOUNT, AND I WOULD THINK THAT WOULD BE A LITTLE BIT MORE OF A DISCOUNT.
BUT, UH, SO THAT WAS KIND OF ONE OF OUR BIG GOALS THAT WE HAD FOR THESE PAST FEW YEARS, UH,
[02:50:01]
AS FAR AS THIS CHAPTER GOES.SO CHAPTER FOUR IS OUR GROWTH MANAGEMENT, UM, LAND USE CHAPTER.
AGAIN, THIS WAS REVIEWED BY VDOT AS WELL.
UM, WE EXPLORED ADOPTING AN ORDINANCE TO ALLOW ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS IN AGRICULTURAL AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS, UM, FOR LONG-TERM HOUSING SOLUTIONS ONLY.
NOT FOR SHORT-TERM, JUST LONG-TERM HOUSING.
UM, AS PER STATE CODE, WE DO HAVE TO IDENTIFY URBAN DEVELOPMENT AREAS.
OBVIOUSLY THE COUNTY DOESN'T HAVE ANY AVAILABLE AREAS FOR UDAS.
SO THOSE IN CONJUNCTION, WORKING IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE TOWN, WE IDENTIFIED THOSE AREAS WITHIN TOWN LIMITS.
UM, THERE IS A MAP, I KNOW IT'S OBVIOUSLY VERY DIFFICULT TO SEE ON THIS TV SCREEN UP IN THE RIGHT HAND CORNER SHOWING THE TOWN LIMITS AND THE UDA AREAS ARE IDENTIFIED IN THE, IN THE PINK.
UM, SO THE TOWN PLANNING DIRECTOR, LAUREN KACI, HAS BEEN PROVIDED A COPY OF THIS.
UM, A LOT OF IT IS EXACTLY THE SAME AS IT WAS IN 2013.
CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION? YES, MA'AM.
ON THEARY AND I, I, I KNOW MATT, YOU WERE, YOU AND I HAD A CONVERSATION, WHAT IS THE, UM, THE LOT SIZE THAT WE COULD HAVE TWO HOUSES ON, OR DID I MISUNDERSTAND THAT? SO WE'VE BEEN, UM, GOING BACK AND FORTH ON THIS.
OBVIOUSLY WE JUST HAVE A DRAFT OF THIS ORDINANCE WRITTEN.
UM, ORIGINALLY IT WAS TWO ACRES.
WE DID RECEIVE SOME FEEDBACK THIS EVENING, UM, AT THE COMMUNITY OUTREACH THAT COMMUNITY, THE CITIZENS WOULD LIKE TO SEE THAT BE A LITTLE BIT BIGGER THAN THE TWO ACRES.
THERE WERE SOME CONCERNS FOR PUTTING TWO HOUSES ON, YOU KNOW, A MINIMUM OF TWO ACRES.
BUT AS IT STANDS RIGHT NOW, WE HAVE THE ORDINANCE DRAFTED FOR A MINIMUM OF, I BELIEVE, THREE TO FIVE.
UH, CHASE HAS DRAFTED THE ORDINANCE.
SO AGAIN, IT IS JUST A DRAFT HAVING, UH, EVEN SENT IT THROUGH LEGAL FOR REVIEW.
UM, BUT A, A ACREAGE REQUIREMENT IS OBVIOUSLY LEGAL.
UM, SO RIGHT NOW WE WERE LOOKING AT POTENTIALLY THREE ACRES FOR AN ATTACHED ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT AND FIVE ACRES FOR DETACHED.
UM, BUT OBVIOUSLY THAT COULD CHANGE, UH, COULD START LOWER AND, AND SEE, SEE WHERE IT GOES FROM THERE.
UH, DEPENDS ON WHAT YOU GUYS WANT, RIGHT? MY CONCERN IS WHEN YOU GET OUT INTO, UM, THE RURAL AREA THAT DOESN'T HAVE WATER AND SEWER, TWO ACRES TO PUT TWO SEPTIC TANKS AND SEPTIC LINES.
AND HERE, THIS IS YOUR EXPERTISE AREA, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF ROOM TO, TO SEPARATE THE WELLS AND THE, AND I KNOW WE HAVE ONE CLUSTER SUBDIVISION OUT IN MY AREA WHERE SOME OF THE LINES ARE ON SOMEBODY ELSE'S PROPERTY.
SO IT, IT, I'M GLAD THAT YOU MENTIONED THAT.
UM, IT MIGHT BE A GOOD TIME TO MENTION THAT WE, WE DO HAVE SOME SETBACK, UH, ORDINANCE THAT ARE WAY DIFFERENT THAN THE MINIMUM STATE REGS.
UM, OUR CURRENT WELL TO, WELL SETBACK IS A HUNDRED FEET.
NO, WELL, TO WELL IS 100 FEET.
THE STATE CODE FOR WELL DE SEPTIC IS 50.
I DON'T THINK YOU'RE CORRECT, BUT I'LL CHECK ON THAT.
ANYWAY, UH, CLARK AND WARNER ARE THE ONLY TWO COUNTIES IN THE STATE THAT HAVE A HUNDRED FOOT, WELL, WELL SAT BACK CLARK BEING AN TALLY ANTI-GROWTH.
UH, AND WE GOT SOME OTHER SETBACK RULES.
THE PROBLEM WITH THESE SETBACK RULES, I UNDERSTAND WHY THEY DID IT.
IT'S THE SHENANDOAH FARMS AREA.
YOU KNOW, I THINK WAY BACK, THEY WERE DESIGNED TO BE CAMPING LOTS.
SO THEY WERE USING HEALTH CODE TO CREATE A ZONING CODE TO KILL SOME LOTS, WHICH WAS NOT COMPLETELY WRONG.
'CAUSE YOU WOULDN'T WANT A HOUSE EVERY 50 FEET, YOU KNOW, IN A MOUNTAIN SUBDIVISION.
BUT I, I, I THINK THEY'VE, UH, THAT SETBACKS A LITTLE HEAVY.
IT'S, IT'S, IT'S NOT A GOOD WAY TO FINISH CHANDLE FARMS. 'CAUSE THE, UH, YOU GET INTO THIS, UH, STRATEGIC CHESS GAME OF WELL TO WELL WELD TO SEPTIC AND, UH, THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT'S A LOT WORSE.
I'LL GET INTO SOME PLACES WHERE THE, THE WELL IS WAY OVER THE BACK.
AND I WAS LIKE, WHY IN THE HECK ARE WE PUTTING A WELL DOWN THERE? HE SAID, WELL, THE NEIGHBOR'S WELL'S OVER HERE AND THIS SEPTICS OVER HERE.
SO WE ENDED UP CLEARING A WHOLE LOT.
SO I I, IT MIGHT BE A GOOD TIME, UH, IN THE NEAR FUTURE TO GO BACK AND, UH, I MEAN, I, YOU KNOW, I DON'T THINK ALL OF THEM SHOULD BE STATE MINIMUM REGS MAYBE.
AND THEN, YOU KNOW, IF IT, YOU KNOW, IF IT'S 50 AND WE'RE A HUNDRED, YOU KNOW, EVEN GOING TO 75 WOULD WOULD BE A HUGE CHANGE.
AND THEN THE, UH, THE OTHER SETBACK, IT REALLY HURTS THE PRIVATE SUBDIVISIONS, UH, WHEN THAT'RE NOT ON VDOT ROADS.
UM, THIS IS A 50 FOOT SETBACK.
[02:55:01]
USED TO BE 35.UH, YOU GET IN PLACE LIKE HIGH KNOB, UH, THE WELL'S NONISSUE, THEY'VE GOT THEIR OWN WATER SYSTEM.
BUT THEN, UH, IT'S SO STEEP THAT YOU END UP PUSHING THE HOUSE 50 OFF THE ROAD.
AND IT'S USUALLY STEEPER BEHIND THE HOUSE.
THEN THEY DON'T LIKE THE SEPTIC AREA.
SO THE HOUSE GETS PUSHED AWAY FAR OFF THE ROAD.
AND, UH, FIRE AND RESCUE HAS, UH, A TERRIBLE TIME REACHING THOSE.
SO, YOU KNOW, MAYBE GO BACK TO A 35 FOOT SETBACK ON PRIVATE SUBDIVISION ROADS AND THEN, UH, FIRE AND RESCUED HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY.
YOU COULD, UH, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD DRAG HOSE AND, UH, CARRY A MAN 35 FEET.
UH, YOU KNOW, FOR, FOR EMERGENCY SERVICES, I THINK IT MAY BE A BETTER WAY TO FINISH OUT THE FARMS. UM, THE REST OF THE AREAS, TWO ACRES IS KIND OF SMALL, DEPENDING ON THE SOIL GROUP, UH, FOR SEPTIC, UH, TO GET IT TO WORK.
YOU KNOW, HAVE A CLEAN ENVIRONMENT.
UH, GET ON MY SIDE, THE RIVER AND THE FORK DISTRICT, WE GOT PLENTY OF WATER.
YOU GET OTHER PLACES, UH, SOIL'S VERY GOOD.
AND THEN MAYBE WATER'S AN ISSUE.
SO, UH, I THINK IT'S DEFINITELY WORTH LOOKING AT, UH, TAKING A, TAKING A LOOK MAYBE AT THE WHOLE PACKAGE BEINGS.
WE'RE GETTING INTO THIS, YOU KNOW, MAY MAYBE THAT NEEDS, UH, I DON'T THINK IT NEEDS TO HOLD A COMPREHENSIVE PLAN UP PER SE, BUT, UH, AT SOME POINT IT'D BE NICE TO GO BACK AND REVIEW THESE ORDINANCES.
UH, NOT SO MUCH TO CHANGE THE COMMUNITY, BUT, UH, WE HAD TALKED ABOUT ACTUALLY WHEN, UH, ALDI WAS ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION.
IT'S HOW WE'RE GONNA FINISH IT, YOU KNOW, KIND OF THING.
SO, UH, MAYBE SOFTENING THOSE SETBACKS UP AND THEN SEE HOW THAT PLAYS OUT ON A TWO ACRE LOT.
AND IF IT'S NOT GONNA WORK ON A TWO ACRE LOT ANYWAY, YOU KNOW, THEN MAYBE THREE IS A GOOD NUMBER, UH, GOING FORWARD.
SO, OH, I DON'T HAVE A CLEAR, THEY'LL ALWAYS FIDDLE ON A TWO ACRE LOT KIND OF SCENARIO FOR YOU.
BUT, BUT I'D DEFINITELY BE WILLING TO, UH, WORK WITH THE, UH, I KNOW ALL THE SOIL GUYS, UH, REGIONALLY, GREENWAY ENGINEERING, UH, HADLEY ENVIRONMENTAL, UH, HADLEY ENVIRONMENTAL'S A GOOD ONE.
HE WAS ACTUALLY, UH, MR. HADLEY WAS ACTUALLY THE, UH, HEAD OF THE WARREN COUNTY HEALTH DEPARTMENT 25 YEARS AGO.
BUT I'M SURE HE WOULD, UH, HE WOULD HELP ME LOOK AT STUFF LIKE THAT.
UH, IF, IF, IF WE, UH, IF THE BOARD WOULD SAY LIKE US TO DIG INTO THAT, I WOULD, UH, YEAH.
I'D BE GLAD TO HELP ANY WAY I CAN.
'CAUSE I THINK IT'D MAKE, UH, MAKE THINGS A LITTLE BETTER.
I THINK YOU, YOU WERE, YOU WERE KIND OF JUMPING AHEAD A LITTLE BIT ON THE VACANT R ONE RESIDENTIAL LOTS STUDY THAT WE WERE TALK, WE WERE GETTING TO TALK ABOUT THE ADUS THEMSELVES.
WE WOULD, UH, PROPOSE LIMITING THEM TO AGRICULTURAL, UH, AREAS AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
NOW BOTH OF THOSE AREAS HAVE A LI UH, LIMITED LOT SIZE AT TWO ACRES.
AND, UH, RURAL RESIDENTIAL HAS A DENSITY OF FIVE ACRES IN THAT, UH, IN THAT, THAT ZONING DISTRICT, UM, THERE COULD BE A COMPONENT OF NEEDING TO HAVE A, A WAIVER FOR THOSE SETBACKS BASED ON THE PROPERTY THEMSELVES AS, AS YOU MENTIONED.
UM, ARE WE CON ARE WE TALKING ABOUT TWO DIFFERENT THINGS WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, BUT WE ARE TALKING? YEAH, YEAH.
WE'RE KIND OF, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT EDS THEN WE START TALKING ABOUT SETBACK.
AND THAT'S WHERE I, I WANTED TO JUST CLARIFY.
YOU SHOULD HAVE SEPTIC AND HOW IT, YEAH, DON, GO AHEAD.
THE ONLY THING I'D LIKE TO ADD ON THAT IS WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT LIKE TWO HOUSES ON TWO ACRES, I USED TO, I, WELL, TWO ISN'T THE NUMBER.
HUH? YOU SAID HE SAID THREE TO FIVE.
WHAT, WHAT I'M, WHAT I'M GETTING AT IS I USED TO LIVE IN APPLE MOUNTAIN.
SO, SO, UM, FIRST OF ALL, WHAT HE WAS SAYING THAT THE FARMS, UH, MIGHT NOT, MIGHT NEED A, A STRICTER SETBACK.
UM, I JUST CHIME IN WITH THAT.
SOME CONSTITUENTS HAD RAISED CONCERNS TO ME AND ASKED IF I WOULD BRING IT TO THE ATTENTION, YOU KNOW, FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ABOUT OVER, UM, TAXING THE LAND THERE WITH, WITH, UH, SEPTICS, ESPECIALLY ON THE STEEPER SLOPES.
UM, AND THEY'RE TALKING ABOUT EROSION.
AND ESPECIALLY IF NEARBY, YOU HAVE LIKE A, SOMEONE CLEAR CUT, SOMETHING TO DO A NEW HOUSE, YOU GET EROSION AND THE SEPTIC FAILS PREMATURELY.
UM, AND THEY'RE WORRIED ABOUT THAT AND OVERBUILDING.
AND SO I THINK AS WHATEVER WE DO WITH SETBACKS, I, WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THAT, WHICH I THINK HE WAS HINTING AT AND MIGHT NEED, YOU KNOW, CONDITIONAL, UH, RESTRICTIONS DEPENDING ON THE AREA AND THE TOPOGRAPHY.
I MAY, UH, TRY TO GET BACK TO THE FIRST BULLET POINT.
UM, THAT'S AGRICULTURAL AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL ONLY IS WHAT YOU'RE, THE WAY THAT'S FRAMED, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE PROPOS.
SO WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT THE FARMS IN THAT, IN THAT CASE WITH THESE A, RIGHT.
[03:00:01]
WELL, IF WE CHANGE THE ORDINANCE, SO WELL, WE JUST NEED TO ITSEPARATE THESE CONVERSATIONS.AGRICULTURAL AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
I MAY HAVE PULLED THIS OFF TOPIC TOO FAR.
SO, WE'LL, WE'LL GET TO YOURS IN JUST A MOMENT, BUT I JUST WANTED THE HEALTH, IT WOULD, ADUS WOULD HAVE TO BE ALL HEALTH DEPARTMENT REQUIREMENTS.
SO ALL HEALTH DEPARTMENT REQUIREMENTS.
SO IF, AND ALSO THEY MIGHT SHARE A, WELL, I WAS GONNA SAY THAT COULD THEY SHARE WHAT THEY'LL NEED ANOTHER SEPTIC.
'CAUSE YOU'VE GOT TOO MANY BEDROOMS COMING FOR THE ORIGINAL.
THAT'S GRANT APPROVAL FOR THAT.
SEE, THE, THE CONCEPT WITH THESE CAN BE THAT, SAY THERE'S A HOME AND, UM, I DON'T KNOW, UH, MAYBE IT'S 15 ACRES, MAYBE IT'S THREE ACRES.
AND PEOPLE HAVE, UH, CHILDREN AND, AND THEY, THE OWNER IS RETIRED AND EMPTY NESTER AND ALL THAT KIND OF STUFF, BUT THEY HAVE KIDS WHO HAVE A FAMILY AND SUCH.
THE A A DU NOTION, AS I UNDERSTAND IT, IS BASICALLY A 1200 SQUARE FOOT LITTLE RANCHER COULD BE PUT ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE PROPERTY, UH, OR NEAR IT, AND THEN THE FAMILY CAN MOVE IN TO THE, TO THE THING.
IT, IT RELIEVES HOUSING PRESSURE.
OPPORTUNITIES FOR MORE HOUSING TO BE BUILT THAT IS ACTUALLY BENEFICIAL TO PEOPLE ALREADY LIVE THERE.
I SUPPORT THE IDEA FOR THE FAMILY THING AND FOR GUEST HOUSES.
AND THE ACREAGE THING IS, IS LIKE I LOOKED AT THE TABLE THAT YOU'VE PRODUCED.
I MEAN, IF IT'S THREE, THERE'S LIKE 4,700 PO OPEN, UH, UH, DWELLING POSSIBILITIES.
AND IF IT'S FIVE, THE NUMBER KEEPS GOING DOWN.
SO IT'S DISTRIBUTED OVER THE AGRICULTURAL AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL ZONING DISTRICTS, WHICH ARE APPROXIMATELY 60% OF THE COUNTY.
AND SO IF YOU CAN BE TALKING ABOUT THE POTENTIAL FOR THOUSANDS OF HOUSING OF DWELLINGS DISTRIBUTED EVENLY OVER THE COUNTY, THAT'S A LOT OF POTENTIAL HOUSING STOCK AND A RELIEF ON PRESSURE.
AND WE'D BE LOOKING AT EITHER A DETACHED OR ATTACHED.
AGAIN, THE, THE ZONING ORDINANCE WOULD ADDRESS THOSE.
THAT ALSO, WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN AN ATTACHED A DU VERSUS JUST PUTTING AN EXTRA WING ON YOUR HOUSE? LIKE THAT'S AN ATTACHED A DU THAT WOULD BE ATTACHED FIX UP THE BASEMENT OR A FULL APARTMENT UP ABOVE A GARAGE.
ANYTHING THAT IT MEANS TWO KITCHEN SINKS, TWO KITCHEN, TWO OVENS TWO, OH NO, IT'S OVENS.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T OVERPOPULATE AN AREA TO THE POINT WHERE WE HAVE CONTAMINATED WELLS OR SEPTIC LINES ON SOMEBODY ELSE'S LOT AND THEY PLANT A TREE ON IT.
AND THEN THERE YOU HAVE PROBLEMS. TREE ROOTS GET INTO THE SEPTIC SYSTEM AND MY, YOU PLANTED A TREE ON MY SEPTIC LINE, AND NOW ARE YOU GONNA PAY FOR IT? AM I GONNA PAY FOR IT? YOU DIDN'T KNOW MY LINES WERE EVEN ON YOUR PROPERTY.
YOU KNOW, SO THAT'S ALREADY, WE'VE A LOT OF THINGS THAT, YOU KNOW, AND YOU KNOW, THAT I KNOW WE NEED HOUSING AND I'VE, YOU KNOW, MY FATHER-IN-LAW'S LIVING WITH US.
SO I, I UNDERSTAND TAKING CARE OF THE ELDERLY AND I, UM, I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THE ATTACHED, BUT IT, IT JUST CONCERNS ME THE LOT SIZE OF HAVING ANOTHER HOME ON A TOO SMALL AN AREA.
NOW, IF THEY PUT IT IN, BUILD THE HOUSE AND YOU SAY, MOM AND DAD ARE IN THEIR SIXTIES, WE'RE YOU GONNA HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF 'EM? SO LET'S PUT AN OVERSIZED SEPTIC SYSTEM IN, AND THEN IF WE HAVE TO BUILD A LITTLE ACCESSORY, THEY TAP INTO THE WELL, AND THAT'S A WHOLE DIFFERENT, I THINK THAT'S THE CONCEPT THOUGH.
THEY COULD EXPAND AN EXISTING DRAIN FUEL OR BUILD A LARGER DRAIN FIELD TO SUIT BOTH DWELLINGS.
BUT ARENT, AREN'T THE ACCESSORY, AREN'T THE ADUS, UH, LIMITED IN SIZE.
YEAH, WE WOULD PUT ACTUALLY A SIZE LIMIT.
WE WERE, WE WERE CONSIDERING THAT AS FAR AS THE SIZE LIMIT, MAYBE A NUMBER OF BEDROOMS, UM, WE WOULD DO IT, WE WERE CONSIDERING IT BY CUP.
SO WE WOULD HAVE SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS, AND THEN IT WOULD BE SITE SPECIFIC.
AND IF THE BOARD DID NOT FEEL GOOD ABOUT CERTAIN SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS OR IF THEY FELT LIKE CONDITIONS NEEDED TO BE PUT ON IT, UH, WE, YOU KNOW, WE, WE COULD DO IT BY THAT WAY.
AND THEN ALSO IT GIVES US AN OPPORTUNITY TO TRACK JUST HOW MANY OF THESE ARE BEING APPLIED FOR.
UM, IT MAY NOT BE A BIG DEAL, BUT DOWN THE ROAD, AT LEAST THIS WOULD ALLOW US TO TRACK THAT.
AND IF THERE IS, THEN WE CAN ALWAYS, I MEAN, WE CAN COME BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD AND TWEAK THE WORDS.
I, I, MY PERSONAL OPINION IS THAT IF THIS IS DONE, IT SHOULDN'T BE BY CUP.
I MEAN, HAVING PEOPLE HAVE TO SPEND 1200, 1500 BUCKS TO GO THROUGH THIS WHOLE PROCESS AGAIN.
I MEAN, IF, IF, IF IT'S A CHANGE THAT WE'RE GONNA MAKE, WE CAN JUST MAKE IT AND LET PEOPLE DO IT.
UM, THE, THE, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS THE TRACKING GOES, I DON'T KNOW, MAYBE THAT'S BY PERMIT OR SOMETHING.
AND JUST TO NOTE, THIS IS ALREADY LIKE I WENT THROUGH A COP TO BE ABLE TO DO THIS.
[03:05:01]
BUT IT'S, IT'S NOT, UM, IT'S NOT, DOESN'T HAVE, IT'S NOT AS FREE FOR ME.I MEAN, I CAN ONLY, I CAN ONLY HAVE FAMILY FOR SIX MONTHS AND WHATEVER.
IT'S ALL RESTRICTED AND REGULATED.
IT WOULD REPLACE THAT ORDINANCE.
IT SHOULD REPLACE THAT, THAT USE, THAT LAND USE GETS, SO IF, IF I LIKE THE DIRECTION THIS GOES, I DO UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT I, BUT AS I'VE DISCUSSED THIS WITH YOU AND, AND, AND KELLY AND, AND CHASE, UM, THE A DU, IT'S NOT LIKE I HAVE A 2,500 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE AND UM, NOW I'M GONNA BUILD A 4,000 SQUARE FOOT HOUSE.
IT'S, IT'S NOT, THAT'S NOT AN A DU
SO, SO THE, SO THE A DU IS ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS.
SO IF THERE'S SOME REASONABLE LIMITS ON IT IN TERMS OF SIZE, AND IT JUST, I'M VERY ACTUALLY ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT THE NOTION OF BEING ABLE TO HAVE A SIGNIFICANT EXPANSION OF POTENTIAL HOUSING STOCK, UM, AVAILABLE MOSTLY TO PEOPLE WHO ARE ALREADY RESIDENTS OF THE COUNTY AND HOMES BUILT BY BUILDERS IN THE COUNTY.
RYLAND HOMES ISN'T GONNA GO OUT AND BUILD ALL THOSE HOMES.
IT'S GONNA BE OUR, OUR OUR GUYS'S BUILDING THE HOME.
I MEAN, SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY I'M ENTHUSIASTIC ABOUT IT.
I I, WELL, I'M NOT SAYING I'M AGAINST NO, UNDERSTAND.
I'M NOT, I'M NOT THINKING YOU'RE AGAINST IT.
I, I, AND I HAVEN'T SEEN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
I, I'VE BEEN SITTING HERE TRYING TO SEE, I GOT IT EMAILED TO ME AND I MISSED IT.
AND I DON'T, SO THESE ARE THINGS THAT I'M NOT SEEING UP THERE THAT I NEED TO KNOW, BECAUSE BEFORE WE'LL, GLAD TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS AND BE GLAD TO MEET WITH YOU ON THIS.
I'LL JUST MENTION THESE WILL NOT BE ABLE TO BE USED AS TRANSIENT LOING FACILITIES.
THAT'S BECAUSE THAT MEANS THAT POLITIC GOALS, IT'S A HOUSING, UH, SOLUTION, A PROPOSED HOUSING SOLUTION.
AND I, I GET THAT AND I TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THAT.
BUT YOU KNOW, FOR EVERY GOOD THING, THERE'S THE UNFORESEEN CONSEQUENCE.
AND THAT'S WHAT I'M LOOKING AT, THE UNFORESEEN CONSEQUENCES AND BUILDING MORE AND OUT IN THE RURAL AREA WHERE WE ARE SEPTIC AND WELLS AND WITH THE LAST TWO YEARS, AND WE DON'T SEEM TO BE GETTING OUT OF THIS DARN DROUGHT, THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT OF THAT AS WELL.
YOU KNOW, YOU, UM, I'LL BE HONEST, WHEN THE NEIGHBOR UP THE ROAD DUG THEIR, WELL RECENTLY, I WAS LIKE, HOLY SMOKE, WHAT'S THAT GONNA DO TO MINE? AND THE CLOSER YOU PUT THESE AND THE MORE YOU PUT, THE MORE IMPACT IT IS TO THAT.
AND COMPLETELY NOT, I'M NOT, I'M NOT IN ANY WAY REFUTING WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT I, BUT I'M, I WANT TO POINT OUT THAT THERE'S ONLY ONE A DU ALLOWED.
SO WHETHER YOU HAVE 40 ACRES OR A HUNDRED ACRES OR THREE ACRES, YOU GET ONE A DU.
AM I RIGHT ABOUT THAT? THAT'S THE INTENTION.
THE OTHER IS THAT, AND IN MY CASE, FOR EXAMPLE, THE A DU, IT'S GONNA SHARE A WELL IN SEPTIC, SO IT'S NOT GONNA BE ANOTHER WELL IN ANOTHER SEPTIC, IT'S GONNA, IT'S GONNA, IT'S GONNA, YOU KNOW.
AND IN, IN TERMS OF WHETHER OR NOT YOU NEED A CUP, LIKE IF, IF THE RIGHT, YOU SAID ALL THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT REGULATIONS WOULD APPLY, SO THEY HAVE TO PERK FOR THE NEW SEPTIC, ET CETERA.
THEY'D HAVE TO MEET ALL THOSE REQUIREMENTS FOR BUILDING CODE AND FOR ZONING.
SO MAY MAYBE THERE COULD BE A STREAMLINED PROCESS WHERE I AGREE LIKE PUTTING DOWN 1200 TO FIND OUT IF YOU CAN DO THIS AND THEN, YOU KNOW.
WE'LL GET SOME LEGAL COUNSEL ON YEAH.
AGAIN, IT'S JUST, THIS IS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN ASPECT TO THIS IS IT'S A GUIDE.
WE'RE CREATE, WE'RE OPENING THE DOOR, THE ORDINANCE THAT WILL BE DRAFTED AND ADOPTED WOULD TAKE CARE OF ALL THE, THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT IS ALLOWABLE.
THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT WE'RE GONNA DO.
THIS IS EXACTLY WHAT YOU'RE ALLOWED TO DO.
UM, CURRENTLY THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN DOES STATE TWO ACRES.
WOULD YOU ALL LIKE TO SEE THAT CHANGED? UM, WE COULD CHANGE THE LANGUAGE WHERE WE REMOVE THE SIZE ALTOGETHER AND JUST SAY THERE WILL BE A MINIMUM LOT SIZE REQUIREMENT IN THAT LANGUAGE RATHER THAN SCOPE.
YOU MEAN THE A DU? ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE, FOR THE A DU? YES.
WELL, TWO ACRES JUST SEEMS AWFULLY STONE TO ME.
THAT, YEAH, THAT'S, IT'S JUST THAT WAS WHAT'S THE PROPOSED LANGUAGE FOR THE CONFERENCE PLAN.
AGAIN, IT'S JUST THAT IT'S JUST OPENING THE DOOR.
IT'S NOT SET IN STONE WHAT THE SIZE IS GOING TO BE.
I LOOKED AT YOUR TABLE AND THREE RESULTED IN SOMETHING NORTH OF 4,500.
UH, UH, WHAT, WHAT WAS THE NAME FOR IT? THERE WAS UNITS THREE AND A HALF AND YEAH, BUT, BUT ANYWAY, THREE TO THREE AND A HALF.
IT OPENED UP A SIGNIFICANT NUMBER, A HEALTHY NUMBER, POTENTIAL SITES.
SO DOESN'T SEEM LIKE THERE'S A REAL MOTIVATION TO KEEP PUSHING IT DOWN TO, TO TWO.
YOU KNOW, YOU GET A GOOD, A GOOD NUMBER OF BENEFITS AT THREE AND THEN YOU START LOSING, THEY START DROPPING OFF WHEN YOU GET BIGGER AND BIGGER ACREAGE.
AND ALSO THINK OF FROM THIS POINT OF VIEW,
[03:10:01]
IF, IF ONE OF THE GOALS IS TO INCREASE IS TO FACILITATE, I GUESS I'LL USE THE TERM AFFORDABLE HOUSING, MAYBE IT'S A LOADED TERM, UM, TO FACILITATE AN INCREASE IN HOUSING STOCK THAT'S ACCESSIBLE TO RESIDENTS OF THE COUNTY, THEN PUSHING THE ACREAGE TOO HIGH, UH, SUBVERTS THAT, THAT ASPECT OF THE GOAL.SO THAT, THAT'S ALL I WOULD SAY ABOUT THAT.
BECAUSE NOT, YOU KNOW, HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE FIVE, HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE 10? HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE 15 FEWER AND FEWER AND FEWER.
SO, SO IF IT'S A BENEFIT, THERE'S A POLICY BENEFIT TO TRY TO FACILITATE THAT, THE BUILD OUT OF THAT HOUSING THAT'S ACCESSIBLE TO PEOPLE IN THE COUNTY ON AN AFFORDABLE BASIS, THEN WE WOULD BE CAREFUL ABOUT HOW, HOW HIGH WE MAKE THE BAR.
BUT I AGREE THAT TWO SOUNDS KIND OF LOW.
SO WE'RE HERE TALKING ABOUT ARBITRARY NUMBERS RIGHT NOW.
IT'S GONNA HAPPEN BY ORDINANCE ANYWAY, SO THANK YOU.
APPRECIATE YOUR INPUT ON THAT.
THAT WAS ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS MOST DISCUSSED IN OUR COMMUNITY GROUP, UH, JUST A COUPLE HOURS AGO.
I THINK THAT WAS WELL, AND I DON'T KNOW WHERE THIS WILL FALL, SO I'M JUST GONNA THROW IT OUT HERE SINCE WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT STUFF I SAW.
AND I, LIKE I SAID, I HAVEN'T SEEN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
I DID SEE ON FACEBOOK SOMETHING ABOUT SEWAGE FACILITIES IN BROWNTOWN, BENTONVILLE AND TON.
IF WE'RE ABOUT TO LOSE OUR CHASE WENT TO THE TEAM ITSELF.
WHILE HE'S DOING THAT, I'LL JUST MENTION, IF YOU WERE TO HAVE, WANT TO DO A FAMILY SUBDIVISION OUT OF A, A LOT, UM, YOU WOULD HAVE TO HAVE A MINIMUM OF THREE AND A HALF ACRES IF THERE WAS A SUBDIVISION RIGHT.
LEFT FOR A FAMILY SUBDIVISION, BECAUSE YOUR ACREAGE, ACREAGE WOULD'VE TO BE TWO ACRES, WHICH IS OUR MINIMUM LOT SIZE IN AG, AND THEN ONE AND A HALF FOR A FAMILY SUBDIVISION.
SO, UM, THAT'S WHAT I'VE ALWAYS BASICALLY TELL IF YOU WANT TO DO A FAMILY SUBDIVISION, YOU GOT THREE AND A HALF ACRES.
SO MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING WE MAY, MAY LOOK AT OR CONSIDER IN THE ADUS, UM, YOU KNOW, OR, OR DECREASE IT A LITTLE BIT OR INCREASE IT A LITTLE BIT, WHATEVER.
COULD YOU CHANGE THAT TO 3.48? 3.4
WELL THAT'LL START A GOOD ONE.
SO, UM, WE ALSO EXPLORED AGRITOURISM, UM, TO HELP OUR COMMUNITY PROMOTE THEIR AGRICULTURAL SECTORS TO STRENGTHEN FARMING AND ENCOURAGE THE CONSERVATION.
UH, WE INCLUDED THE ROCKLAND COMMUNITY VISION PROJECT, UM, AND AS WELL AS BROWN TOWN'S COMMUNITY VISION.
THESE PLANS WILL ALSO BE AVAILABLE AS APPENDIX ITEMS TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
UH, CITIZENS FROM WITHIN THOSE COMMUNITIES REACHED OUT TO US PERSONALLY, UM, AND FELT IT WAS CRUCIAL THAT THEY BE HEARD AND MADE A PART OF THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
UM, WE INCLUDED A NEW FUTURE LAND USE MAP, A NEW PROPOSED FUTURE LAND USE MAP FOR THE 3 45 22 CORRIDOR.
AND, UM, WE DID A STUDY INTO, AND THIS IS BACK TO WHERE WE WERE EARLIER WHEN WE STARTED MIXING R ONE AND THE ADUS, UM, THE IDENTIFICATION OF VACANT R ONE RESIDENTIAL LOTS.
WE LOOKED INTO SEEING HOW MANY OF THOSE R ONE LOTS WERE VACANT TO POSSIBLY SOLVE OR PROPOSE A, AN ISSUE, UM, A WAY TO SOLVE THE HOUSING CRISIS THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING IN HERE IN WARREN COUNTY BY LOWERING SOME OF THE SETBACK REQUIREMENTS.
UM, WHETHER THOSE REQUIREMENTS ARE TO LOWER THE STANDARDS FOR THE ROADS IN THAT AREA.
UM, SO THEY DON'T HAVE TO BE, THEY DON'T HAVE TO MEET STATE STANDARDS.
THEY DON'T HAVE TO MEET THE STANDARDS FOR SANITARY DISTRICTS EITHER, BUT ARE STILL ACCEPTABLE.
UM, THERE ARE A LOT OF THOSE LOTS THAT ARE IN THE FLOODPLAIN.
UM, SO THERE'S JUST NEVER GONNA BE BUILT UPON.
THERE'S A LOT OF, UM, TOPOGRAPHICAL ISSUES WITH A LOT OF THOSE LOTS, UM, BUT THEY ARE WHAT COULD BE CONSIDERED THE MORE AFFORDABLE HOUSING AREA.
SO WE DID INCLUDE A MAP OF THAT STUDY IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
I WONDER IF THERE WAS A, IS THERE ANY, IS THERE ANY BEEN ANY THOUGHT GIVEN TO POSSIBLY PUTTING A, UH, A PERCENTAGE CAP ON, UH, YOU KNOW, THE, UH, WHAT IS IT? THE AIRBNBS SHORT TERM MONEY? I KNOW WE'VE TALKED ABOUT IT.
YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE THIS CAME UP DURING THE PREVIOUS, UH, COMMUNITY OUTREACH SESSION.
ALSO VERY, I KNOW THAT I MENTIONED THIS BEFORE, BUT MY, MY DAUGHTER AND SON-IN-LAW HAD TO MOVE TO LOURAY IN ORDER TO FIND AN AFFORDABLE HOUSE.
'CAUSE THEY JUST COULDN'T FIND A HOUSE HERE, PERIOD.
I, I, I HAVE A THOUGHT ON THIS, UH, BECAUSE I, I TOLD YOU I WAS GONNA HAVE, I SENT YOU
[03:15:01]
MY, LIKE, TYPOS, BUT NOW I HAVE SOME REAL IDEAS.UM, SO PAGE 21, UM, IT SAID THAT SHORT TERM RENTALS ARE NOT AFFECTING OVERALL HOUSING IN INVENTORY.
AND I HAVE TO SAY, I, I'M NOT SURE I'M WITH YOU ON THAT SENTENCE.
UM, JUST LOOKING AT NUMBERS, I LOOKED AT THE NUMBER OF, UM, SINGLE FAMILY DWELLINGS THAT WERE, UM, YOU KNOW, THOSE PERMITS ISSUED OVER THE YEARS AND RECENTLY, LIKE 2023, WE WERE ABOUT 148.
I THINK WE PEAKED AT TWO HUNDRED AND TWENTY TWENTY ONE, BUT WE'VE HAD SOME TROUGHS AS WELL, LIKE THE, UH, THE ECONOMIC GREAT RECESSION IN THE YEARS AFTER, FROM 29 TO 2014, IT WAS AN AVERAGE OF 70 OR SO, UH, NEW SFD PERMITS PER YEAR.
AND THEN I'M JUST THINKING ABOUT HOW MANY OF THESE SHORT TERM TERM RENTALS WE APPROVE AND IT'S GOTTA BE LIKE FOUR A MONTH PROBABLY.
SO IF WE'RE APPROVING 50 A YEAR AND WE'RE BUILDING 150 NEW HOUSES A YEAR, THEN SHORT TERM RENTALS ARE TAKING UP FOR AIRBNBS, BASICALLY A THIRD OF OUR NEW HOUSING.
AND I KNOW WE HAVE LIKE 20,000 OR WHATEVER HOMES OVERALL.
AND YES, THE ST R IS A TINY PERCENTAGE OF THAT, BUT WHAT REALLY MATTERS IS AT THE, AT THE MARGIN, BECAUSE THE POPULATION IS GROWING, PEOPLE ARE GETTING KIDS, PEOPLE ARE MOVING HERE.
SO HOW MANY NEW HOMES ARE YOU BUILDING VERSUS HOW MANY SHORT TERM RENTALS ARE YOU PERMITTING? AND, UM, I DO THINK WE NEED, I SAID THIS THE OTHER MEETING, WE NEED, UH, A COMMITTEE OR A TEAM OR A GROUP OR, OR YOU ALL TO STUDY THIS, AND WE NEED TO COME UP WITH A POLICY TO HELP STEER THIS.
AND I DON'T KNOW IF WE NEED TO CAP IT OR HAVE CERTAIN CRITERIA, BUT WHAT CONCERNS ME EVEN MORE IS THAT MOST OF THE ONES I'VE BEEN NOTICING RECENTLY, IT'S SHORT TERM RENTALS, WHERE IT'S PEOPLE THAT DON'T LIVE HERE, THEY'RE OUTSIDE OF WARREN AND MAYBE THEY LIVE IN WASHINGTON, DC OR SOMEWHERE ELSE, AND THEY'RE BUYING IT HERE AS AN INVESTMENT.
UM, AND, UH, THEN THEY HIRE A LOCAL MANAGEMENT COMPANY.
AND THAT'S, THAT'S GOOD JOBS, I GUESS, FOR THE LOCAL MANAGEMENT COMPANY, BUT, BUT IT'S NOT KEEPING THE WEALTH AND THE, THE BENEFIT, THE ECONOMIC RETURNS TO THE PROFIT FROM THOSE SHORT TERM RENTALS WITHIN THE COUNTY.
AND YES, WE GET THE, THE TAX REVENUE, THE, THE, UM, TRANSIENT, UM, LODGING TAX, AND THAT'S GOOD FOR THE COUNTY AND WE NEED THAT.
UM, SO THE WHOLE THING'S A DOUBLE-EDGED SWORD, BUT IT, IT NEEDS MORE STUDY.
MY BIGGEST POINT IS I, I TAKE ISSUE WITH THE PHRASE THAT IT'S NOT HAVING ANY IMPACT BECAUSE I THINK YOU, THAT'S DEMONSTRABLY FALSE.
UH, UH, OR IT DEPENDS WHAT YOU CALL AN IMPACT.
TO ME, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S AN IMPACT.
WELL THAT'S CERTAINLY THAT WE, WE CAN CONSIDER REMOVING AND THEN ACTUALLY PUTTING IN LANGUAGE REGARDING POTENTIAL, UH, STUDY OF, OF THE IMPACT BOTH ECONOMICALLY AND FROM A HOUSING STANDPOINT.
AND UM, AGAIN, THIS IS A GUIDE, SO IT'S, IT'S BENEFITING US, YOU KNOW, FOR THE NEXT 5, 10, 20 YEARS.
SO YEAH, FROM AN ECONOMICAL STANDPOINT, THE, UH, THE SHORT TERM FIRST RENTAL INITIALLY DID, UH, THEY WERE RENTAL FOR LONG TERM RENTALS.
AND THEY WEREN'T HAVING VERY GOOD SUCCESS WITH MAINTENANCE ON LONG-TERM RENTALS.
THE PROPERTIES LOOK VERY DERELICT AND ROUGH IN THE, UH, BY 'EM BECOMING SHORT-TERM RENTALS, YOU KNOW, THEY NEED TO BE CLEANED NEITHER, THEY'RE NOT A MARKETABLE PRODUCT.
SO WE CLEANED UP A LOT OF NEIGHBORHOODS WITH THEM.
THE SECOND THING IS, IS WHERE IT'S A BETTER ECONOMIC VALUE, WE'RE GONNA COLLECT PROPERTY TAX ON THAT WITH ZERO GUARANTEED ZERO LOAD ON THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.
AND ALL THESE THINGS NEED TO COME INTO A STUDY.
UM, I, BUT I, I THINK ONE OF THE BIGGEST ISSUES, AND PEOPLE MENTIONED IT, I THINK IN THE SURVEY, WAS AFFORDABLE HOUSING OR WORKFORCE HOUSING, HOWEVER, HOWEVER YOU WANT TO CALL IT.
WE CAN'T OVERBURDEN THE SCHOOLS.
UM, AND, UH, WE'RE TRYING TO PROMOTE TOURISM BECAUSE IT HAS KNOCK ON BENEFITS, YOU KNOW, SO IT, IT ALL IS PART OF THIS OPTIMIZATION.
UM, I JUST THINK THOUGH, THAT RIGHT NOW WE'RE NOT SURE IF WE'RE DOING THE RIGHT THING.
AND I'M INCREASINGLY CONCERNED AS, AS WE'RE RUBBER STAMPING ALL THESE.
NOW, I, I DON'T WANNA SAY RUBBER STAMPING, THAT IMPLIES WE'RE NOT USING ANY JUDGMENT OR CRITERIA, BUT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE PASSING A LOT, WE'RE APPROVING A LOT OF THESE SHORT TERM RENTALS.
I'M PART OF, PART OF THE PROCESS, YOU KNOW, UH, BUT I'M, I'M MORE AND MORE THINKING ABOUT THE BIG PICTURE AND IS THIS REALLY THE RIGHT THING TO DO OR NOT? YEAH.
SO I'M, I'M HEARING YOU WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THE DATA OR FURTHER DATA ON THE LAND USE AND, AND WHAT COULD BE DONE, AND THEN CERTAINLY DIALOGUE BASED ON THAT DATA.
I THINK WE'VE, YEAH, WE'VE ADDRESSED A LOT OF THE, THE CODE, YOU KNOW, IN THE PAST YEAR, YEAR AND A HALF.
AND, YOU KNOW, WHAT COULD WE DO TO THE CODE? WHAT COULD WE DO TO THE CODE? BUT I THINK A LOT OF IT IS BASED ON LET'S GET, YOU KNOW, THIS IMPACT VIA SOME DATA, ADDITIONAL DATA TO HELP OUT.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT IS A GOOD DIRECTION, I THINK FOR US TO GO IN THIS ESPECIALLY, UH, IN ADDRESSING THE HOUSING MM-HMM.
YEAH, THAT'S DEFINITELY SOMETHING WE, WE WILL, AND MAYBE YOU COULD, UH, CHANGE IT FROM NOT AFFECTING TO, SHOULD
[03:20:01]
BE STUDIED, WHETHER IT'S AFFECTING.THAT'S ONLY ABOUT, UH, 20 MINUTES PER BULLET.
SO WE'RE DOING, YOU'RE DOING GREAT.
SO MOVING INTO CHAPTER FIVE, WHICH IS OUR COMMUNITY FACILITIES CHAPTER, UM, WE PROPOSED ADOPTING A HISTORIC PRESERVATION PLAN.
AGAIN, THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WAS IMPORTANT TO OUR ROCKLAND FOLKS AND BROWNTOWN FOLKS, UM, TO SAFEGUARD HISTORIC HERITAGE RESOURCES AND ARCHEOLOGICAL RESOURCES.
WE DID ADD NONPROFIT ORGANIZATIONS THAT ASSIST THE CITIZENS WITH OUR COMMUNITY.
THE SCHOOL BOARD UPDATED THEIR COMPREHENSIVE LONG RANGE PLAN THROUGH 2030 WITH THEIR FOCUS BEING ON SAFETY, EQUAL OPPORTUNITY, STRONG LEADERSHIP, COMMUNITY RELATIONSHIP SUCCESS DEVELOPMENT, AND TECHNOLOGICAL ADVANCES.
UH, WE MADE UPDATES TO LAW ENFORCEMENT SERVICES AS THEY IDENTIFIED NEW GOALS AND OBJECTIVES TO IMPROVE TECHNOLOGY, MORE COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT, BETTER EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS AND COMPREHENSIVE TRAINING.
FIRE AND RESCUE IDENTIFIED THEIR TOP PRIORITIES, UH, STAFFING SAFE AND RELIABLE APPARATUS AND EQUIPMENT AND FIRE STATION ENHANCEMENTS, FACILITY UPGRADES AND CANCER PROTECTIONS FOR THE EMPLOYED AND VOLUNTEERS.
WARREN COUNTY PARKS AND REC UPDATED THEIR MASTER FACILITIES PLAN FOR IMPROVEMENTS TO ROCKLAND PARK AND THE ADDITIONS OF THE BOAT LANDINGS AT MORGAN FORD AND INDIAN HOLLOW.
CHAPTER SIX IS OUR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT CHAPTER.
UM, ALSO WONDERFUL BEDTIME READING MATERIALS, SHOULD YOU STRUGGLE GOING TO SLEEP AT NIGHT.
WE UPDATED OUR DATA ON LABOR FORCE, STATISTICS, EMPLOYMENT RATES, OCCUPATIONS, RETIREES, UNEMPLOYMENT, OUR LABOR POOL, WORK SOURCE ANALYSIS, RETAIL TAXES, AND BUSINESS LICENSE, UH, COMMUNING PATTERNS AND INCOME AND WAGES.
SO ALL OF THIS IS LAID OUT, UH, JUST STATISTICS FOR POTENTIAL PEOPLE WHO WANNA MOVE HERE, UH, DEVELOPERS, ET CETERA, ET CETERA.
CHAPTER SEVEN IS OUR INFRASTRUCTURE CHAPTER.
MATT DID NOTE THAT, UM, WE WERE REALLY CLOSE TO GETTING V DOT'S APPROVAL.
WE HAVE THEIR STAMP OF APPROVAL, BUT WE DO NOT HAVE THEIR LETTER.
WE'RE HOPING TO RECEIVE THAT, UH, BEFORE TOMORROW.
WE SUBMITTED OUR FORMAL SUBMISSION PACKAGE TO THEM AFTER MAKING ALL OF THE CHANGES THAT THEY HAD REQUESTED.
UM, IT WAS JUST REORGANIZING SOME MAPS AND FOR A SMOOTHER LAYOUT.
SO WITHIN CHAPTER SEVEN, WE UPDATED OUR TRAFFIC VOLUMES, UM, IDENTIFIED THE INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS FOR WARREN COUNTY, AND IT HAS AN ACCOMPANYING MAP IDENTIFIED THE FISCAL YEAR, 2025, VDOT, SIX YEAR IMPROVEMENT PLAN, UM, AS WELL AS SMART SCALE AND STAR STUDY RECOMMENDATIONS, WHICH ALSO HAVE ACCOMPANYING MAPS PROPOSED IMPROVEMENTS TO THE ROUTE, UH, 3 45, 22 NORTH CORRIDOR TRANSPORTATION PLAN.
ALSO WITH AN ACCOMPANYING MAP UPDATES TO THE HIKING, BIKING, AND RAIL TO TRAIL INITIATIVES WITH MAPS AND THE ADDITION OF BROADBAND INFRASTRUCTURE.
IT DID COME UP WITH THE COMMUN WITHIN THE COMMUNITY OUTREACH TO ADD CELLULAR AS WELL, NOT JUST INTERNET.
UM, SO WE WILL WORK ON SOME LANGUAGE FOR THE ADDITION OF CELLULAR AVAILABILITY FOR THE COUNTY AS WELL.
UM, DOES THE INFRASTRUCTURE CATEGORY INCLUDE WATER INFRASTRUCTURE? YES.
THERE WEREN'T REALLY SIGNIFICANT UPDATES TO IT.
UM, OBVIOUSLY EXPLORING MAYBE SOME, UM, VARIANCE IN THE SETBACK REQUIREMENTS THAT WE SPOKE ABOUT EARLIER.
UM, EASING UP SOME OF THOSE BECAUSE STATE CODE IS CURRENTLY 50 FEET.
UM, AND WE HAVE IT AT, AT 100 FEET.
SO WHY, WHY ARE WE SO FAR UP AND ABOVE STATE? OKAY.
UM, SO, AND I WAS ACTUALLY THINKING MORE ABOUT WATER SUPPLY.
UM, SO, UH, I SAW SOMETHING NOT IN CHAPTER SEVEN, BUT I THINK IT WAS AROUND PAGE 25, MENTIONING LIKE LOOKING AT MCKAY AS A WATER OPTION.
AND ALSO IT SAID, UH, LOOKING AGAIN AT FREDERICK COUNTY'S SYSTEM.
I JUST WANTED TO THROW OUT ANOTHER OPTION THAT'S BEEN TALKED ABOUT RECENTLY.
AND, UH, I DON'T KNOW HOW VIABLE IT IS, BUT MAYBE SOMETHING THAT COULD BE STUDIED.
UM, AND IT CAME UP IN THE MERRILL IN THE MAYOR RACE.
UM, I THINK MR. UH, ESHELMAN HAD A COMMERCIAL TALKING ABOUT LIKE POTENTIALLY THE QUARRIES AS A WATER, UH, AT LEAST A RESERVOIR TYPE OPTION.
UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S POTEN WORTH LOOKING INTO.
THE TOWN MANAGER HAS MENTIONED THAT AS WELL IN FRONT ROYAL.
UM, BECAUSE I, I KNOW THAT MCKAY IS A POTENTIALLY THORNY ISSUE, AND THAT MIGHT BE A THIRD WAY THAT, THAT WE'VE LOOKED AT FREDERICK ONCE WE COULD GO BACK TO THEM, BUT WE'VE NEVER LOOKED AT THE QUARRY THING AND MIGHT BE WORTH LOOKING INTO.
WE CAN ADD SOME LANGUAGE ON THAT.
WELL, WE WERE, PIPE THAT PUMPS WATER OUTTA THE QUARRY, CROSS
[03:25:01]
THE ROAD AND THEN TO THE TRIBUTARY ALL DAY LONG.AND GEORGE, I'M SURE YOU GUYS HAVE SEEN IT WHEN YOU DRIVE OVER THERE.
CORK THAT THING AND, AND THEN CONNECT IT, LET IT FILL UP AND THEN CONNECT IT TO THE WATER SUPPLY.
WHEN WE WERE TALKING ABOUT THAT PARTICULAR THING, I HAD MENTIONED THAT, UH, THAT AT SOME POINT, UH, BECAUSE EVERYTHING THAT WE DO IN THE, UH, NORTH CORRIDOR FOR COMMERCIAL, WE'VE GOTTA GO BACK AND ASK THE TOWN FOR PERMISSION WHETHER WE CAN GET ENOUGH WATER OR NOT TO RUN IT.
I THINK AT SOME POINT ON THAT END OF TOWN, WE OUGHT TO BE FINDING OUR OWN WATER SOURCE.
AND I THINK THE COUNTY OUGHT TO GO IN THE WATER BUSINESS AND NOT BE DEPENDENT ON FRONT ROYAL, UH, THAT WAY.
'CAUSE IT, IT SEEMS TO BE A BIT OF A, UH, A RESTRAINT, UH, ON OUR GROWTH.
'CAUSE AT SOME POINT THEY'RE GONNA RUN OUT.
THEY'RE GONNA, YOU KNOW, BETWEEN THEIR OWN EXPANSION IN TOWN AND, AND THINGS LIKE THAT, UNLESS THEY DUMP A BUNCH OF MONEY IN THEIR SITE OR DO ANOTHER SITE.
SO, UH, YOU KNOW, NOT, YOU KNOW, NOT TOMORROW, BUT I'D SAY SOMETIME IN THE FUTURE, DEPENDING ON WHAT THOSE COMMERCIAL NEEDS ARE, UH, IT'S GONNA BE A HIGH DEMAND FOR WATER.
I DID, UH, TEXT THE, UH, SOIL GUY AND HE SAID THERE IS NO MINIMUM SETBACK FOR WELL TO, WELL IN THE STATE FROM GUY PRETTY WELL TRUST.
HE SAID IT'S ALL BASED ON LOCAL AUTHORITIES.
BUT I THINK IT'S A FUNCTIONAL THING TO ACTUALLY DRILL A WELL.
AND IF IT'S, UM, TWO DIFFERENT PROPERTIES, THERE'S A SETBACK PROPERTY LINE FIVE.
SO MAYBE THAT'S WHERE 10 FEET.
IT'S, IT'S FIVE TO THE PROPERTY LINE.
WELL, SO YEAH, I THINK WE DID MENTION SOME LANGUAGE REGARDING THE REDUNDANT LINE THAT THE TOWN IS CURRENTLY HAS UNDER CONSTRUCTION INTO THE CORRIDOR.
UM, WHICH THERE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S AGAIN FOR PUBLIC STORM WATER TO THE CORRIDOR.
I THINK THAT WAS DRIVEN MOSTLY BY THE DOMINION POWER PLANT THERE.
SO, UH, WE CAN ADD THE ADDITIONAL ITEMS THAT YOU WERE, WELL, THERE WAS AN AGREEMENT ORIGINALLY SIGNED IN 1999.
RIGHT? WHAT'S THAT CALLED? THE, UM, THERE'S THE PILOT AGREEMENT VOLUNTARY FROM A PILOT, PILOT AGREEMENT.
THE VOLUNTARY SETTLEMENT IN WHICH THE, THE TOWN WAS VERY MOTIVATED NOT TO HAVE THE COUNTY BRING IN WATER FROM FREDERICK AND, AND ACTUALLY COMMITTED TO PROVIDE INDUSTRIAL AND COMMERCIAL TO THE EXTENT THAT THEY HAVE IT AVAILABLE.
BUT THEY'RE ALWAYS GONNA, THEY'RE GONNA, IF THEY DON'T HAVE IT AVAILABLE, THEN THEY'LL SAY IT'S THE ONLY THING FINANCIALLY PROFITING THEM UP.
IF YOU DON'T THINK IT'S NO MONEY TO BE MADE IN WATER, PUT IT OUT TO PRIVATE SECTOR AND SEE IF SOMEBODY WON'T BUY YOUR WATER RIGHTS UP AND SELL YOU WATER BACK.
AND CLARK AND FREDERICK AND EVERY COUNTY THEY CAN GET A PIPE TO.
SOUNDS LIKE THE, THE COST OF BRING, UH, THAT I'VE LOOKED AT, THE COST OF BRINGING ANYTHING FROM FREDERICK COUNTY IF THERE WAS SOMETHING IN FREDERICK COUNTY IS ASTRONOMICALLY HIGH.
UM, AND THAT THE MCKAY BRINGS IS A, IS A SENSITIVE AND FRAGILE SITUATION THAT PROBABLY DOESN'T HAVE THAT MUCH WATER ANYWAY.
UH, AT LEAST NOT WITHOUT CA CABAN IN PEOPLE'S, UH, PROPERTY.
SO, AND, AND THE IDEA OF THE, OF THE RESERVOIRS OR THE, THE QUARRIES, IT ADDS NOT, UM, IT ADDS A STORAGE COMPONENT.
SO A BUFFER, UH, CAPACITY, WHICH CAN BE VERY IMPORTANT.
UM, 'CAUSE IT CAN LET YOU LAST.
THAT WATER COMES FROM SOMEWHERE.
THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S A HUGE AMOUNT OF WATER TOO.
MAYBE THE COUNTY KIND OF HELPING OR MAYBE JOINING THE TOWN TO FACILITATE A CAPITAL PROJECT IN THAT ARENA OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT MIGHT BE A WAY TO REALLY GET IT GOING IN THAT DIRECTION.
BUT ONE THING, YOU'RE, I'M NOT AGAINST THEM, BUT THEY'RE SO HARD TO WORK WITH
WELL, MIND WELL THAT'S OUR, ONE OF OUR GOALS IS TO IS TO, TO, UH, WORK COOPERATIVELY.
UH, WATER IN THE CORRIDOR, THERE'S JUST NOT THAT MUCH LAND LEFT OUT THERE.
UH, THERE'S A, A FAIRLY LIMITED ADDITIONAL STOCK OF COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL LAND.
AM I RIGHT ABOUT THAT? THAT'S CORRECT.
SO IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST LIMITED AND, UM, AND IT'S DEFINITELY, IT IS SO LIMITED AND THE COUNTY REALLY NEEDS THAT COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL REVENUE.
UM, AND IF IT'S, IF WATER IS NOT AVAILABLE, THEN THAT'S OBVIOUSLY GONNA BE A ZERO.
UM, SO I, I SECOND, UM, MR. HENRY'S COMMENTS THERE ABOUT THAT, BUT I'LL JUST SAY ALONG THOSE LINES, UM, THE TOWN NOW IS, IS REQUIRING THE BOARD TO REQUEST, UH, AGAIN, THIS WAS THEIR PROCESS, BUT THEY NEVER REALLY FOLLOWED IT.
SO NOW THEY'RE REQUIRING THE BOARD TO REQUEST THE WATER FOR THE INDUSTRIAL LAND USE THAT COMES IN.
[03:30:01]
BASED ON WHAT THAT INDUSTRIAL LAND USE IS, CAN I GUESS, VOTED IT UP OR VOTE IT DOWN.MOST OF OUR INDUSTRIAL LAND USES THAT ARE COMING IN ARE WAREHOUSE DISTRIBUTION, WHICH DOESN'T REALLY SCARE INTENSIVE THAT MUCH.
IT'S NOT A BIG DEAL 'CAUSE IT'S A LOT.
BUT IF WE HAD A BUSINESS THAT CAME IN THAT COULD GENERATE, YOU KNOW, NEEDED THE WATER AND COULD GENERATE A LOT OF REVENUE FOR THE COUNTY AND WHATNOT, WE'D BE AT THEIR BECK AND HALL AS TO WHETHER THEY WOULD PROVIDE THAT FOR THAT INDUSTRIAL USE.
YEAH, I MEAN THAT, THAT'S CONSISTENT WITH THE VOLUNTARY, IT'S A CHALLENGE.
THAT CONTRADICTS THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT BECAUSE IN THE SETTLEMENT AGREEMENT IT SAYS THAT THEY'LL PROVIDE WATER FOR INDUSTRIAL USE.
I THINK THEY STILL LEAVE THEMSELVES A, A CORON TO, TO SAY IF WE HAVE IT, AND THAT THIS NEW PROCESS IS BASICALLY THEM SAYING, WELL, DO WE HAVE IT? AND I, I THINK THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT IT'S, WHY IT'S COME ABOUT IS THERE'S LANGUAGE IN THERE.
UM, I'LL JUST MENTION ALSO WITH THE ADDITION OF THE BROADBAND INFRASTRUCTURE.
UH, IT WAS BROUGHT UP DURING OUR COMMUNITY OUTREACH MEETING ABOUT, UH, CELL PHONE COVERAGE, CELL COVERAGE, AND, UH, WE'LL HAVE TO PROBABLY ADD SOMETHING RELATING TO THAT.
UM, MOST OF THOSE MEMBERS WERE IN YOUR DISTRICT IN BROWNTOWN MM-HMM.
SO, UM, WE'LL PUT SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE TO, YOU KNOW, CONSIDER, YOU KNOW, FURTHER, YOU KNOW, PLANS OR OUTREACH OR WHATEVER TO BE ABLE TO GET THAT FULL COVERAGE FOR, UH, OR BETTER COVERAGE FOR RIGHT.
I ACTUALLY, UH, TALKED TO THE VERIZON PERSON WHO WAS AT BAY COVE, THE EXHIBITOR, AND GAVE HIM MY CARD AND SAID, WE NEED TO HAVE A TALK ABOUT THIS AREA.
SO I REACH OUT WHENEVER I CAN THAT PLEASE LET US KNOW.
UM, WE HAVE SERVICENOW IN OUR AREA, WHICH WE DIDN'T HAVE, UM, WITH VERIZON.
SO, SO MAYBE IT'S COMING EVERY OPPORTUNITY I GET, I DRIVE, JUST FOR CLARIFICATION ON MY PART WITH THE LANGUAGE.
SO WHEN WE SEE, UM, BROADBAND IN INFRASTRUCTURE, WE'RE SAYING FOR THE COUNTY, RIGHT? WE'RE NOT TARGETING A DISTRICT OR AN AREA.
IT'S ACROSS THE WHOLE, THE WHOLE COUNTY.
THE WHOLE COUNTY, WHOLE COUNTY.
IT'S JUST TO ADD, WE, WE HAVE 80% COVERAGE NOW THAT'S FROM THE BARE MINIMUM SPEEDS AVAILABLE, BUT WE DO HAVE 80% COVERAGE OF THE COUNTY CURRENTLY.
UM, SO TO FILL IN THOSE GAPS, THE AREAS THAT ARE UNDERSERVED OR NOT SERVED AT ALL, WE JUST WANTED TO ADDRESS, UM, SOME LANGUAGE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
THERE ARE A COUPLE OF, UM, YOU KNOW, LITTLE SNAPSHOTS OF THE COVERAGE IN THE COUNTY, AND THEN WE'LL ADD THAT CELLULAR AS WELL.
UM, CAN I, CAN I ASK YOU, I, I WENT TO THE BROADBAND AND DR. HOLMES WAS THERE, AND SHE'S THE HEAD OF BROADBAND OUT OF THE DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT, WHICH WAS REALLY GOOD TO HAVE HER THERE.
UM, IF YOU TOOK YOUR 80% OFF THE FEDERAL, SHE SHOWED US THAT YESTERDAY AND SHE SAID THOSE NUMBERS ARE OFF LAW.
SO I, I'M JUST PUTTING THAT OUT THERE.
THAT, UM, THERE WERE QUITE A FEW COUNTIES THERE, AND LET'S JUST SAY THAT WAS A HEATED DISCUSSION ABOUT BROADBAND.
SHE BROUGHT IT UP AND SHOWED US AND SHE SAID THE, THE NUMBERS ARE JUST FLAWED.
THEY ARE, IF YOU'RE USING THE FEDERAL NUMBERS, I CAN ACTUALLY TELL YOU IN JUST ONE SECOND AND, AND I'LL JUST MENTION, UH, YOU KNOW, WE'RE KIND OF GOING DOWN THESE AS A BULLETED ITEMS. UM, THERE ARE SUPPLEMENTAL APPENDICES IN THE COMP PLAN THAT WILL HELP YOU KIND OF TAKE A LOOK.
I MEAN, WE'VE INCLUDED BOTH OF THE, UH, PLANNING REPORTS FOR THE ROCKLAND DISTRICT AND THE BROWNTOWN DISTRICT.
AND THEN ALSO, UH, WE COULDN'T GET HER AWAY WITH DOING A COMP PLAN WITHOUT HAVING SOME REALLY GOOD MAPS.
SO WE'VE ADDED A BUNCH OF MAPS THIS TIME AROUND.
JAMESON, THE PRO, UH, PROCESS OF, UH, POTENTIALLY HAVING MORE BUILDABLE LOTS IN THE R ONE ZONING DISTRICT.
SO WE'VE GOT SOME SLOPE MAPS THAT, UH, THAT SHOWS SOME OF THOSE LOTS.
I THINK THAT THAT'D BE VERY HELPFUL.
AND, UM, JUST A LOT OF VERY GOOD INFORMATION THAT YOU, YOU CAN GET FROM THOSE MAPS.
SO WE ASKED YOU TO LOOK AT THOSE.
SO I WAS ABLE TO CONFIRM THAT DATA SOURCE, WHICH WAS COMMONWEALTH CONNECTION.
UM, YEAH, WE DID INCLUDE LANGUAGE, UM, THAT THE N-S-V-R-C HAD A 2022 ACCELERATED FIBER DEPLOYMENT
[03:35:01]
INITIATIVE AIMING TO MAKE HIGH SPEED INTERNET AVAILABLE TO UNSERVED AREAS IN THE COMMISSION SERVICE AREA, INCLUDING WARREN COUNTY.UH, THEY HAD OVER 2100 SITES IN WARREN COUNTY THAT THEY IDENTIFIED AS NOT BEING SERVED.
UM, SO IT WAS THE LARGEST BROADBAND INITIATIVE IN VIRGINIA IN THE DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT AWARDED A $97 MILLION GRANT, UH, TO COVER EIGHT COUNTIES IN PORTIONS OF NORTHERN VIRGINIA IN THE NORTHERN SHENANDOAH VALLEY.
THEY SAID THEY WERE EXPECTED TO DELAY 3,700 MILES OF FIBER OPTIC COVERAGE OVER A THREE YEAR PERIOD.
SUPPOSEDLY SUPPOSED TO END IN 2025 AT SOME POINT.
NOT SURE WHERE WE ARE CURRENTLY ON THAT, BUT NOWHERE CLOSE
BUT WE CAN LOOK INTO OTHER DATA SOURCES OUTSIDE OF COMMONWEALTH CONNECTION.
YEAH, IT DIDN'T, I THINK THE, A LOT OF THE PROVIDERS, UM, SAY THAT'S MY SERVICE AREA AND I SURVEY IT AND THEY INCLUDE IT AND THEY'RE NOT.
YEAH, IT DID, THE STATISTICS DID MATCH UP WITH AT LEAST WHAT WE RECEIVED IN CITIZEN COMMENTS THROUGH THE SURVEY RESPONSES.
BUT OBVIOUSLY WE'RE NOT GETTING SURVEY RESPONSES FROM EVERY CITIZEN WITHIN THE COMMUNITY.
UM, AND 20% OF THE SURVEY RESPONDENTS STATED THEY DID NOT HAVE BROADBAND INTERNET ACCESS.
SO, SO, UM, HAVE YOU CONSIDERED, UH, FOR THE, UH, INFRASTRUCTURE INCLUDING THE AIRPORT IN HERE? IT IS.
WE JUST, THERE WEREN'T MANY UPDATES TO IT.
UM, CORY GRIFFITH, OUR GIS COORDINATOR, ACTUALLY CREATED A PRETTY AMAZING MAP OF AN AIRPORT OVERLAY.
UM, IT'S A PRETTY INTERESTING MAP IF YOU HAVE A MOMENT TO, TO LOOK OVER THAT.
YEAH, THAT WAS THE SLOPE GLIDE, UH, SLOPE.
GLIDE PATH, IS THAT IT? GLIDE PATH.
SO IT'S A PRETTY GOOD, GOOD MAP.
UM, SO, AND I THINK THERE'S ABOUT A PAGE AND A CLOSE TO A PAGE AND A HALF ON THE AVIATION RAIL SERVICE IN INLAND PORT IN CONSTRUCTION.
THE REASON I, I, I MENTIONED THIS IS BECAUSE THE, UH, I THINK THAT, UH, THE AIRPORT WOULD BE A GREAT, YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU HAVE HIKING, BIKING, AND RAIL MM-HMM.
AND, UH, THE AIRPORT WOULD BE A GREAT, UH, OPPORTUNITY TO THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS, THE AIRPORT COMMISSION, UM, ADVERTISING THIS, YOU KNOW, THROUGH THE, THROUGH THE VARIOUS, UH, UH, COMMUNICATIONS ABOUT FLYING INTO FRONT ROYAL AND, UH, YOU KNOW, ENJOYING OF, UM, THE, UM, UM, WHAT IS IT, THE SKYLINE DRIVE ENJOYING THIS AREA BECAUSE IT'S A, UH, VERY HISTORICAL, SOMETHING ELSE YOU CAN ADD FOR THE AIRPORT AS WELL.
INFRASTRUCTURE, THEY, THEY, THEY'RE LACKING BROADBAND OR INTERNET CONNECTION OUT THERE AS WELL.
SO WE DO HAVE, IN INFRASTRUCTURE, ASIDE FROM OUTSIDE OF THE MAIN HOT TOPICS, WE DO HAVE RIDE SHARING, PARK AND RIDE LOTS, TAXI SERVICE, OTHER TRANSIT SERVICE, THE AVIATION RAIL SERVICE, AND INLAND PORT HIKING AND BIKE TRAILS, THE RAIL TO TRAIL INITIATIVE AS WELL.
SO WE COVERED A MULTITUDE OF DIFFERENT INFRASTRUCTURE TOPICS.
UM, THERE JUST WEREN'T TOO TERRIBLY MANY UPDATES TO FOCUS ON.
SO MOST OF THE PEOPLE IN THAT AREA ARE NOT WANTING MUCH FOR EXPANSION THERE.
AND THEN, UH, FROM A GEOGRAPHY STANDPOINT, THAT, UH, THE WAY THE MOUNTAIN IS ON ONE SIDE AND THE POWER LINE ON THE OTHER, UH, IT DOESN'T LEND ITSELF WELL TO, TO EXPANSION.
YOU'RE, YOU'RE RIGHT ABOUT THAT.
IT, IT IS KIND OF A TOUGH ONE.
SO, OH, THE GLIDER CLUB, I LIVE REAL CLOSE TO IT.
THE GLIDER SCARE THE HELL OUT OF YOU IN THE YARD AND SHADOW OF A PLANE COMES OVER, BUT THERE'S NO NOISE.
AND YOU'LL THINK, WHAT IN THE WORLD IS THAT COMING THERE? BUT IT, UH, YOU JUST HEAR A LITTLE, JUST A LITTLE WHISTLE GOING BY.
OH, SO THE PROMOTION OF AN ANNUAL BLUE ANGELS FESTIVAL WOULD NOT
YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT ABOUT THAT.
I MEAN, YOU KNOW, OH, I, I JUST, YOU KNOW, IT IS NOT GONNA MEET A WIN.
IT'LL NEVER BE LIKE WINCHESTER AIRPORT.
IT'S, IT'S NOT GONNA MEET THAT THE PEOPLE OUT THERE THROW A FIT OVER IT AND THEN, UH, THEY CRASH THE TOPOGRAPHY.
I JUST DON'T THINK IT'LL ALLOW IT.
I MEAN, AGAIN, THAT, THAT'S WHAT SETS WARREN COUNTY APART FROM, FROM OTHER AREAS.
UM, I'LL, I'LL MENTION JUST ONE OF THE THINGS WE ADDED ALSO, UM, WAS THE NORTHERN SHENANDOAH VALLEY REGIONAL COMMISSION HAS A COMMUTER, UH, RIDE SHARE, UH, PROGRAM THAT THEY'RE, THEY'RE GETTING READY TO, UH, GET GOING IN DECEMBER CALLED OMNI RIDE.
AND SO WE, UH, WE INCLUDED THAT, UH, BECAUSE WE ARE SO CLOSE TO THAT.
THEY'VE BEEN WORKING ON THAT AND THEY'VE HAD RIDESHARE
[03:40:01]
PROGRAMS FOR ON AND OFF FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS.AND, AND, UH, SO THEY'RE REALLY EXCITED ABOUT THAT.
AND IT'LL, IT'LL VERY MUCH BENEFIT, UH, THE CITIZENS OF THE COUNTY WITH, UH, COMMUTES TO NORTHERN VIRGINIA AND DC.
SO, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS ONE THING SINCE YOU MENTIONED THAT, YOU KNOW, I, I USED TO, TO DRIVE INTO DC OR, YOU KNOW, GO DOWN TO BROAD RUN AND PICK UP THE, UH, UH, RAIL OVER THERE.
AND HAS THERE, AND SOMEBODY HAD MENTIONED THIS WAS YEARS AGO, THAT THEY WERE GONNA POSSIBLY EXTEND THE RAIL SERVICE OUT TO AFTER THIS PORT.
HAVE YOU, OR AFTER THIS PART, HAVE YOU EVER HEARD OF ANY TALK ABOUT THAT? THE RAIL SERVICE? YEAH.
I'VE TRIED TALKING 'EM INTO PUTTING A MONO RAIL BETWEEN WARREN COUNTY AND NORTHERN VIRGINIA, BUT, UH, I THINK THAT'S TOO EXPENSIVE FOR THEIR BLOOD.
BUT, UH, UH, NO, I'VE, I'VE NOT HEARD OF THAT.
THIS IS, UH, THEY HAVE A COMMUTER BUS, UH, AS PART OF THIS PROGRAM, AND THEN ALSO VAN AND CARPOOLS THAT YOU CAN WORK WITH.
AND, UM, I THINK VERY, VERY GOOD, GOOD RATES.
UH, SO, UM, THEY'RE EXCITED ABOUT IT.
AND WE'RE, WE'VE ACTUALLY PUT SOME INFORMATION ON OUR WEBSITE AND, AND FACEBOOK PAGE TO HELP PROMOTE THAT.
AND THEN AS FAR AS THE RAIL TO TRAIL INITIATIVES, UM, RIGHT NOW THAT'S KIND OF STUCK AT A STATE LEVEL.
I DON'T KNOW, YOU'VE PROBABLY READ A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT.
AND THERE'S A, A, A COMPONENT OF, OF FOLKS WHO WANT TO DO IT RAIL WITH TRAIL, AND THEN ANOTHER THAT WANT TO DO RAIL TWO TRAIL.
UM, THE STUDIES HAVE BEEN DONE FOR THE RAIL TWO TRAIL, NOW THEY'RE GONNA GO AHEAD AND DO A STUDY WITH THE RAIL, UH, WITH TRA TRAIL.
AND THEN, I GUESS, UH, SO IS IT GOING TO HAPPEN ONE WAY OR ANOTHER AFTER THEY SORT THAT, OR
I, I, I JUST, I KNOW THAT THEY HAVE ALLOTTED, UH, MILLIONS OF DOLLARS TO YEAH.
YOU KNOW, TO ACCESS TO GET THE EASEMENTS AND WHATNOT AND DO I THINK SOME OF THE SURVEY AND WHATNOT.
BUT, UM, I THINK AT THIS POINT IN TIME, IT'S GONNA BE A KIND OF WAIT AND SEE AND IT'S OKAY.
IT'S ALMOST, I THINK IT'S KIND OF A POLITICAL THING.
IS THERE SOMETHING WE CAN DO A RESOLUTION AND KIND OF PILE ON OR, OR, YOU KNOW, ED, WHAT DO YOU THINK? ARE YOU TRYING TO KILL IT OR TRYING TO NO, I WANT IT DONE.
IT WE'RE, YEAH, TELL 'EM TO QUIT PLAYING WITH IT.
DO WHAT THEY STARTED WITH ORIGINALLY.
THAT'S THE WHOLE PURPOSE OF THAT IS TO DELAY AND KILL IT.
SO THE RAIL WIDTH TRAIL IS A RUSE AND IT'S REALLY KILL IT.
S**T, I KNOW AT ONE TIME WHEN I WAS ON THE TOWN PLANNING COMMISSION, THERE WAS A GUY OUT OFF OF HAPPY CREEK ROAD WHERE THE SOLAR FARM IS NOW.
CAME WITH A PROPOSAL TO BUILD A RAIL YARD THERE, BASICALLY, OR A PARKING COMMUTER LOT THERE.
BASICALLY THE FORCE, THE RAILROAD START RUNNING A COMMUTER TRAIN OUT HERE.
AND NORFOLK SOUTHERN WE GOT, EVERYBODY IS BASICALLY, THERE AIN'T NO WAY.
AND YOU KNOW WHERE MM-HMM,
WELL, I WAS LATE TODAY, SO, UM, OKAY.
UH, HAVE
IF, IF YOU WANNA GO GRAB IT, LET, LEMME JUST GRAB THAT AND THEN, BECAUSE I, I DON'T HAVE IT ATTACHED TO THIS, SO I'D HAVE TO GO AND UPLOAD IT TO THE COMPUTER IN THERE.
UM, SO NEW MAPS THAT WE ADDED TO CHAPTER SEVEN, WE WENT FROM HAVING ROUGHLY FIVE MAPS IN OUR INFRASTRUCTURE, CHAPTER TWO 14.
UM, AND COREY DID A PHENOMENAL JOB CREATING THESE MAPS.
UH, WE ADDED VDOT ROAD CONDITIONS, SO THE CURRENT STANDINGS, UM, AROUND THE COUNTY, OUR PROPOSED ROAD IMPROVEMENTS, THE SIX YEAR IMPROVEMENT PLAN, THE ROUTE 3 45, 22 NORTH CORRIDOR TRANSPORTATION PLAN, SANITARY DISTRICTS, THE, UH, VDOT ROADS IN SHENANDOAH FARMS, THE AIRPORT OVERVIEW, BICYCLE PEDESTRIAN TRAILS, THE SMART SCALE APPLICATIONS AND STAR STUDIES ARE THE NEWEST ADDITIONS, WHEREAS THE OTHER ONES WERE JUST EDITED AND UPDATED.
WITH THAT, I CAN, BEFORE WE JUMP INTO THE FUTURE LAND USE, UM, JUST LASTLY, CHAPTER EIGHT IMPLEMENTATIONS WERE OBVIOUSLY UPDATED TO REFLECT THOSE THAT WERE UP UPDATED THROUGHOUT CHAPTERS THREE THROUGH SEVEN.
WE DO NOT HAVE ANY GOALS, OBJECTIVES, OR IMPLEMENTATIONS IN CHAPTERS ONE AND TWO, UH, JUST THREE THROUGH SEVEN.
WE CREATED A SCHEDULE FOR THOSE IMPLEMENTATIONS, WHICH WILL BE ADDED AS AN APPENDIX ITEM.
SO IF MATT WANTS TO MOVE ON TO THE PROPOSED FUTURE LAND USE CORRIDOR MAP.
SO IF YOU WANT TO ASK, HOW MANY OF YOU HAVE HAD AN OPPORTUNITY TO LOOK AT THE STORY MAP ON THE COUNTY WEBSITES? HAS ANY OF Y'ALL BEEN ABLE TO
[03:45:01]
DO THAT? UH, IT WAS A GIS PROJECT THAT OUR INTERN WORKED WITH CO ON THIS SUMMER.AND BASICALLY IT'S, UH, A GIS MAP BASED MAPS, UH, STORY MAP.
THEY CALL THE STORY MAP 'CAUSE THERE'S TEXT INVOLVED WITH IT, THERE'S PHOTOS INVOLVED WITH IT.
IT'S, IT'S LAND USE THROUGH THE AGES OF WARREN COUNTY.
AND THEN, UH, SOME OF THE NEWER DATA, WE ACTUALLY HAVE SOME, UH, AERIAL IMAGERY THAT GOES BACK TO THE 1930S.
AND, UH, YEAH, SORRY ABOUT THAT.
UH, IT GOES BACK TO THE 1930S, FIFTIES AND, UH, AND THEN TO THE PRESENT.
AND THERE'S SOME REALLY, REALLY COOL AND GIS UH, LITTLE TOOLS IN WIDGETS THAT YOU CAN USE.
SO I'D ASK YOU IF YOU HAVE IT, IT, IT 10 MINUTES AND IT JUST GO THROUGH IT.
AND, UH, WE'RE REAL PROUD OF THAT.
THE, UH, OUR INTERN DID A GREAT LITTLE GREAT JOB ON THAT.
UM, BUT I JUST ASK, UM, AND MAYBE THE GENERAL PUBLIC CAN DO THAT ALSO.
SO, UM, WHAT I WANTED TO DO IS KIND OF GO OVER SOME OF THE PROPOSED, AND AGAIN, THESE ARE PROPOSED, UM, CHANGES FOR THE 5 22 3 40 CORRIDOR CORRIDOR FOR FUTURE LAND USE.
IF WE LOOK DOWN HERE AT THE BOTTOM, THIS IS OUR CURRENT FUTURE LAND USE MAP.
AND THE CURRENT FU FUTURE LAND USE MAP INCLUDES THE PURPLE AREA HERE, WHERE WE'VE GOT AN ACTIVE, UH, REZONING APPLICATION FOR SLATE RUN FARM, UH, WHICH WAS TABLED.
UM, AND, UM, AND THEY HAVE ACTUALLY REQUESTED IT, UH, TO, UH, CONTINUE TO BE TABLED.
WE'RE GONNA BE BRINGING THAT FORWARD TO YOU HERE SHORTLY.
UM, BUT, UM, WE WERE KINDA LOOKING AT THAT, UH, KIND OF BASED ON A LOT OF THE COMMENTS WE HEARD FROM, UH, BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS OF FOLKS WHO LIVED THERE AND HOW THAT WAS THEIR MB ISSUE, UH, UH, FOR THE YEAR.
AND, UH, DIDN'T REALLY HAVE A GOOD FEEL ABOUT THE, UH, PROPOSED POTENTIAL FOR PROPOSED WAREHOUSE DISTRIBUTION CENTER.
AND THEN ALSO THE COST OF A, A BRIDGE TO BRIDGE OVER, UH, CROOKED RUN AND IN THAT AREA.
AND THAT'S GONNA IMPACT ANYWHERE ALONG HERE ALONG THIS CROOKED RUN FLOODPLAIN AREA.
I THINK THE ONE THAT, UH, THEY DID FOR BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS GOLF COURSE STARTED AT ABOUT 11 MILLION, PROBABLY ENDED UP AROUND 15 MILLION IN THAT BALLPARK WHEN IT WAS ALL SAID AND DONE.
BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, THE BRIDGE THAT THEY WERE PROPOSING, AND IT WOULD BE FOR, FOR TRACTOR TRAILERS, IS PROBABLY GONNA BE LOOKING AT A 30, $40 MILLION BRIDGE.
THAT'S A LOT OF INFRASTRUCTURE COSTS FOR, UH, FOR, UM, DEVELOPMENT FOR INDUSTRIAL.
SO, UM, WE KIND OF JUST KIND OF PUT OUR HEADS TOGETHER AND THOUGHT, WELL, LET'S SEE WHAT WE COULD DO.
AND THEN IT TURNS OUT THE NEIGHBOR WHO, UH, HAPPENS TO KNOW THE, UH, THE PROPERTY OWNERS PRETTY WELL CAME IN AND SAID, I WANT, I WANT MY PROPERTY TO BE FUTURE LAND USE FOR RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
YOU KNOW WHAT I WAS SAYING, WORTH FOR RESIDENTIAL? I SAID, WELL, YOU COULD PROBABLY DO RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
THAT MIGHT BE THE BETTER OF THE, THE TWO.
'CAUSE THE DENSITY IS, UH, A LITTLE, YOU GET A FIVE ACRE DENSITY FOR DWELLING, BUT TWO ACRE LOT SIZE, SAME AS AGRICULTURAL.
AND YOU STILL KEEP THAT, UH, RURAL FEEL TO THE COMMUNITY.
BUT, UH, YOU HAVE, UM, THE COMPONENT OF BEING RESIDENTIAL AND IT DOES ALLOW FOR SOME, SO, SO WHEN YOU SAY IT'S FIVE ACRE LOT SIZE, BUT TWO ACRES FOR THE DWELLING, IS THAT, IS THAT WHERE YOU CLUSTER IT? I'M SORRY, A TWO ACRE LOT SIZE FIVE ACRE DENSITY FOR DWELLINGS WITHIN THE, UH, COMMUNITY, BECAUSE A CERTAIN PART OF THAT HAS TO BE RESERVED FOR, UH, OPEN SPACE.
SO WE KIND OF THOUGHT, AND AGAIN, THIS IS JUST A PROPOSED, WE'RE KIND OF LOOKING AT THIS.
WE THOUGHT, WELL, WE'VE GOTTA, WE'VE GOTTA PRESERVE THIS AREA IN A FLOOD PLANT ANYWAY.
UM, THERE'S SOME STEEP SLOPE, I WON'T SAY STEEP SLOPE, BUT SOME DRAINAGE SWS AND WHATNOT THROUGHOUT THIS PROPERTY THAT COULD POTENTIALLY COULD BE IDENTIFIED AS THAT OPEN SPACE CONSERVATE CONSERVED AREA.
AND, UH, IT HAS ACCESS FROM STATE ROADS, FROM THE BACK, A COUPLE OF STATE ROADS ACCESS IT.
SO IN LIEU OF HAVING TO BUILD AN EXPENSIVE BRIDGE, WE LOOKED AT THAT AND THEN WE THOUGHT, WELL, THERE'S STILL LAND.
HERE'S THE, HERE'S THE WINCHESTER ROAD.
THERE'S STILL LAND HERE THAT COULD BE PRESERVED FOR SOME, UH, INDUSTRIAL AND THEN AND COMMERCIAL HERE.
THESE ARE CURRENTLY AGRICULTURAL LOTS HERE THAT YOU SEE IN RED.
UM, THIS PO THIS LOT HERE IS NOT ZONED, UH, UH, COMMERCIAL, IT'S, IT'S STILL AGRICULTURAL BECAUSE IT IS JUST OUTSIDE OF THE FAIRGROUND ROAD, UH, BOUNDARY FOR THE TOWN SEWER AND WATER DISTRICT.
I DON'T WANT YOU TO GET CONFUSED.
THIS HERE, THIS, THE, THIS HERE WITH THE CROSS SA LINES IS OUR HIGHWAY CORRIDOR OVERLAY
[03:50:01]
DISTRICT.BUT, UM, SO THE TRADE OFF KIND OF IN TRADING, THIS IS A FUTURE INDUSTRIAL LAND USE IS A LOT HERE.
THAT'S JUST NORTH OF FAMILY DOLLAR.
IT HAS DIRECT ACCESS TO WINCHESTER ROAD.
THE PROPERTY TO THE NORTH IS UNDER A CONSERVATION EASEMENT, SO THAT WON'T EVER BE DEVELOPED, UH, BE USED FOR AG.
THERE IS A SMALL PORTION OF, UH, OF COMBINATION RESIDENTIAL AGRICULTURAL LOTS HERE.
BUT YOU KNOW, WITH, UH, OR BUFFERING AND SCREENING REGULATIONS, WE COULD POTENTIALLY, ANY DEVELOPMENT WE CAN OFFSET SOME OF THAT, UH, VISUAL, UM, UH, UH, PROBLEMS THERE THAT MAY, MAY COME OUT, YOU KNOW, OR CONCERNS, UH, THAT WOULD GO FOR ANY LIGHTING ALSO.
SO, UM, SO WE CAME UP WITH THAT, UH, THAT IS OWNED BY A COMPANY THAT'S OUTTA STATE.
UM, AND, UH, THEY'RE NOT, IT'S, I THINK THERE'S ONE HOUSE ON IT THAT'S BEING LEASED.
I DON'T EVEN THINK IT'S BEING FARMED IN ANY WAY RIGHT NOW.
UM, THEY MIGHT MAKE HAY ON IT.
UH, BUT IN ANY CASE, THAT WOULD BE KIND OF A TRADE OFF.
MOST OF OUR AREA HERE IS, UH, INDUSTRIAL.
WE'VE HAD A NUMBER OF LOTS IN THIS PAST YEAR, UH, THAT HAVE BEEN SOLD THE EDA LOTS THEMSELVES.
AND, UH, SOME OF THE OTHER LOTS ARE, ARE UNDER CONTRACT AND THEY ARE LOOKING AT INDUSTRIAL USES PRIMARILY FOR WAREHOUSING AND DISTRIBUTION, WHICH KIND OF TIES INTO OUR INLAND PORT.
UM, AND THE ACCESS TO THAT, UH, I'LL JUST MENTION HERE IN THIS LOWER AREA HERE, UM, THESE TWO LOTS HERE ARE ADJACENT TO EXISTING COMMERCIAL, UH, LAND, WHICH, WHICH IS JUST TO THE REAR OF CROOKED RUN SHOPPING CENTER.
UH, THE ACCESS WITHOUT HAVING TO BUILD A BRIDGE WOULD BE RELIANCE ROAD TO RIAU HOLLOW ROAD.
AND THEN THAT WOULD PROVIDE DIRECT ACCESS TO THESE, THESE FOUR LOTS WITHOUT HAVING TO BUILD AGAIN ANOTHER BRIDGE.
UH, THE A THE PROPERTY OWNERS DOWN HERE AND THE PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE KIND OF CAME TO ME AND SAID, WELL, WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT DOING A DATA CENTER THERE? I THOUGHT, WELL, I THINK THE BOARD WANTS TO SEE THAT.
AND WE, WE TRIED THAT A FEW YEARS AGO AND, UH, I THINK YOUR BEST BET MIGHT BE SOMETHING LIKE OFFICE BUILDINGS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
AND SO THEY SAID, WELL, UM, SO IT'S SOMETHING THAT WE COULD THINK ABOUT.
AGAIN, THESE ARE PROPOSED WHERE THIS WOULD BE ADJACENT TO AN EXISTING, UH, UH, PROPERTY THAT'S COMMERCIAL THAT IS DIRECTLY, I MEAN, YOU CAN SEE IT FROM, UH, 81.
BUT, UM, IT HAD, IT WOULD'VE TO BE ACCESSED HERE THROUGH THIS BACK WAY WE COULD POTENTIALLY GET PROFFERS FOR IMPROVEMENTS TO RELIANCE ROAD AND, UH, RIAU HOLLOW ROAD AND CERTAINLY, UH, MAYBE EVEN MOLLY CAMPBELL.
THERE'S A SMALL BRIDGE THERE THAT WE COULD POTENTIALLY GET IMPROVEMENTS TO.
BUT AGAIN, THIS IS JUST FUTURE LAND USE.
UM, IF WE WANNA SEE THAT KIND OF THING.
UM, I DON'T EXPECT YOU WOULD SEE A SHOPPING CENTER THERE, ALTHOUGH, WHO KNOWS? UH, BUT RIGHT NOW, UM, IT WOULD BE CONSISTENT WITH THE ADJACENT PROPERTY BEING AGRICULTURAL, OR EXCUSE ME, UH, COMMERCIAL, THE ADJACENT LOT TO THE NORTH IS A SMALL SUBDIVISION THAT'S, UH, ZONED.
R ONE PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE BEEN RURAL RESIDENTIAL AT LARGER LOT.
AND, UH, SO THE IMPACT TO THOSE NEIGHBORS, AGAIN, THERE'S SOME, UH, EXISTING WOODLANDS BUFFERING THAT COULD BE UTILIZED AND KEPT IN PLACE, UH, FOR ANY, UH, POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT OF THIS AREA.
SO, UM, AND WE IDENTIFY VERY BOTTOM, UH, I BELIEVE THIS IS THE PARCEL THAT THE COUNTY OWNS.
UM, THAT COULD POTENTIALLY BE AN INDUSTRIAL USE ALSO THAT JUST, JUST SOUTH OF, UH, DOMINION POWER.
SO, UM, SO WE ARE JUST KIND OF PUTTING THAT OUT THERE.
UM, I UNDERSTAND WE DO HAVE AN ACTIVE APPLICATION FOR REZONING.
UM, AND CERTAINLY IF THE APPLICANTS OF THAT WOULD WANT TO MEET WITH ME, I'LL BE GLAD TO GO OVER THIS WITH THEM.
UH, I THINK RIGHT NOW, UM, THEY HAVE, UH, EXPRESSED, UH, THESE COLORS THAT, UH, THEY WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE THAT, UH, TABLING OF THAT APPLICATION.
SO, UM, LEGALLY I'M NOT SURE WE CAN, WE CAN ADDRESS THAT WITH OUR LEGAL REQUIREMENT AS FAR AS AN ACTIVE APPLICATION FOR THIS PROPERTY.
IT MAY BE THAT WE WOULD'VE TO DIS LEAVE THAT FUTURE LAND INDUSTRIAL LONG AS THAT ANOTHER GOOD APPLICATION.
BUT, UH, THESE ARE JUST SOME THOUGHTS AND WE'D LIKE TO HEAR ANY COMMENTS OR IF YOU WANT, UH, DIGEST IT LITTLE BIT, GET BACK TO US.
[03:55:01]
WE'LL, GLAD TO.I'D BE THE, MAKE A COMMENT IF IT'S OKAY.
OH, I, I, I PERSONALLY THINK IT'S A TERRIBLE IDEA.
OH, THAT CORRIDOR IS THE ONLY LAND THAT WE GOT IS SUITED FOR COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL.
NOTHING IN SOUTH RIVER, NO INTERSTATE LINDEN'S ALREADY BUILT OUT.
THE BRIDGE WOULD BE TO THE BURDEN OF THE DEVELOPER.
IF YOU DO IT IN RURAL RESIDENTIAL, YOU STILL NEED A BRIDGE ACROSS IT.
EVERY ONE OF THOSE HOUSES ADDS LOW ON LOAD ON THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.
I THINK TO KEEP OUR TAXES UNDER CONTROL, I'D LIKE TO SEE EVERY BIT OF THAT GREEN RED.
OH, I, I AM STRONGLY, STRONGLY OPPOSED TO SWITCHING THAT TO A RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
I CAN SEE INCREASING THE BUFFER ZONE OFF OF BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS.
IF YOU LOOK AT THAT MAP, THERE'S YOUR SPOT ZONE.
THAT'S WHAT SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN THERE.
OH, THAT, THAT'S WHAT SHOULDN'T HAVE BEEN THERE.
OH, THAT'S SUB SUBURBAN RESIDENTIAL.
WELL, WHAT, YEAH, WHATEVER YOU YEAH, THAT, THAT'S THE SPOT ZONE.
I CAN SEE GIVING THEM SOME MORE BUFFER BECAUSE THEY'RE ALREADY THERE.
BUT TO SWITCH ALL THAT TO RURAL RESIDENTIAL, OH, YOU DIDN'T PUT ENOUGH RED TO OFFSET IT TO SUIT ME.
'CAUSE THAT, I JUST THINK IT LONG TERM THAT IS, UH, THAT IT'S GONNA ADD BURDEN, TAX BURDEN, NOT HELP IT.
I, THAT, THAT WHOLE SECTION I WOULD JUST LOVE TO SEE READ.
OH, BUT I, THAT'S THE BOARD'S DISCRETION.
UH, BUT IT'S, IF THAT'S ON THE PLANNING THING TOMORROW, I'M VOTING AGAINST IT.
I'LL JUST PUT IT TO YOU THAT WAY.
'CAUSE I, I JUST FEEL MY HEART THAT IT'S WRONG.
WELL, I MEAN, AGAIN, THAT'S WHY WE'RE HERE TONIGHT AND YOU KNOW, UM, YOU DO SAY RED, RED IS THE COMMERCIAL, COMMERCIAL OR INDUSTRIAL.
E EITHER PURPLE OR RED, I DON'T CARE.
I APPRECIATE YOU CLARIFYING FOR ME.
SO, UH, ANYWAY, AND I WOULD MENTION THAT IF THESE TWO PARCELS HERE WERE TO BE INCLUDED, UM, THE TOWN WOULD HAVE TO AGREE TO EXPANDING THEIR WARRANTS SEWER, UH, BOUNDARY FOR THAT NOT ALLOW FOR WATER AND SEWER TO BE PROVIDED FOR.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR NOW? I, I, I, UM, AGREE WITH MR. HENRY AS WELL.
I MEAN, I WAS ALWAYS TOLD THE CORRIDOR WAS GONNA BE FOR INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AND COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT.
I'VE EVER SINCE I'VE BEEN ON THIS BOARD AND NOW YOU'RE TAKEN AWAY FROM THAT, THAT CONCEPT.
I I THINK IT NEEDS TO BE, YOU, YOU NEED TO, UM, GO BACK TO THE ORIGINAL CONCEPT.
THE, BECAUSE YOU KNOW, OH, I'M SORRY IF I CAN BECAUSE WE NEED, WE NEED THAT LAND FOR REVENUE.
I MEAN WE CAN'T, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T BUILD ANYTHING IN THE TOWN.
I MEAN, THEIR REAL ESTATE IS JUST ABOUT GONE, YOU KNOW, AND IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE FOR THE TOWN, YOU KNOW, FOR THE CITIZENS, BUT OUT THERE IN THE CORRIDOR AND STUFF, THAT'S OUR REVENUE.
HE BROUGHT UP A VERY, THAT'S WHERE IT, GOOD POINT ABOUT THE FACT THAT THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT THE, UH, THAT THE OTHER AREAS, OTHER VIABLE AREAS WITHIN THE, THE COUNTY OF OR THE OTHER AREAS WITHIN THE COUNTY ARE NOT REALLY VIABLE THAT THIS IS, THIS IS YOUR BEST SHOT.
SO FIRST OF ALL, THE, THE, UM, LANDOWNER WHO SAID I'D LIKE MY LAND TO BECOME RESIDENTIAL, UM, HOW MUCH DOES THAT FACTOR IN? LIKE WHAT SORT OF, UH, DOES, DOES HIS WILLINGNESS TO EVER SELL TO THE PROPERTY OR, OR DO SOMETHING ELSE WITH IT, YOU KNOW, HINGE ON WHAT IT, WHAT IT'S ZONED TO BECOME? WELL, IT, I'LL JUST SAY THE ONE LANDOWNER OWNS, I THINK IT'S THESE THREE PARCELS HERE.
AND, UH, I THINK A PART OF THAT IS SOMEWHAT FOR ESTATE PLANNING, UH, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK HIS, HIS CHILDREN OR GRANDCHILDREN ACTUALLY WANT TO GO INTO FARMING OR, UM, AND SO HE'S KIND OF THINKING ALONG THE LINES, WELL IF I CAN SUBDIVIDE THIS A LITTLE BIT MORE, UH, MAYBE GET A FEW MORE LOTS OUT OF IT, THEN I COULD WITH AG OR, OR YOU KNOW, EVEN, I MEAN FOR IN AG HE COULD POTENTIALLY EVEN DO A CLUSTER SUBDIVISION AGAIN, IF, IF, IF, UH, UM, SOMEONE WANTED TO BUILD A STATE ROAD.
UM, THERE'S, THERE'S OTHER FACTORS I THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, WERE WANTING HE BASICALLY A BUTTS UP TO THE BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS.
SO THAT WAS KIND OF A, I THINK ANOTHER PART OF WHAT HIS THOUGHTS WERE.
UM, THESE FOLKS HERE, UM, YEAH.
HOW MUCH IS, HOW MUCH IS CURRENTLY UNDER HOLD UNDER,
[04:00:01]
UH, APPLICATION? THAT'S ABOUT 440 ACRES.IS THAT THE, THE WHOLE THING? THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S EVERYTHING EXCEPT THESE THREE LOTS.
THAT'S EVERYTHING NORTH OF THOSE THREE, ALL OF THESE AND NOT, NOT INCLUDING THESE LITTLE LOTS HERE.
WHAT, WHAT ARE, WHAT ARE THE LITTLE GRAY AREAS THERE THAT, WHAT, WHAT IS THAT NOW? WHAT ARE THOSE LITTLE THINGS? THOSE ARE SINGLE FAMILY.
SO, AND THEN THIS, WE JUST SHOWED THIS AS A, LIKE A CONSERVATION BUFFER ADJACENT TO THE, UH, CROOKED RUN.
BUT THIS, THIS ACTUALLY GOES, IF YOU LOOKED AT IT FROM THE ZONING CURRENT PLANT, FUTURE LAND, USE IT, IT LITERALLY GOES ALL THE WAY TO, UM, WINCHESTER ROAD, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE AREAS THAT ARE, UM, LIKE THIS IS, UH, AGRICULTURAL CURRENTLY, THESE ARE ALL AGRICULTURAL CURRENTLY.
SO THIS, IT GOES TO, UM, ACTUALLY THIS HERE IS I THINK THE FURTHEST NORTH, BUT ALL OF THIS WOULD BE THE BLUES JUST FLOODWAY, RIGHT? YEAH.
THAT'S THE, WE JUST WANTED TO BE ABLE TO SHOW THAT.
BLUES FLOOD PLANE AND, AND, AND A 50 FOOT CORY PUT A 50 FOOT BUFFER AROUND THE, COULD CONTRIBUTE TO THE OPEN SPACE THAT WOULD BE REQUIRED WITHIN THE RURAL RESIDE RURAL RESIDENTIAL.
I MEAN, AGAIN, THIS WAS, THIS IS, THIS IS A PROPOSED WITH THE RURAL RESIDENTIAL, NOT EXISTING.
THE EXISTING CURRENTLY INCLUDES EVERYTHING AS PURPLE, WHICH IS YOUR INDUSTRIAL, IT, IT'S INTERESTING, AGAIN, IT'S THIS DOUBLE-EDGED SWORD.
WE NEED THE, THE COMMERCIAL TAX BASE.
WE ALSO HAVE A HOUSING INVENTORY PROBLEM.
AND UH, I'M WONDERING IS, IS THERE ANY WAY THAT YOU COULD SPLIT THAT AND HAVE IT COMMERCIAL ON THE EASTERN SIDE TOWARD 5 22 3 40 AND HAVE IT BE RURAL RESIDENTIAL AS YOU GO FURTHER WEST? UM, YEAH.
THAT'S WHAT WE'VE DONE IS SO, SO THIS HERE IS THE, UH, IS THE CROOKED IS CROOKED RUN.
AND SO EVERYTHING KIND OF FROM CROOKED RUN AND THIS, THESE ARE LIKE REALLY STEEP SLOPE AREAS.
SO THAT GOES TO THE, TO THESE POINTS HERE.
SO RIGHT NOW, KIND OF, IF, IF YOU SEE MY FINGER THAT THAT'S PRETTY MUCH KIND OF WHERE THE, UM, EASTERN PORTION OF THE SLATE RUN PROPERTY AND THEN ALL THESE OTHER PROPERTIES WOULD BE PART OF THAT CORRIDOR.
UM, EITHER AS AGRICUL, UH, EITHER AS A COMMERCIAL OR INDUSTRIAL.
SO THERE IS, WE WERE KIND OF SAVING SOME OF IT OBVIOUSLY.
THE BIG THING WAS THE BRIDGE IS AVOIDING OKAY.
BUT ALL THE, ALL THE GREEN THAT'S, THAT'S NEW.
HE WAS SAYING THAT'S A TERRIBLE IDEA.
NEEDS TO BE ALL RED AND RED OR PURPLE CONCURS RED OR PURPLE RED OR PURPLE.
BUT LIKE, COULD YOU KIND OF BISECT THAT, UH, VERTICALLY DOWN THE MIDDLE AND, AND HAVE IT RED TO THE RIGHT OF THE GREEN PART, PUT IT RED ON THE RIGHT.
AND, AND RURAL RESIDENTIAL GREEN ON THE LEFT WOULD BE FAIR ARGUMENT THAT THOSE TWO SHOULDN'T BE BUTTED TOGETHER THERE.
THEY'RE, THEY'RE, I MEAN THERE'S NO REASON THAT WHY YOU COULDN'T, UH, UH, IT'S JUST KIND OF THE REALITY CHECK OF, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE STILL HAVING TO BUILD A BRIDGE.
YEAH, NO, I'M JUST SAYING ALSO LIKE THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM WITH YOU.
YOU KNOW, THAT WAS REALLY MY PRINCIPLE REASON TO PROPOSE THIS IS, YOU KNOW, HOW LONG ARE YOU GONNA WAIT FOR THAT TO DEVELOP IF, IF A DEVELOPER HAS TO COME IN, IF SOMEBODY'S COMING IN AND BUILDING A, A BRIDGE, I HAVE A, YOU HAVE A GENERAL OBSERVATION ABOUT THAT.
AND THAT IS THAT THE, THE ASTRONOMICAL INCREASES OF COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL REAL ESTATE IN THE EAST COUNTIES TO THE EAST OF US ARE, ARE MAKING MORE AND MORE THINGS FEASIBLE THAT WOULDN'T HAVE BEEN FEASIBLE YEARS AGO.
SO IF YOU LOOK FIVE YEARS, 10 YEARS, MAYBE $20 MILLION BRIDGE IS NO PROBLEM.
YOU KNOW, I MEAN, UM, SO, YOU KNOW, AND THIS IS, THIS IS LONG, LONG TERM STUFF, RIGHT.
20 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, I MEAN, I, I MEAN THAT'S, TO ME, THAT'S THE SPOT.
YOU, YOU HOUSING, YOU CAN, YOU KNOW, YOU GOT, YOU KNOW, SOME ROOM IN SOUTH RIVER AND SOME MORE AREA OUT IN THE FORK AND YOU KNOW, DIFFERENT PLACES LIKE THAT.
BUT AS FAR AS BEING ABLE TO TRACK COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL AND ACCESS TO THE INTERSTATE AND RAIL INLAND PORT, IT'S ALREADY A BUNCH OF IT THERE.
I MEAN, IT, IT, TO ME IT'S THE SPOT, THE, THE, THE ODD ONE IS THE BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS.
AND I UNDERSTAND WE NEED TO, TO MAINTAIN A GOOD, YOU KNOW, REASONABLE SETBACK, YOU KNOW, SO THAT, UH, BEING THEY'RE THERE FIRST.
I MEAN, YOU, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T WANT TO, DON'T WANNA MAKE IT MISERABLE FOR 'EM TO LIVE THERE, BUT IT, YOU KNOW, AT THE SAME TIME THEY, THE 5.2 CORRIDOR'S THERE, YOU KNOW.
[04:05:01]
I THINK INCREASING THE SETBACK WHEN IT COMES IN, IF THEY OPEN THE APPLICATION BACK UP, I'D WANT A GOOD, YOU KNOW, MAYBE DOUBLE WHAT WAS REQUIRED OR SOMETHING.AND THEN, UH, BUT YEAH, I, THIS IS GETTING KIND PICK TOO, BUT YOU CAN USE MULTI CELL BOX CULVERTS TO FILL OVER IT AND WATER STILL FLOW UNDER IT AND YOU'RE NOT BUILDING A BRIDGE.
SO THE OTHER THING IS, YEAH, CLIFF IS AT LEAST 75.
IT'S THE RESIDENTIAL THAT IS SHANNON, THE SHADOWS, THEY DON'T WANT ANY MORE INDUSTRY.
SO IF YOU SPLIT IT, PUT MORE HOUSES, YOU JUST GOT MORE PEOPLE NOT WANTING INDUSTRY.
EVERY HOUSE YOU BUILD COST US MONEY BASICALLY BECAUSE OF SCHOOL LOAD.
EVERY HOUSE THAT'S POTENTIALLY GOT TWO KIDS IN IT, WAS IT POTENTIALLY LIKE $2,500 OR SOMETHING ADDITIONAL TO THE REST OF THE COMMUNITY HOUSEHOLDS OR SOMETHING.
YOU KNOW, YOU ADD THAT, YOU ADD THAT BACK INTO IT, THE REDS, THE RED PURPLES SHOULD BE A POSITIVE NET INCOME.
WELL, OVERACHIEVER AGAIN, I, I WANTED TO BRING THIS FORWARD TO YOU JUST AS A CONCEPT.
UM, WE APPRECIATE YOUR COMMENTS ON IT AND, UM, UM, THE, THE APP, THE, THE FOLKS PART OF SLATE RUN HAVE, HAVE, AGAIN, THEY DID NOT REACH OUT TO ME AND, AND SO I WOULD'VE EX I WOULD'VE, UH, I, UH, GOING OVER THIS WITH THEM IF, IF IT WAS SOMETHING THEY'D BE INTERESTED IN, BUT, UM, I JUST WANTED TO KIND OF THROW IT OUT THERE AND, UM, YOU KNOW, I WOULD ASK THAT POTENTIALLY MAYBE YOU CONSIDER THOSE, THESE TWO PARCELS AS, UH, ADDITIONS.
OH, DEFINITELY ADD THEM TO IT.
THESE AS ADDITIONS TO THE, UH, TO THE CORRIDOR AND POTENTIALLY THIS ONE HERE JUST BECAUSE OF IT, UH, BEING ADJACENT TO AN EXISTING COMMERCIAL, UM, UH, PROPERTY.
SO IS IS THAT THE, THE, THE RED THAT'S DOWN THERE, IS THAT THE PROPERTY THAT THEY COME IN AND WANT TO SWITCH THAT TO R ONE AND IT WAS, THEY WANTED TO DO R ONE TO ONE OF THEM.
AND THEY WANTED TO BUILD A MULTIFAMILY DWELLING UNIT ON THAT AND THEN HAVE THE OTHERS, UH, AS COMMERCIAL.
A FEW YEARS BACK, THE, THE STATE WAS GONNA PONY UP $20 MILLION FOR THE BRIDGE, HAD IT AVAILABLE, AND THEN, UM, FOR VARIOUS REASONS THE BOARD DECIDED THEY DIDN'T WANT TO SEE THAT THERE AND DENIED THE APPLICATION.
THE NEIGHBORS BEHIND IT TOO, FOR SOME REASON DIDN'T, I THINK THERE WAS A FEW NEIGHBORS.
UM, IT, THERE'S NOT A LOT OF 'EM, BUT THERE'S A FEW OF 'EM THAT HAD CAME OUT.
UM, AND I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE, I DON'T KNOW, FROM ALL OVER THE COUNTY ACTUALLY CAME OUT, HAD CONCERNS.
UM, BUT IN ANY CASE, UM, SO ONCE THAT WAS DENIED, THE, THE MONEY WAS OFF THE TABLE FOR THE BRIDGE AND I DON'T KNOW.
SO, UM, BUT IN ANY CASE, UM, AND THE ONLY ACCESS TO THE TWO RED ON THE BOTTOM ARE WRITTEN OR HOLLOW.
IS THAT LIKE A GRAVEL ROAD NOW OR IS THAT A NO, IT'S, IT IS A PAVED ROAD.
IT'S A STATE ROAD, BUT UM, IT IS, IT'S PRETTY NARROW AND IT'S GOTS A CREEK BED ON THE ONE SIDE.
AND DIDN'T YOU JUST SAY A LITTLE BIT, IF YOU'RE GONNA BUILD AN OFFICE PARK IN THERE, IT'S GONNA HAVE TO SEE A LOT OF IMPROVEMENTS.
THEY WOULD'VE TO, THEY WOULD'VE TO PROP.
DIDN'T YOU JUST SAY THOUGH THAT THE PRIOR APPLICATION HAD 20, HAD $20 MILLION FROM THE STATE TO MAKE A BRIDGE 10 TO DO 20 MILLION? WELL, 20 MILLION FOR THE BRIDGE ACROSS CROOKED RUN.
NOT, NOT MOLLY CAMPBELL ACROSS.
WELL, I MEAN, BUT IF THAT WAS THE CASE, THEN WHY WOULD, WHY WOULD THE ACCESS HAVE TO BE THROUGH RIGHT NOW ROAD? ARE YOU JUST ASSUMING THAT A BRIDGE WOULDN'T GET BUILT? I'M JUST, I DON'T KNOW.
THE STATE'S NOT GONNA PAY FOR THE PAY, THE STATE'S NOT GONNA PAY FOR IT.
BUT WHERE ARE THEY GONNA PAY FOR IT BEFORE? BUT THEY'RE NOT NOW.
OR DID I MISS IT WAS A REVENUE SHARING TYPE THING TO R ONE.
I THINK VDOT WAS GONNA PAY 10 MILLION.
I THINK IT WAS A PART OF IS A MIX LIKE TOWNHOUSES, YOU KNOW? YEAH.
THERE'S TOWNHOUSES PLUS SINGLE FAMILIES IS A MIX.
AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THE DEVELOPER HAD A, UH, AN INCENTIVE, UH, TO GET THE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPED BECAUSE BOX STORES WERE KIND OF MORE IN VOGUE THEN.
BUT, UM, NOW WITH, YOU KNOW, INTERNET AND AMAZON AND EVERYTHING, YOU'RE JUST NOT SEEING THOSE KIND OF ANCHOR STORES COMING IN AND INTERESTED.
SO IF I, IF I MAY, UM, I ROLL BACK JUST A LITTLE BIT, UM, ON AGRITOURISM, IS THERE, I I WANTED TO BRING UP A FARMER'S MARKET CONCEPT.
IS, IS THAT ANYWHERE IN THE, IS IT RELATED TO AGRITOURISM OR WHERE'S THE, WHERE'S THE, THE, THE FACILITATION OF, OF FARMER'S MARKETS? IS THERE? SO THERE'S TWO IN WARREN COUNTY RIGHT NOW, UH, THE FARMER'S MARKETS THAT ARE ACTIVE
[04:10:01]
RIGHT NOW, UM, THE FRONT ROYAL FARMER'S MARKET JUST STARTED BACK UP THIS YEAR.IT WAS ACTIVE, UH, MANY YEARS AGO.
UM, BUT THEY, THE DOWNTOWN FORGOT, I THINK IT'S DOWNTOWN MARKET DOWN, IT'S THE FRONT ROW RIGHT ON MAIN STREET.
THERE'S ANOTHER ONE THAT'S DL FARMER'S MARKET THAT WAS ACTIVE AT THE, THE CHURCH DYNAMIC LIFE, BUT NOW IT IS CURRENTLY AT THE FAIRGROUNDS.
THEY'RE HOSTING IT AND THEY DO LIKE EVERY, EVERY OTHER, LIKE ONE SATURDAY, ONE SUNDAY.
SO THERE ARE TWO, UM, AS OF RIGHT NOW.
WHERE, WHERE'S THE FARMER'S MARKET AGAIN? IN, IN FRONT ROYAL, UM, RIGHT ON MAIN STREET AT THE GAZEBO.
AND THEY DO IT ON, THEY HOLD IT ON SUNDAY.
SOME OF THE, UH, ALIENATORS, SOME OF THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESS PEOPLE, RIGHT? THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT KINDS OF FARMERS MARKETS.
THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT THE MARKET WHERE SOMEBODY BRINGS SOMEBODY THAT SETS UP A LITTLE STAND MM-HMM.
AND SO DOES, UM, RIGHT IN LINDEN AT THE GIVING TREE, THEY'LL ALSO HOST THE GIVING TREE.
HAS, UH, HAS ONE LIKE THAT AS WELL.
SO, SO, AND, AND THEN WARREN OR POP HERE, WARREN.
UH, THEY'RE CLOSE TO THAT LINE.
I'M NOT, IT'S RIGHT ON THAT LINE.
YEAH, I WAS GONNA SAY, I THINK IT'S F**K IS, IS THE FIGURE ON, UH, ONE INTERIOR OR PEOPLE SET UP IT'S EXTERIOR.
UM, REALLY RIGHT IN THAT PARKING LOT.
SO, UM, WELL, I THINK THAT THE, WITH THE, WITH THE, UH, ATHLETIC COMPLEX GOING IN AND THE POTENTIAL FOR THE SPORTS TOURISM GETTING LARGER THERE, THAT THE MCKAY BRINGS, THAT, THAT PROPERTY ON THE CORNER THERE HAS CERTAINLY SOME PRETTY SERIOUS POTENTIAL TO BE, TO FACILITATE THAT KIND OF ACTIVITY THERE.
UM, AND THEN THERE'S A HISTORICAL ASPECT WITH THE HOUSE THAT HAS, I DON'T KNOW IF THERE HOST HERITAGE, THOUGHT HE MIGHT BE INTERESTED IN HELPING WITH THAT.
UM, AND THEN KIND OF A PARK, THERE'S A LOT OF TIMES WHERE FAMILIES GO TO THOSE SPORTS TOURNAMENTS AND, YOU KNOW, THE 12-YEAR-OLD OR THE 14 YEAR OLDS, ALL DAY GAMES ALL DAY.
BUT THERE'S, THERE'S A YOUNGER SIBLINGS AND STUFF AND, YOU KNOW, LIKE HAVING THINGS NEARBY TO DO, BE AT CHILDREN'S PARK OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT.
UM, SORRY, BUT THAT, THAT, UM, I WAS A LITTLE OFF TRACK.
I JUST WANT, BEFORE WE END THIS MEETING TO, TO SORT OF SAY THAT, UH, I, I REALIZE THAT THIS, THIS IS A RURAL COUNTY, UM, UNDER A LOT OF PRESSURE FROM PEOPLE, UM, WANTING TO MOVE INTO THE COUNTY AND HA HAVING A LIMITED HOUSING STOCK AND THAT CAUSING PRICES, YOU KNOW, TO GO UP AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
AND THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT A MAP HERE OF THE CORRIDOR THAT SHOWS THAT THERE'S, THERE'S BASICALLY ALMOST NOTHING LEFT
UM, AND I THINK JUST AS A, AS A BOARD AND HOPEFULLY AS A PLANNING COMMISSION, WE NEED TO FACILITATE AND MAKE EFFICIENT AS POSSIBLE AND AS FAST AS POSSIBLE.
THE TRANSITION OF, OF PROPERTIES INTO INDUSTRIAL PAYING, INDUSTRIAL TAX PAYING BASE AND COMMERCIAL TAX PAYING BASE, UH, THAT'S WHAT THAT HELD AREA IS DESIGNATED FOR.
AND ONCE THAT PROPERTIES, YOU KNOW, BOOKED OUT WE'RE, IT'S ALL RESIDENTIAL NOW, E EVERYTHING WE DO IS, IS RESIDENTIAL CITIZEN PROPERTY TAX BASE.
SO I THINK WE NEED TO PRIORITIZE GETTING THAT DONE.
UM, AND TR YOU KNOW, THAT'S OUR OPPORTUNITY TO STOP THE CONSTANT INCREASE OF, OF PROPERTY TAX INCREASES.
AND IT NOT AS THOUGH THOSE AREN'T GONNA CONTINUE TO HAPPEN.
BUT THE POINT IS WE HAVE LITTLE AND WHAT WE HAVE, WE NEED TO MAKE GOOD USE OF THAT.
THAT'S KIND OF MY, MY PRIORITIES ON A, ON A GOING FORWARD BASIS.
AND I, I AGREE WITH YOU THERE.
AND THERE'S WHERE WITH THE ACCESSORIES, I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED THAT IF WE, IF WE DON'T, IF WE GET IT TOO MUCH IN TOO SMALL A SPACE, WE GOT THE SAME THING.
UM, THERE'S ONLY SO MUCH LAND FOR RESIDENTIAL LEFT AS WELL.
SO, UM, TRYING TO MAINTAIN THAT RURAL AND THAT AGRICULTURAL, UM, IT'S, IT'S HARD TO MAKE A FINE BALANCE THERE.
SO, UM, AND NOT TO OVERSTRESS OUR ENVIRONMENT RE IN OUR, UH, RESOURCES THAT WE HAVE BECAUSE, UM,
[04:15:01]
THE LAST FEW YEARS HAVE BEEN HARD ON THE WATER TABLE AND HELENE DID A LOT OF DAMAGE TO A LOT OF PLACES AND YEP.THE RIVER CAME UP, THE CREEK CAME UP.
BUT ANYBODY, I MEAN, UM, WE'VE GOT A HUGE PIPE THAT COMES OFF OF THE HILLSIDE.
IT NEVER GOT DAMP DURING HELENE.
NO WATER CAME OFF OF THAT HILLSIDE AT ALL, AND IT'S A STEEP HILLSIDE.
UM, IF YOU DUG DOWN, IT WAS, YOU KNOW, AFTER ABOUT TWO FEET IT WAS TOTALLY DRY.
SO YOU, YOU KNOW, IT'S GONNA TAKE SOME GOOD SNOWS THIS WINTER AND SOME SIGNIFICANT GOOD RAINS TO EVEN BRING UP THE TABLE A LITTLE BIT.
SO ADDING SOME MORE HOUSES, YOU KNOW, HOW LONG IS THIS GONNA GO ON? AND THAT'S MY CONCERN.
I JUST, IT'S NOT, I'M NOT TRYING TO KEEP PEOPLE OUT.
I'M JUST TRYING TO PROTECT WHAT WE HAVE HERE.
YOU KNOW, THE THE SAYING, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR HOME BEFORE YOU CAN TAKE CARE OF SOMEBODY ELSE'S SOMETIMES.
AND, UM, SO THAT'S, THAT'S MY THOUGHT THERE THAT, UM, THAT THAT BALANCE AND HOW WE DO THAT BALANCE.
SO HOW MANY SURVEY RESPONDERS DID YOU GET? I BELIEVE IT WAS UPWARDS OF 600 CLOSING IN ON AROUND 700, 700 MM-HMM.
THAT WAS, THAT WAS THE SECOND ROUND OF SURVEY.
THE FIRST ROUND WAS 2018 WHERE THEY SENT OUT SURVEYS AS PART OF THE STRATEGIC VISIONING.
AND THEN THEY TOOK THOSE AND THEN CREATED THE STRATEGIC VISIONING, UH, IN 2018 BY 1819 AND 19.
AND THEN AGAIN, EVERYTHING KIND OF HAPPENED AND THEN WE THOUGHT, WELL, WE'RE GETTING BACK INTO IT.
LET'S, LET'S USE SOME OF THIS MODERN TECHNOLOGY WITH A FEW R CODES.
AND WE HAD CARDS PRINTED UP AND EVERYTHING AND, UH, PUT THAT INFORMATION OUT ON THE WEB AND ON ON FACEBOOK.
AND, UH, I THINK THAT GOT THE WORD OUT PRETTY GOOD, UH, AS BEST WE COULD.
AND, UH, IT WAS GOOD GETTING KIND OF A SECOND ROUND THAT WE COULD BASE, UM, THIS PAST YEAR REVIEW ON FOR THE COMMISSION.
SO THOSE RESPONSES, HOW MUCH, WHAT IS THE PERCENTAGE OF THOSE RESPONSE HAD INFLUENCE IN YOUR REVISIONS TO THIS COMP PLAN? WELL, THE MAJORITY OF IT IS FINDING THAT BALANCE BETWEEN NOBODY WANTING TOO MUCH DEVELOPMENT, BUT EVERYBODY WANTING LOWER TAX RATES.
UM, THAT WAS THE VAST MAJORITY OF ALL OF OUR SURVEY RESPONSES, SO GOT BOTH.
UM, SO THAT CONTRIBUTED TO TRYING TO FIND THIS, THIS BALANCE BETWEEN HOW DO WE, TO HOW DO WE CONTINUE TO DEVELOP, BUT DO IT IN A MANNER IN WHICH WE CAN, WE CAN SUSTAIN OURSELVES AS A COUNTY.
SO I MEAN, IT, IT PRETTY MUCH WHAT THE ENTIRE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN BALANCE, FINDING THAT THAT BALANCE, UM, YOU KNOW, STILL MAINTAINING SOME DEVELOPMENT, BUT DOING IT IN A SLOW PACE MANNER.
BUT YEAH, I MEAN THE, THE SURVEY RESULTS ARE, WE HAVE LAID ALL OF THEM OUT.
UM, ALLISON, OUR OFFICE MANAGER, TRACKED ALL OF THOSE AND SHE CREATED AN APPENDIX ITEM FOR THE COMPREHENSIVE PLANS.
THE RESULTS WILL BE AVAILABLE.
I MEAN, WE JUST COULDN'T INCLUDE ALL OF THE APPENDIX BECAUSE THIS WOULD BE A NEARLY 1000 PAGE DOCUMENT IN FRONT OF YOU.
UM, BECAUSE WE INCLUDED LOTS OF DIFFERENT STUDIES AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
BUT, UM, I THINK THAT WE, WE TOOK AS MUCH OF IT AS WE COULD.
THERE WAS A LOT OF, UM, AGRITOURISM RESPONSE, A LOT OF HISTORIC PRESERVATION, A LOT ON OUR EDUCATION SYSTEM, UM, GETTING BETTER QUALITY TEACHERS, UM, YOU KNOW, BETTER RESPONSE TIMES FOR EMERGENCY SERVICES.
AND THAT ALL GOES HAND IN HAND WITH THE, YOU KNOW, THE WORKFORCE HOUSING AS WELL.
SO, I MEAN, WE TRIED TO TOUCH ON ALL OF THOSE THINGS AND TAKE INTO CONSIDERATION, YOU KNOW, UPDATING THOSE, THOSE AREAS WITHIN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO ADDRESS THE CITIZENS' LARGEST CONCERNS.
ONE, I HAVE TO GET BACK TO THOSE SEWAGE FACILITIES.
'CAUSE I'M BENTONVILLE, BROWNTOWN AND LAMBTON.
I'M GONNA GET A LOT OF CALLS AND NOT HAVE ANY, WHAT IS THAT? SO THAT CARRIED OVER FROM THE 2013 COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, UM, THAT CAME UP AS WELL IN TO, IN THIS EVENING'S COMMUNITY OUTREACH.
UM, THAT MATT, YOU COULD PROBABLY SPEAK A LITTLE BIT BETTER ON IT THAN I CAN, BUT IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT WITH THESE, LIKE THE RURAL VILLAGES, UM, YOU KNOW, THE, THE SHARED WELLS, UM, THE COMMUNITY,
[04:20:01]
THERE'S SMALL PARCELS IN THERE.IT'S ALMOST LIKE IN ORDER TO, IN ORDER TO SEE AN EXPANSION OF THOSE, THE FOOTPRINTS OF THE, OF THE VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE TO HAVE SOME, YOU KNOW, A PACKAGE PLANT THAT MAYBE CAN SERVE NUMEROUS HOUSES, UH, AND MAYBE A CO A COMMUNITY WELL, THAT CAN POTENTIALLY SERVE NUMEROUS HOUSES.
UH, IT'S JUST THAT THESE, THESE, UH, LITTLE VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL AREAS ARE, ARE HIS, SOME OF THEM ARE HISTORIC DISTRICTS.
THE BROWNTOWN ONE IS, AND, UH, I KNOW ONE HOUSE IN THERE, UM, IN THAT DISTRICT.
AND I THINK, UH, ONE OR TWO IN THE BENTONVILLE DISTRICT WHERE THEY HAVE PUMPING HALLS THAT WERE APPROVED BECAUSE THEY COULDN'T GET CISTERNS OR THERE'S A LOT.
AND SO, UH, I THINK THAT'S WHAT THAT'S KIND OF TYING IT INTO.
IT'S A MATTER OF WHERE THAT INFRASTRUCTURE CAN GO.
AND WHERE DO YOU WANT TO SEE THE EXPANSION OF THE FOOTPRINT OF THESE VILLAGES, YOU KNOW, THE VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL AREAS? MM-HMM.
UM, SO, UM, ACTUALLY SPEAKING OF THAT, IS THAT THE PLANNED RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, THE PRD, UH, ZONING CATEGORY THAT WAS MENTIONED AS A NEW WELL, UH, I WOULDN'T SAY IT WAS PLANNED RESIDENTIAL BECAUSE PLANNED RESIDENTIAL, IN MY MIND, I KIND OF THINK OF MANY MORE HOUSES.
UM, THIS WOULD JUST BE MORE OF A, A ALMOST A CLUSTER HOUSING TYPE OF A DEVELOPMENT.
WHERE YOU, YOU MAY HAVE SIX TO 10 OR MAYBE 20 HOUSES.
AGAIN, OUR CLUSTER HOUSING IS, IS AT THIS POINT ALLOWED AGRICULTURAL MM-HMM.
BUT IT WOULD BE ONE OF THOSE THINGS WHERE, YOU KNOW, IF YOU WANTED TO BUILD A ROAD TO SERVE THOSE PROPERTIES, UM, AGAIN, WE ALL, WE REQUIRE STATE STANDARDS ROAD, BUT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT YOU COULD REEVALUATE AND THEN HAVE THOSE HOUSES SERVED BY EITHER A PACKAGE PLANT OR, YOU KNOW, COMMUNITY WELLS FOR SO MANY HOUSES.
UM, THE THING IS, IS YOU DON'T HAVE CONSERVATION AREAS IN VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL, YOU KNOW, IT'S JUST NOT, YOU KNOW, IT'S THAT VILLAGE, YOU KNOW.
SO, UM, WE DID GET FEEDBACK FROM ROCKLAND AND ROCKLAND, UM, REALLY WOULD PREFER TO BE, YOU KNOW, IDENTIFIED AS A COMMUNITY VERSUS A VILLAGE ANYMORE, BECAUSE THE VILLAGE IS, THERE'S SOME REMNANTS OF IT, BUT REALLY IT'S NOT A CENTRAL FOCAL POINT FOR THE COMMUNITY.
THE COMMUNITY IS THE VAST LARGE FARMS THAT ARE UNDER CONSERVATION EASEMENT.
AND, UM, THEY FEEL SAFER IN BEING LOOKED AT THAT WAY THAN, THAN A VILLAGE, A HIGH DENSITY OR HIGHER DENSITY AREA FOR, FOR, UH, RESIDENTIAL OR EVEN COMMERCIAL, WHICH, UH, IS ALLOWED IN, IN VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL.
SO, UM, WE'LL MAKE THAT, THERE'S A CHANGE THAT WE'LL MAKE IN THE COMP PLAN BASED ON THAT, THOSE COMMENTS.
BUT, UH, SO THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE'RE AT.
UM, I WILL MENTION WITH, UH, CLUSTER HOUSING SUBDIVISIONS, UM, SINCE I'VE BEEN HERE, I THINK THERE'S BEEN FOUR THAT WERE APPROVED.
THERE WAS ONE APPROVED PRIOR, ONE, I THINK ONE OR TWO APPROVED PRIOR TO ME COMING ON BOARD IN 2005.
UM, ONE THAT WAS VERY SUCCESSFUL WAS A WALNUT, UH, ROAD, ONE OFF CATLETT MOUNTAIN ROAD THAT MR. ANDREWS DID AND RESERVED SOME OPEN SPACE
AND, UM, AND THEN, UH, WE'VE HAD A COUPLE THAT JUST, UM, DIDN'T MOVE FORWARD.
THE COUNTY ACTUALLY TOOK OVER THE PERFORMANCE BOND FOR THE WATERHOUSE ROAD ONE IN ORDER TO GET MR UH, BUNKY WOODS, UH, HOUSE BUILT.
AND, UM, THAT HAS SINCE BECOME A NICE SUBDIVISION.
BUT AGAIN, IT WAS, IT WAS A LONG TERM COMING UNTIL THEN, THE HOLIDAY PLANTATION ONE.
THAT'S BEEN A NICE SUBDIVISION, BUT AGAIN, IT'S BEEN A LONG TIME.
UH, AND WE STILL ARE WAITING FOR VDOT TO GIVE IMPROVEMENT ON THOSE ROADS.
SO THERE'S SOME REAL CHALLENGES THAT WE HAVE WITH THESE CLUSTER OF SUBDIVISIONS.
AND FOR A DEVELOPER TO HAVE TO BUILD A ROAD TO STATE STANDARDS, THEY'RE PROBABLY GONNA NEED MORE HOMES.
THEY'RE JUST NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO DO THAT AND BE ALLOWED SIX BY RIGHT.
I MEAN, I THINK THAT MIGHT BE SOMETHING THAT YOU COULD RECONSIDER.
UH, WE'VE HAD, UH, DEVELOPERS COMING OUT AND LOOKING AT THOSE, LOOKING AT PROPERTY LARGER PROPERTIES TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT, BUT THEY PUT THE NUMBERS TOGETHER AND THEY JUST CAN'T, IT JUST DOESN'T WORK OUT FOR 'EM.
OR, UH, THE PROPERTY DOESN'T HAVE SITE DISTANCE AND VDO PRETTY MUCH SAYS YOU'RE JUST NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO DEVELOP IT AT THAT, UH, HIGH DENSITY.
SO AGAIN, THAT'S PART OF KEEPING THE COUNTY RURAL FIELD, YOU KNOW, IF VDOT SAYS YOU, YOU CAN'T MEET THOSE SITE DISTANCES, I MEAN, THAT, THAT CAN KILL A PROJECT.
[04:25:01]
UM, SO THAT'S JUST SOMETHING TO CONSIDER ABOUT, UH, MAYBE WE CAN TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT, IF THAT'S SOMETHING YOU'D LIKE US TO, TO INCLUDE, YOU KNOW, ADDITIONALLY.UM, BUT AT THIS POINT IN TIME, UM, WE JUST DON'T GET A LOT OF THOSE HAVEN'T HAD ANY OF THOSE APPLICATIONS, SO, WELL, MY CONCERN THERE IS THE COUNTY TAXPAYERS SHOULDN'T HAVE TO, UM, GET THE ROADS UP TO STATE STANDARDS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHY I'VE ALWAYS SAID I THINK THE DEVELOPERS OUGHT TO DO IT, BUT I DO UNDERSTAND IT'S, IT'S GOTTEN AWFULLY EXPENSIVE TO DO THAT AND TO MAKE ANY PROFIT ON YOUR WORK.
SO IT'S, THAT ONE'S A HARD ONE.
ONE OF THE THINGS, AND, AND JUST SPEAKING OF ROADS, IT'S ALWAYS GONNA COME.
IT'S LIKE IT COMES BACK TO ROADS, PRIVATE ROADS, EASEMENT AND SEPTIC SYSTEMS.
UH, LIVING IN THE COUNTRY, I MEAN, IT, IT SEEMS TO ALWAYS COME BACK TO THESE AND, AND THE ROADS, AND WE DISCUSSED THIS WITH DR.
JAMESON, SOME OF THESE PLATTED ROADS IN, IN SHOW NO FARMS THAT NEED TO BE PUT IN.
WELL, THERE ON STEEP SLOPE AREAS ARE GONNA HAVE THEIR CHALLENGES AS IT IS.
AND FOR A DEVELOPER TO HAVE TO BUILD IT TO A STATE STANDARD, YOU'RE JUST NOT GONNA MAKE ANY MONEY ON IT.
IT'S JUST GONNA BE TOO COSTLY.
SO THERE'S GONNA HAVE TO BE SOMETHING WE'LL HAVE TO LOOK AT, MAYBE WORK WITH A PUBLIC WORKS DIRECTOR AS FAR AS SET, YOU KNOW, HAVING SOME SORT OF STANDARD THAT A SANITARY DISTRICT COULD OVERSEE THOSE ROADS, BUT NOT HAVE TO BE IT, HAVE IT BROUGHT INTO THE STATE SYSTEM.
SO, UM, THAT MIGHT BE A SOLUTION IN ONE WAY FOR BUILDING OUT SOME OF THESE VACANT LOTS IN THE R ONE.
AS LONG AS YOU'VE GOT ENOUGH HOUSES TO SUPPORT THE DISTRICT, UH, 'CAUSE YOU, YOU KNOW, IT'S STILL COMING BACK TO THE, TO THE HOMEOWNERS TO, TO PAY FOR THAT MAINTENANCE, YOU KNOW? THAT'S RIGHT.
NO, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, THE HOMEOWNERS DON'T WANNA HAVE AN HOA OR SANITARY DISTRICT, THEN THEY'RE STUCK WITH THE ROADS.
I MEAN, I, I'M HAVING, I'M GOING THROUGH THAT RIGHT NOW WITH, UM, AN AREA IN, IN MY DISTRICT, YOU KNOW, SO IF YOU, THERE'S GOTTA BE SOME BALANCE SOMEWHERES, I THINK HOLIDAY PLANTATION WOULD'VE FINISHED UP A LOT SOONER, A LOT CLEANER IF MR. HAMMOND HADN'T PASSED AWAY TOO.
YOU GOT, YOU KNOW, DEVELOPERS WHO WERE INVOLVED, WHO WERE, YEAH, HE, HE WAS A LOCAL DEVELOPER.
AND THEN, UH, HAD HE NOT PASSED AWAY EARLY, UH, KIND OF UNTIMELY, I'M SURE THAT WOULD'VE CAME OUT A LOT QUICKER.
DID HE PASS AWAY? OH, I DID NOT KNOW THAT.
WELL, NO WONDER IT'S NOT GETTING TURNED IN
UM, SO YEAH, SO MOST OF WHAT WE, WE DISCUSSED ON THE ROADS WITH DR.
JAMON WERE THE, THE PLATTED ROADS AND SHE BE FARMS SO THAT THEY WOULD BE, I GUESS, A PART OF BE EVENTUALLY ADOPTED OR INCLUDED INTO THAT SANITARY DISTRICT.
AND, AND, UH, AFTER SEEING THE WORK THAT THE PUBLIC WORKS GUYS DID FOR OLD LOCO, YOU KNOW, I THINK SOMETHING LIKE THAT, UH, THAT IS NOT TO BE ADOPTED OR BECOME PART OF THE STATE SYSTEM MIGHT BE A ROUTE WEEK AGO.
WE JUST NEEDED TO FIND THE STANDARD THAT WE WANT TO PUT THOSE ROADS AT.
I DO WANNA GIVE KUDOS TO, UH, MR. HENDERSON OVER HERE.
I UNDERSTAND HE DID SOME OF THE PICTURES THAT ARE ON THIS, AND THERE YOU DID A GREAT JOB.
SO, UM, BLUE MOUNTAIN DRONE, LLC, UM, NOW A LIMITED LIABILITY COMPANY, UM, PROVIDED MANY, MANY, MUCH NEEDED PHOTOS.
UM, WE UTILIZED AT LEAST 18 THROUGHOUT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN AND SEVERAL WITHIN THE, THIS POWERPOINT ITSELF.
BUT HE ABSOLUTELY PROVIDED AMAZING PHOTOS, UM, TO OUR COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WOULD NOT LOOK ANYWHERE AS GREAT AS IT DOES WITHOUT HIS CONTRIBUTION.
WE BETTER WATCH OUT BECAUSE WE MAY LOSE HIM.
YEAH, I, WELL, AND I THINK KUDOS TO ALL OF YOU.
YOU ALL DID A LOT OF WORK, COREY, THANK YOU.
UM, ON THE MAPS AND THINGS THERE, THEY'RE REALLY NICE.
SO I APPRECIATE ALL THE WORK IN THE COMMISSION AS WELL, ALL THE WORK YOU GUYS HAVE DONE ON IT.
I HOPE YOU GUYS ARE SATISFIED WITH THE OVERALL LOOK AND FLOW OF IT.
UM, WE'VE WORKED REALLY HARD TO TRY TO MAKE IT AS USER FRIENDLY AS POSSIBLE.
UM, AND JUST REDESIGNING IT, UPDATING IT, BRINGING IT, UM, IT'S WHAT REALLY REFLECTS OUR COUNTY AND THE VISION FOR OUR COUNTY.
IT REALLY REFLECTS EXTREMELY POSITIVELY ON OUR COUNTY AND JUST GOING THROUGH, I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU DIDN'T GET THE EMAIL, BUT IT'S, I HAVE A PDF AND, UH, IT LOOKS GREAT.
SO, AND YEAH, AND IT, IT REALLY PUTS US, UH, I THINK IT JUST SHOWS SO WELL, IT PUTS US IN
[04:30:01]
A LEAGUE FAR ABOVE OUR FIGHTING WEIGHT, YOU KNOW? THANK YOU VERY MUCH.I AM BY NO MEANS A GRAPHIC DESIGNER.
UM, SO IT WAS A, A BIT OF A STRUGGLE, BUT WE WANTED IT TO NOT LOOK AS MUCH LIKE A LEGAL DOCUMENT AS POSSIBLE.
IF I COULD HAVE A PAPER ONE, YOU CAN HAVE MY BOOK.
WOULD I JUST NEED TO TUCK THAT MAP BACK IN HERE? YEAH, I, I'M BETTER AT THAT THAN I AM ON A COMPUTER.
WE ARE MORE THAN HAPPY TO PREVENT A, OR TO PROVIDE A PAPER COPY TO ANYBODY WHO WANTS ONE.
UM, YOU KNOW, SOME PEOPLE LIKE TO WORK ON PAPER, SOME PEOPLE DON'T MIND WORKING.
I'D LIKE PAPER COPIES OF THE MAPS.
BUT THE WHOLE THOUSAND PAGE THING WITH THE APPENDIX IS I'LL TAKE A PDF, I'LL BORROW AND GIVE BACK.
SO WE WILL PROVIDE JUST A MAP SECTION IN AS AN APPENDIX ITEM.
SO LIKE, LIKE YOU'RE SAYING RIGHT NOW, I JUST WANNA LOOK AT THESE MAPS.
UM, THEY'LL BE ABLE TO GO TO AN APPENDIX ITEM THAT JUST HAS ALL THE MAPS, SO GREAT.
BUT YES, I WILL GET YOU A COPY OF ALL OF THE MASKS.
AND AS A TIMELINE OF TOMORROW NIGHT, AS YOU KNOW, WE HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING AT THE P MISSION.
UH, WE'VE ADVERTISED IT JUST KIND OF AS THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, WHAT LITTLE CHANGES WITH SOME OF THE CHANGES THAT WE GOTTEN TONIGHT.
WE, WE MAY GO AHEAD AND MAKE THOSE TOMORROW PRIOR TO BRING IT FORWARD.
UM, AGAIN, THERE'S AN OPTION, CREATE A MOTION THAT THE TABLE, IF YOU WANT FURTHER INFORMATION, ESPECIALLY IF WE DON'T GET THE LETTER FROM YOU, THAT IS AN IMPORTANT COMPONENT OF THIS.
UM, WE'RE STILL SHOOTING FOR DECEMBER AT LEAST TO AUTHORIZE ADVERTISEMENT MAYBE FOR JANUARY PUBLIC HEARING AT THE BOARD LEVEL.
THAT GIVES US ONE MORE MONTH AT THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO MAKE ANY OF THESE, UH, UPDATES AND MODIFICATIONS AND SUGGESTIONS THAT YOU PROVIDED TO US, UM, TO THE CONFERENCE PLAN, BOTH FROM YOU AND, AND CITIZENS.
AND, UH, AND WE JUST HOPE THAT THE NEXT TIME WE BRING IT TO YOU, YOU'LL FEEL VERY CONFIDENT IN, UH, REVIEWING IT.
UM, JUST TO, TO ADD TO THE VDOT, UM, WE DID SUBMIT THE FORMAL PACKAGE TO THEM.
IT'S, IT'S AN ODD SYSTEM, BUT WE, WE DO WHAT THEY SAY WE, WE HAVE TO DO.
UM, SO WE SUBMITTED IT FOR REVIEW, UM, A COUPLE OF MONTHS AGO.
THEY KICKED IT BACK WITH WHAT THEY ADVISED US TO DO.
UM, SO WE WENT BACK AND FORTH WITH A COUPLE OF THE GENTLEMEN AT VDOT.
THEY CAME BACK ONCE AGAIN, UM, WITH JUST SOME MINOR CHANGES.
UH, AS OF LAST WEEK, THEY WERE VERY MUCH IN LOVE WITH OUR INFRASTRUCTURE CHAPTER.
SO, UH, WE ONCE AGAIN SUBMITTED A FORMAL PACKAGE.
THEY SHOULD PROVIDE THAT LETTER.
I WAS HOPING FOR IT TODAY, BUT IT DID NOT COME.
I'M HOPING, FINGERS CROSSED, TOMORROW I WILL ATTACH THAT LETTER TO THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
IT HAS TO BY, BY LAW BE IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
IT THEN ONCE AGAIN GETS RESUBMITTED TO VDOT WITH THE APPROVAL LETTER.
UM, THAT IS JUST WHAT THEY REQUIRE.
AND THEN THEY WILL KICK IT BACK ONCE MORE.
AND WE ARE GOOD TO GO AS FAR AS VDOT GOES.
SO IT'S JUST A BACK AND FORTH GAME.
SO, BUT WE DO HAVE THEIR UNOFFICIAL APPROVAL PROBABLY TO A DIFFERENT, PROBABLY.
WE'RE, WE'RE LEAVING THE RESIDENCY AND WE'RE GOING TO TO STANTON.
SO YOU WERE CONSERVATIVE TO GET THIS ALL.
WE WANTED IT OUT BY THE END OF 2024.
BUT JUST WE WOULD, WE WOULD NOT REQUEST AUTHORIZATION ADVERTISEMENT UNTIL COMMISSION DECISION.
APPRECIATE YOUR TIME THIS EVENING AND COMMISSION ANOTHER ROUND.
IS THERE A MOTION FROM THE BOARD TO ADJOURN? SO MOVED.
ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? A AYE BOARD IS ADJOURNED.
MOTION FROM PLANNING COMMISSION FOR ADJOURNMENT.