[00:00:01] LADIES AND GENTLEMEN, AT 7:00 ON THE JULY 9TH, 2025 MEETING OF THE WARREN COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION TO ORDER OUR FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA TONIGHT. NO ONE'S WEARING THEIR HAT, SO I CAN'T USE MY USUAL SPEECH. BUT LET'S STAND FOR THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE. I PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE TO FLAG UNITED STATES OF AMERICA AND TO THE REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS. ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INDIVISIBLE, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL. THANK YOU SO MUCH. OUR NEXT ITEM TONIGHT IS ADOPTION OF OUR AGENDA. [III. Adoption of the Agenda] MR. CHAIRMAN, MAKE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE AGENDA AS PRESENTED. OH. WAIT A MINUTE. SORRY, SORRY, SORRY. MR. CHAIR, I MOVE THAT WE MOVE CONSENT AGENDA ITEM F TO DISCUSSION. YEAH. OKAY. NEW BUSINESS. WE COULD LEAVE IT ON THE AGENDA. AND THEN AS FAR AS THE CONSENT AGENDA GO. YEAH. JUST TO TAKE IT OUT OF THE CONSENT AGENDA. CORRECT? YEAH, WE CAN DO THAT WHEN WE GET TO THE CONSENT AGENDA. OKAY. AND WE CAN DO IT NOW OR LATER. WHATEVER. I THINK ESSENTIALLY WHAT THE CHAIRMAN IS PROPOSING IS THAT IF THERE'S A MOTION TO ADOPT THE CONSENT AGENDA, THAT SOMEONE WOULD SAY NO, I SUGGEST THAT THAT ITEM BE MOVED AT THE TIME. I THINK IT'D JUST BE MORE ORDERLY TO DISCUSS THAT WHEN WE GET TO THE MOTION FOR THE AGENDA, RATHER THAN THE DISCUSSION THIS EARLY. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. SO I MADE A MOTION. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. OKAY. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? OUR AGENDA HAS BEEN ADOPTED. NEXT ITEM IS THE ADOPTION OF THE REGULAR MEETING MINUTES OF JUNE 11TH, [IV. Adoption of the Regular Meeting Minutes] 2025. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MOVE THAT WE ADOPT THE MINUTES OF THE JUNE'S MEETING AS PRESENTED. SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? MINUTES ARE ADOPTED. NEXT ITEM IS PUBLIC PRESENTATIONS. [V. Public Presentations] PUBLIC PRESENTATIONS ARE LIMITED ISSUES THAT ARE NOT INCLUDED ON THE MEETING AGENDA. IT'S INTENDED AS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR THE PUBLIC TO GIVE INPUT ON RELEVANT PLANNING ISSUES, NOT INTENDED AS A QUESTION AND ANSWER PERIOD. IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING, IT'S NOT ON THE AGENDA THAT'S ON YOUR MIND. PLEASE COME FORWARD, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AND TELL US WHAT YOU'RE THINKING. MR. JENKINS. I SEE WE DO HAVE THE TIMER, DON'T WE? OKAY. MR. JENKINS NEED TO SEE US AS WE ARE LIMITED TO THREE MINUTES. JOHN JENKINS, SOUTH RIVER DISTRICT. A FEW WORDS ABOUT THE CODE. THE WARREN COUNTY CODE SETS FORTH THE OFFICIAL GUIDELINES, RULES, AND REGULATIONS GOVERNING BOTH PRIVATE AND GOVERNMENT ACTIVITIES WITHIN THE WARREN COUNTY. WHEN INDIVIDUALS VIOLATE THE RULES AND REGULATIONS, WHO DO CITIZENS CONTACT TO FOR TO CORRECT A SITUATION AND THE REMOVAL OF THAT PERSON? TO MY KNOWLEDGE, THERE IS NO ONE THAT THE CITIZENS CAN GO TO THE COUNTY LIBRARY BOARD. RULES AND REGULATIONS WAS ADOPTED IN DECEMBER THE 10TH OF 2024. PRIOR TO THAT DATE, THERE WAS NO CODE OR A NEED FOR A LIBRARY BOARD WHO REQUESTED THE ADDITION OF THAT TO THE CODE, AND FOR WHAT REASON? ACCORDING TO THE STATE CODE 40 2-1, DASH 35, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS SELECTS MEMBERS FOR THE LIBRARY BOARD PER THE STATE CODE. THESE INDIVIDUALS ARE TO BE APPOINTED BY THE GOVERNING BODY FROM AMONG THE CITIZENS AT LARGE, WITH CONSIDERATION GIVEN TO THEIR QUALIFICATIONS FOR THE POSITION. THE SELECTED MEMBERS WERE UNFIT FOR OFFICE DUE TO THEIR BIAS AGAINST THE LIBRARY. CHAPTER SEVEN. ONE LIBRARY BOARD ITEM H STATES MEMBERS MAY BE REMOVED FOR MISCONDUCT OR NEGLECT OF DUTY. WAS REQUESTING A PROPOSAL FOR LIBRARY SERVICES MISCONDUCT. WHEN THE CHAIRMAN OF THE BOARD SOLICITED PROPOSALS. THAT JOB, I THOUGHT WOULD BE THE COUNTY ADMINISTRATOR JOB. STATE CODE 15 2-1512. OATH AND BOND STATES THAT ALL ELECTED AND APPOINTED OFFICIALS ARE REQUIRED TO TAKE A SWORN OATH. I DO SOLEMNLY AFFIRM THAT I WILL SUPPORT THE CONSTITUTION OF THE UNITED STATES AND THE CONSTITUTION OF THE COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA. AND I WILL FAITHFULLY. I WILL FAITHFULLY AND IMPARTIALLY DISCHARGE, DISCHARGE ALL THE DUTIES AND INCUMBENT UPON ME AS A MEMBER OF THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS OF [00:05:03] WARREN COUNTY. I BELIEVE THAT THE SUPERVISORS VIOLATED THAT OATH BY INFRINGING ON THE RIGHTS OF THE PEOPLE, REFUSING TO ALLOW THE PEOPLE TO PETITION FOR A REFERENDUM, AND TO SHOW COMMUNITY SUPPORT FOR THE LIBRARY FOR ALLOWING RELIGIOUS INTERVENTION, INTERVENTION AND NEW GOVERNMENT MATTERS. SOCIALISM. COMMUNISM. RELIGIOUS EXTREMISTS DO NOT BELONG IN WARREN COUNTY. GOVERNMENT. THANK YOU. THANK YOU SIR. THANK YOU. OKAY. WITH THAT, WE'LL MOVE ON TO PUBLIC HEARINGS. [VI.A. Z2025-05-01 - Zoning Text Amendments for Accessory Dwelling Units - Warren County Planning Staff - An ordinance to amend Chapter 180 of the Warren County Code (Zoning Ordinance) to add a definition for accessory dwelling unit, to repeal the existing definition for guesthouse, to amend the Agricultural zoning districts to make "accessory dwelling unit, provided that it is accessory to an existing single-family dwelling, and attached to or located within the existing principal structure" permissible by right and "accessory dwelling unit, detached from an existing principal structure, provided that the accessory dwelling unit is accessory to an existing single-family dwelling" permissible only by conditional use permit in the Agricultural zoning district, and to enact supplementary regulations for accessory dwelling units. - Chase Lenz, Zoning Administrator] WE HAVE FOUR TONIGHT. FIRST ONE Z 2025 0501. ZONING TEXT AMENDMENTS FOR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS. WARREN COUNTY PLANNING STAFF AN ORDINANCE TO AMEND CHAPTER 180 OF THE WARREN COUNTY CODE. ZONING ORDINANCE TO ADD A DEFINITION FOR ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT. TO REPEAL THE EXISTING DEFINITION FOR GUEST HOUSE AND AMEND THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICTS TO MAKE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT, PROVIDED THAT IT IS AN ACCESSORY TO AN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING ATTACHED TO OR LOCATED WITHIN THE EXISTING PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE. PERMISSIBLE BY RIGHT AND ACCESSIBLE DWELLING UNIT DETACHED FROM THE EXISTING AND EXISTING PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE, PROVIDED THAT THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT IS ACCESSORY TO AN EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING. PERMISSIBLE ONLY BY CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT AND AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICTS, AND TO ENACT SUPPLEMENTAL REGULATIONS FOR ACCESSIBLE DWELLING UNITS. MR. LENTZ, THANK YOU. I DID THIS PRESENTATION LAST NIGHT FROM UP HERE, AND IT WAS THE BETTER PART OF THE MEETING FOR ME. SO I'M GONNA STAY UP HERE. SO YOU'VE REHEARSED. SO. YES. ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS. SO THE TEXT AMENDMENT WILL INCLUDE A DEFINITION LISTED USES AND SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS. STARTING WITH THE DEFINITION, WE ARE LOOKING AT THE PROPOSED DEFINITION OF A SUBORDINATE DWELLING UNIT LOCATED ON THE SAME LOT AS A PRINCIPAL SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING THAT INCLUDES PERMANENT PROVISIONS FOR LIVING, SLEEPING, EATING, COOKING, AND SANITATION. THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT SHALL COMPLY WITH THE SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS SET FORTH IN SUBSECTION 180 3.2 OF THIS CHAPTER. ANOTHER CHANGE TO THE DEFINITION SECTION WILL BE TO REMOVE REPEAL THE EXISTING DEFINITION FOR GUEST HOUSE. THE IDEA IS THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT WILL REPLACE THE GUEST HOUSE. AND SO WE'VE GOT TWO LISTED USES IN THE AGRICULTURAL DISTRICT BEING PROPOSED TO BE ADDED ONE BY RIGHT AND ONE BY A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR THE BI-RITE USE. IT WOULD BE THOSE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS THAT ARE ATTACHED TO OR LOCATED WITHIN AN EXISTING PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE, AND THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT WOULD BE REQUIRED FOR ANY DETACHED ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT FROM THE EXISTING SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING. IN DIVING INTO THE SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS. WE START WITH A STATEMENT OF INTENT, AS I BELIEVE ALL CODE SECTION SHOULD. SECTION B HAS A LOT OF THE PROCEDURES IN IT, AND IT TIES IN HEALTH DEPARTMENT AND BUILDING INSPECTIONS. SO, YOU KNOW, YOU'LL HAVE TO GO THROUGH THEM TO CHANGE THE EXISTING CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY AND HEALTH DEPARTMENT PERMITS FOR THE SEWAGE DISPOSAL SYSTEM. AND WELL, POTENTIALLY AND SUBSECTION C PROPOSED TO LIMIT EACH LOT TO ONE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT. SUBSECTION D IS THE MINIMUM ACREAGE. AS DISCUSSED PREVIOUSLY WE HAD BUMPED THAT DOWN FROM FIVE ACRES TO 3.5. THERE WAS ACTUALLY DISCUSSION LAST NIGHT OF BUMPING IT FURTHER DOWN TO TWO ACRES. SO THAT IS POTENTIALLY SOMETHING THE BOARD WILL BE LOOKING AT WHEN THIS GOES BEFORE THEM AS WELL. THE SUBSECTION E, IT WILL BE THE PRINCIPAL STRUCTURE SETBACKS APPLIED TO ACCESSORY DWELLING UNITS. DON'T WANT THERE TO BE ANY CONFUSION OVER THE FACT THAT ACCESSORY IS IN THE NAME. AND THE SIZE WINDOW UNDER SUBSECTION F THAT WE'RE SUGGESTING I CANNOT TAKE CREDIT FOR. THIS IS MUCH FANCIER THAN I CAME UP WITH. BUT THE STARTING WINDOW IS 750 TO 1500 SQUARE FEET IN THE FLOOR AREA SIZE. AND THERE THE COUNTY ATTORNEY HAS BUILT IN A PROVISION THAT WOULD ALLOW FOR UP TO 3000FT² IN FLOOR AREA IF THE UNIT IS PRINCIPALLY PRINCIPALLY BELOW GRADE OR IF IT IS A CONVERSION OF SPACE LOCATED WITHIN AN EXISTING STRUCTURE. SUBSECTION G IS OFF STREET PARKING. IT ADDS ON THE WHAT WOULD TYPICALLY BE REQUIRED FOR A NEW DWELLING ONTO WHAT IS ALREADY REQUIRED FOR THE EXISTING DWELLING. SO BOTH WOULD BE REQUIRED AND THEN SUBSECTION H. IT DOES SIMILAR TO SHORT TERM RENTALS. IF YOU DON'T FOLLOW THE OCCUPANCY ON YOUR HEALTH DEPARTMENT PERMIT, YOU COULD BE SUBJECT TO REVOCATION, WHICH ULTIMATELY WOULD BE DEMOLITION OF THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT. SUBSECTION I WAS AN ATTEMPT TO HOPEFULLY WARD OFF ANY ANYONE TRYING TO USE AN EXCESSIVELY LONG COVERED BREEZEWAY TO [00:10:10] MAKE SOMETHING ATTACHED TO AVOID HAVING TO GET THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. AVOID CIRCUMNAVIGATING THAT PART OF THE CODE. AND AS DISCUSSED DURING THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN, THAT DOES END WITH A RESTRICTION ON USE OF THE ACCESSORY DWELLING UNIT AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL. IT WAS MEANT TO BE A HOUSING OPTION OR LONG TERM RENTAL OPTION, AND NOT AS A SHORT TERM RENTAL OPTION. AND THAT'S ALL I HAVE. OKAY. THE QUESTIONS BEFORE WE OPEN IT UP. OKAY. THANK YOU. PUBLIC HEARING IS NOW OPEN. ANYONE CARE TO SPEAK? ANYONE SIGN UP TO SPEAK STILL. PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED. THE ONLY COMMENT I HAD WAS IN SUBSECTION I. A 25 FOOT BREEZE. PLEASE COME ALONG. THAT'D BE BETTER THAN A HUNDRED. YEAH, I AGREE WITH THAT. YEAH, WE WERE TRYING TO FIND A REASONABLE NUMBER. I CAN'T. SOMEWHERE IN THUNDERBIRD FARMS, BUT THERE'S ONE THAT I'VE SEEN THAT'S REALLY LONG. AND I MEAN, YOU KNOW, IT WAS CONSIDERED AN ATTACHED, SO THAT WAS KIND OF MY THOUGHT PROCESS WAS. OKAY, HERE'S YOUR EXTREME EXAMPLE. NO MORE. NO, NO MORE THAN THAT. BUT YEAH, THAT WOULD BE AN EASY FIX IF YOU THINK IT SHOULD BE LESS. HAPPY TO DO IT. THAT'S JUST ME. BUT YEAH, MY OPINION IS IS GOOD. AND, YOU KNOW, IF WE NEED TO AMEND. IF WE SEE PEOPLE PUSHING THEN AND IT SEEMS EXTREME. YOU COULD PART, YOU KNOW, AT 25 FOOT, YOU COULD PARK IN BETWEEN THEM ALL. AND THEN IF YOU DIDN'T LIKE YOUR MOTHER IN LAW, MAYBE YOU NEED THE 25. YEAH. YEAH. THERE IS A PROPERTY UP ON PABST WAY WHERE THEY CONVERTED A GARAGE, AND THEY HAD A DRIVEWAY BETWEEN THE PRINCIPAL DWELLING AND THE GARAGE, AND THEY CONVERTED THE GARAGE WITHOUT PERMISSION. AND SO WE CITED THEM. AND SO THEY PUT THE BREEZEWAY FROM THE HOUSE TO THE GARAGE. BASICALLY, IT WAS PROBABLY, I'M GOING TO SAY, ABOUT 50FT. AND IT IT LOOKED PRETTY EXCESSIVE. BUT THEY HAD PARKING UNDER IT. YOU KNOW, THEY, YOU KNOW, THE VEHICLES PARKED UNDERNEATH IT. AND THE OTHER PORTION OF IT REALLY WAS JUST TO A A WALKWAY THAT SERVED THE, THE DWELLING UNIT. SO I DO REMEMBER THAT. AND THEY ACTUALLY HAD COME IN FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR, I THINK THEY WERE DOING A RETREAT CENTER OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. BUT THAT WAS THAT WAS A FIX TO A VIOLATION THAT THEY HAD BECAUSE THEY WANTED TO KEEP THAT ACCESSORY, THE ADDITION. SO AND I WAS GOOD WITH THE THREE AND A HALF ACRES, I'D, I'D BE GOOD AT THAT. I'D BE HESITANT AT TWO ON THE DENSITY IN SOME AREAS. OH, AND WE HAD EVEN SAID FIVE ONE TIMES. SO I THOUGHT THREE AND A HALF WAS A GOOD. YEAH. YES. YEAH. TO THE LOGIC, NOT TO CONTINUE TO BEAT THE POINT, BUT JUST COUNTING CEILING TILES 25FT IS BASICALLY FROM THE WALL BACK TO THE DOOR WHERE IT SAYS RULES OF ENGAGEMENT, ASSUMING THOSE ARE TWO FOOT BY TWO FOOT TILES. THAT'S NOT TOO BAD. THAT'S NOT SO BAD. NO, THAT'S NOT SO BAD. YEAH, BUT YEAH, YOU CAN SQUEEZE TWO CARS IN THERE EASILY. YEAH. SECOND. YEAH. ON SECOND OPINION, I'LL RETRACT MY STATEMENT. SO THE THE ACREAGE JUST BASICALLY WE CAME UP WITH THAT IS IS MINIMUM LOT SIZE FOR AG DISTRICT IS TWO ACRES. UNLESS IT'S A FAMILY SUBDIVISION IT'S 1.5. IF THEY DID AN ADU ON A LOT THAT WAS THREE AND A HALF ACRES AND WANTED AFTER FIVE YEARS, WANTED TO COME BACK AND JUST DO A FAMILY SUBDIVISION, THEY WOULD HAVE THAT 1.5 ACRES THAT WOULD MEET THE CODE REQUIREMENTS. SO AND THAT ACTUALLY WE KIND OF DIDN'T THINK ABOUT THIS, BUT THAT ACTUALLY MIGHT HELP US AVOID HAVING SUBDIVISION VARIANCES FOR THOSE FAMILY SUBDIVISIONS WHERE THE PEOPLE DON'T OWN IT FOR FIVE YEARS. YEAH. SO THEY CAN HOPEFULLY. WELL, THEY'D HAVE TO GET THE CUP IF IT WAS A UNIT THAT WAS DETACHED, BUT THE CUP ESSENTIALLY WOULD GO AWAY ONCE THE FAMILY SUBDIVISION WAS DONE. SO. SO THAT ACTUALLY MAKES SENSE. MAKE IT EASIER FOR RESIDENTS TO JUSTIFY 3.5 ACRES GENERATION AFTER SOMEBODY PASSES TO. RIGHT. RIGHT. YEAH. RIGHT. YEAH. YOU KNOW, IF IT WAS A FOR ELDERLY OR SOMEBODY, AND THEN AFTER THEY PASSED, YOU GIVE YOU ANOTHER OPTION. YEAH. ONE, ONE COMMENT THAT SHE'S MADE TO IF THE [00:15:09] PERMIT WAS REVOKED. I MEAN, IT WOULDN'T NECESSARILY NEED TO BE DEMOLITION, RIGHT? IT WOULD JUST BE TAKING OUT THE KITCHEN. YEAH. I MEAN, THERE WOULD BE OPTIONS FOR CONVERTING IT. A LOT OF TIMES, YOU'LL SEE WE ACTUALLY DO A LETTER OF UNDERSTANDING TYPE AFFIDAVIT THING WHERE IF YOU'RE LIVING IN A HOUSE AND THE GOAL IS TO BUILD A NEW HOUSE AND DEMO THE HOUSE THAT YOU'RE LIVING IN ONCE YOU'RE DONE, WE CAN ACTUALLY. WE HAVE A LETTER OF UNDERSTANDING. THEY SIGN. IT'LL BECOME A VIOLATION IF YOU DON'T DEMO IT OR CONVERT IT WITHIN 30 DAYS. AND SO WE COULD PROBABLY MODIFY THAT LETTER OF UNDERSTANDING TO WORK FOR US IN THIS SITUATION. BUT YEAH, I WOULD SAY THAT THERE GO TO WILL PROBABLY BE TO CONVERT RATHER THAN DESTROY. YEAH. YEAH. TAKE A MOTION PLEASE. FINDING THAT THE PROPOSED ZONING ORDINANCE AMENDMENTS ARE APPROPRIATE FOR PUBLIC NECESSITY, CONVENIENCE AND GENERAL WELFARE AND OUR GOOD ZONING PRACTICE. I MOVE THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION FORWARDED THE PROPOSED TEXT AMENDMENT TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WITH THE RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL. SECOND. OKAY. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? I JUST HAPPENED TO BE SENT ON TO THE BOARD. NEXT ITEM. SEP 2025 0601 SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL TWO 2026 DRUMMER HILL ROAD. [VI.B. CUP2025-06-01 - Short-Term Tourist Rental - 2026 Drummer Hill Road - A request for a conditional use permit for a short-term tourist rental. The property is located at 2026 Drummer Hill Road and is identified on tax map 15E, section 4, block 4, as lot 414A. The property is zoned Residential-One (R-1) and is located in the Shenandoah Magisterial District. - Kelly Wahl , Planner] REQUEST FOR CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL PROPERTY IS LOCATED AT 2026 DRUMMER HILL ROAD AND HAS IDENTIFIED ON TAX MAP 15 E. SECTION FOUR. BLOCK FOUR IS LOT 414. A PROPERTY IS ZONED R1 RESIDENTIAL, LOCATED IN THE SHENANDOAH MAGISTERIAL DISTRICT AS WELL. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THE APPLICANTS ARE REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL FOR THE PROPERTY THEY PURCHASED IN NOVEMBER OF 2024. THE APPLICANTS WOULD LIKE TO MAKE THE PROPERTY AVAILABLE FOR SHORT TERM LODGING, WHILE CREATING JOB FLEXIBILITY FOR THEMSELVES. RESIDING PERMANENTLY ONLY A HALF MILE AWAY FROM THE PROPERTY, THE PROPERTY OWNERS WILL MANAGE IT THEMSELVES. THIS PROPERTY HAS NOT HAD ANY PREVIOUS CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS ISSUED FOR USES IN THE RESIDENTIAL ONE ZONING DISTRICT. THE DWELLING WAS CONSTRUCTED IN 1970. THE APPLICANTS BEGAN ADVERTISEMENT IN OPERATION OF THE DWELLING AS A SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL WITHOUT A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT AT THE BEGINNING OF MAY 2025, BUT HAVE CEASED THE OPERATION OR THE SUBMISSION SINCE SUBMITTING THEIR APPLICATION, SO IT IS AVAILABLE FOR VIEW ON AIRBNB, BUT THEY CANNOT GO THROUGH WITH ACTUALLY RENTING IT. SO THEY SHUT DOWN THE ABILITY TO RENT IT OUT. THERE IS A HEALTH DEPARTMENT OPERATION PERMIT APPROVING A MAXIMUM OF FOUR OCCUPANTS FOR THE TWO BEDROOM DWELLING FOR A CONVENTIONAL SEPTIC. A REQUEST FOR COMMENTS WAS SUBMITTED TO THE PROPERTY OWNERS OF SHENANDOAH FARMS, WHO STATED THEY HAVE NO OBJECTIONS, BUT ADVISE ALL OWNERS AND GUESTS OF THE PROPERTY TO HAVE FOUR WHEEL DRIVE DURING INCLEMENT WEATHER. THE DWELLING MEETS THE SETBACK REQUIREMENT OF 100FT TO ADJACENT SINGLE FAMILY DWELLINGS, THE CLOSEST BEING 170FT TO THE SOUTH. WE RECEIVED ONE LETTER OF OPPOSITION FROM A NEIGHBOR, AND ANOTHER WHO WAS CONCERNED WITH THE PROPERTY BEING RENTED OUT WITHOUT A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, BUT OBVIOUSLY THEY'VE SUBMITTED AN APPLICATION. YOU SHOULD HAVE COPIES OF THAT IN YOUR AGENDA PACKET. PLANNING STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THE FOLLOWING CONDITIONS BE ADDED TO THIS CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. IF THE PLANNING COMMISSION CHOOSE TO RECOMMEND CHOOSES TO RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THIS PERMIT TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS. NUMBER ONE, THE APPLICANT SHALL COMPLY WITH ALL WARREN COUNTY HEALTH DEPARTMENT. WARREN COUNTY BUILDING INSPECTIONS IN VIRGINIA STATEWIDE FIRE PREVENTION CODE REGULATIONS AND REQUIREMENTS. THE MAXIMUM NUMBER OF OCCUPANTS SHALL NOT EXCEED THE SYSTEM CAPACITY IS DETERMINED BY THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT PERMIT, PER WARREN COUNTY CODE SUBSECTION 180 56.4 B, THE CERTIFICATE OF ZONING SHALL ONLY BE ISSUED WITH APPROVED HEALTH DEPARTMENT RECORDS. NUMBER THREE, THE APPLICANT SHALL HAVE THE WELL WATER TESTED ANNUALLY FOR E-COLI AND COLIFORM BACTERIA, AND A COPY OF THOSE RESULTS SHALL BE SUBMITTED TO THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT AND HEALTH DEPARTMENT. AND LASTLY, NUMBER FOUR, THE APPLICANT SHALL HAVE THE SEPTIC SYSTEM SERVICE EVERY FIVE YEARS, AS RECOMMENDED BY THE HEALTH DEPARTMENT AND A COPY OF THE SERVICE INVOICES TO BE PROVIDED TO THE PLANNING DEPARTMENT. THIS PUBLIC HEARING HAS BEEN PROPERLY ADVERTISED. ADJACENT PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED IN. THE APPLICANTS ARE NOT HERE THIS EVENING. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR ME. OKAY. THANK YOU SO MUCH. WITH THAT, WE'LL OPEN THE PUBLIC HEARING. ANYONE CARE TO SPEAK FOR OR AGAINST? NO ONE SIGNED UP. PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED. SOUNDS LIKE EVERYTHING'S IN ORDER. YEAH, WELL, GOING ONLINE AND TAKING A LOOK AT WHAT THIS LOOKED LIKE WHEN IT WAS SOLD. IT'S AMAZING WHAT THEY'VE DONE IN FIVE MONTHS. WELL, THAT'S THAT'S BEEN YOU KNOW, THAT'S BEEN THE SAVIOR FOR THESE THINGS DOWN IN THE FORMS FOR SOME OF THESE HOUSES THAT DON'T WELL, DON'T RENT VERY WELL LONG TERM. YEAH. AND THE LISTING HAD BEEN ABANDONED SINCE 2006. YEAH. WE LOOKED AT. YEAH. YEESH! THAT'S. YEAH. YEAH, THAT'S ALMOST A TEAR DOWN IN SOME CASES. YEAH. FOR SURE. WOW. ALL RIGHT. TAKE A MOTION. PLEASE. MOVE THE PLANNING COMMISSION FORWARD. THIS APPLICATION TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WITH A RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST FOR 2026, [00:20:05] DRUMMER HILL ROAD FOR SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL WITH THE CONDITIONS AS RECOMMENDED BY STAFF. I'LL SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? BE PASSED ON TO THE BOARD OF PASSES. THIRD ITEM TONIGHT. SEP 2025 0602 SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL. [VI.C. CUP2025-06-02 - Short-Term Tourist Rental - 145 Indian Pipes Rd - A request for a conditional use permit for a short-term tourist rental. The property is located at 145 Indian Pipes Road and is identified on tax map 24B, block 116, as lot 546. The property is zoned Residential-One (R-1) and is located in the Blue Mountain subdivision in the Shenandoah Magisterial District. - Chase Lenz, Zoning Administrator] 145 INDIAN PIPES ROAD. REQUEST FOR A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL PROPERTIES LOCATED AT 145 INDIAN PIPE ROAD, IDENTIFIED IN TAX MAP 24 B, BLOCK 116 AS LOT 546. PROPERTY ZONED R1 RESIDENTIAL, LOCATED IN BLUE MOUNTAIN SUBDIVISION, SHENANDOAH MAGISTERIAL DISTRICT. MR. LENZ. THANK YOU, MR. CHAIR. THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL FOR THE PROPERTY PURCHASED IN JANUARY OF THIS YEAR. THE OWNER WOULD LIKE TO MAKE THE PROPERTY AVAILABLE FOR SHORT TERM LODGING. FOR COUPLES SEEKING A QUIET, NATURE ORIENTED GETAWAY, THE APPLICANT WILL MANAGE THE PROPERTY PERSONALLY WITH ASSISTANCE FROM A LOCAL PROPERTY MANAGER. AS MENTIONED, THE PROPERTY IS AT 145 INDIAN ROAD IS LOCATED IN THE BLUE MOUNTAIN SUBDIVISION. AND WITH THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY, THE DWELLING IS CURRENTLY UNDER CONSTRUCTION. AND SO WE DID REQUEST COMMENTS FROM THE BLUE MOUNTAIN PROPERTY OWNERS ASSOCIATION. BUT THEIR RESPONSE WAS THAT THEY WILL WITHHOLD THEIR CONCURRENCE WITH THE APPLICATION UNTIL THE DWELLING HAS FINISHED CONSTRUCTION, AND THEY HAVE VERIFIED COMPLIANCE WITH ALL POA BYLAWS AND COVENANTS. THERE IS A HEALTH DEPARTMENT PERMIT ON FILE FOR THE DWELLING, AND A MAXIMUM OF FOUR OCCUPANTS FOR THE TWO BEDROOM DWELLING AND THE DWELLING ON THE SUBJECT PROPERTY. WE DO MAKE THEM PUT IN THE FOUNDATION AND DO THE FOUNDATION LOCATION SURVEY BEFORE WE ACCEPT THE APPLICATION. SO WE DO KNOW WHERE THE HOUSE IS GOING TO BE FOR THIS MEASUREMENT. AND THE DWELLING DOES MEET THE SETBACK REQUIREMENT VERY CLEARLY. THE NEAREST RESIDENCE IS ABOUT 250FT TO THE SOUTHEAST. AND I DID USE THE ACTUAL FOUNDATION LOCATION SURVEYS IN THIS CASE TO TAKE THAT MEASUREMENT. IT'S A LITTLE MORE ACCURATE THAN JUST THE MEASURING TOOL. SO IT IS THE THE STANDARD CONDITIONS WE'RE RECOMMENDING. SAME AS THE LAST APPLICATION. WITH YOUR TYPICAL SEPTIC SYSTEM CONDITION FOR HAVING IT SERVICED EVERY FIVE YEARS, WHICH IS TYPICAL FOR A CONVENTIONAL SYSTEM, AND THAT THIS PUBLIC HEARING HAS BEEN PROPERLY ADVERTISED. ADJACENT PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED. AND THE APPLICANT IS HERE THIS EVENING. IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR US. THANK YOU. DOES THE APPLICANT HAVE ANYTHING YOU WANT TO ADD TO MR. LYNN'S COMMENTS? YES, SIR. I'M HAPPY TO STEP UP IF YOU GUYS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. OKAY. IF IF WE DO, WE'LL CALL YOU UP THEN. OKAY. WITH THAT, PUBLIC HEARING IS OPEN. ANYONE CARE TO SPEAK FOR OR AGAINST? LAST CALL. PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED. SOUNDS LIKE. WELL, MY CONCERN IS. SO WE GOT A FOUNDATION. THAT'S IT. SO? SO THAT IS WHERE IT WAS AT WHEN HE APPLIED. HE HAS ACTUALLY GOT THE WALLS UP AT THIS POINT. I THINK HIS NEXT INSPECTION WILL BE FRAMING OR HE'S AT THAT POINT IN ON TO PUTTING IN WINDOWS AND STUFF. SO WE'RE COMFORTABLE. IT'S GOING TO MEET THE REQUIREMENTS A BIT BIT. NEW CONSTRUCTION OF THE BUILDING CODE. ABSOLUTELY. IT HAS TO MEET THE PLANS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN APPROVED. IF THEY DOESN'T BUILD IT ACCORDING TO THOSE PLANS, THEY HAVE TO AMEND THE PLANS AND IT GOES THROUGH ANOTHER REVIEW TO MAKE SURE IT'LL MEET BILLING SO THEY CAN'T SNEAK IN ANOTHER BEDROOM. NO, NO. OKAY. ALL RIGHT. I STILL FEEL LIKE THE ASSOCIATION THERE KIND OF HAS A POINT. IT'S NOT. IT'S NOT FINISHED YET. SO HOW ARE YOU SURE IT'S GOING TO BE? WELL, THE SEPTIC SOLELY, YOU KNOW. OH, RIGHT. YOU CAN YOU CAN CHEAT NUMBER OF BEDROOMS A LITTLE BIT AND REWRITE THE PERMIT DIFFERENT. BUT THE BOTTOM LINE IS THAT THERE'S TWO RULES. YEAH. NUMBER A NUMBER OF PEOPLE, YOU KNOW, SO YOU CAN DO ALL TWO BEDROOM FOR OCCUPANCY OR YOU CAN DO THREE BEDROOM FOR OCCUPANCY. YOU CAN DO THREE BEDROOM, SIX OCCUPANCY. SO I'D SAY THEIR LIMIT AS FAR AS NUMBER OF PEOPLE. OH. EVEN IF IT WAS ANOTHER ROOM OR SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, AS LONG AS THEY DIDN'T YOU KNOW, I DON'T CARE IF EVERYBODY SLEEPS IN A SEPARATE ROOM, YOU KNOW, THEY COULD SLEEP IN THE LIVING ROOM, YOU KNOW? BUT, YEAH, THEY WOULDN'T OVERDO THE THE SEPTIC OR WATER SYSTEM. YEAH. SO THE NUMBER OF OCCUPANTS, I THINK, IS THE BIGGER DRIVER FOR A SHORT TERM RENTAL, FOR PROTECTING ENVIRONMENT KIND OF THING. YEAH. OKAY. OKAY. YOU. COFFEE? YOU OKAY? YEAH. ANYTHING? GOOD. OKAY. TAKE A MOTION. PLEASE MOVE THE PLANNING COMMISSION FORWARD. THIS APPLICATION TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR THE RECOMMENDATION TO APPROVE THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT REQUEST FOR 145 INDIAN PIPES ROAD FOR A SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL. WITH THE CONDITIONS AS RECOMMENDED BY STAFF. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. [00:25:04] OPPOSED? AYES HAVE IT. IT'S BEEN APPROVED. IT'LL BE FOUGHT ON TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, AND THEIR AGENDA WILL PROBABLY TAKE IT UP IN THE NEIGHBORHOOD OF A MONTH NOW. THANK YOU. THANK YOU. OKAY. OUR NEXT ITEM. PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT FEES. [VI.D. Planning and Zoning Department Fees - A request to amend the Planning and Zoning Department fee schedule in accordance with recent amendments to the subdivision ordinance and to improve organization. - Chase Lenz, Zoning Administrator] THE REQUEST TO AMEND THE PLANNING AND ZONING DEPARTMENT FEE SCHEDULE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE RECENT AMENDMENTS TO THE SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE AND IMPROVE ORGANIZATION. MR. LENZ. YES, SIR. SO, AS YOU ARE AWARE OF RECENT CHANGES TO THE CODE OF VIRGINIA REGARDING SUBDIVISION PLAT SUBMITTALS, REVIEWS AND APPROVALS NECESSITATED TEXT AMENDMENTS TO THE WARREN COUNTY SUBDIVISION ORDINANCE. WE GOT THOSE IN IN TIME, SO WE'RE IN GOOD SHAPE. BUT THE FEE SCHEDULE DOESN'T MATCH HOW IT WORKS NOW. SO THAT IS THE THE DRIVING POINT OF THIS ITEM. AS THE TEXT AMENDMENTS REMOVED ALL REFERENCES TO THE CLASS SYSTEM, WHICH BASICALLY DEFINED WHO WHO APPROVED IT AND WHAT THE APPROVAL PROCESS WAS. SO THEY'RE ALL HELD TO THE SAME STANDARD NOW. AND SO WE DON'T NEED TO HAVE THREE DIFFERENT FEES FOR THE SAME THING. AND SO THAT IS THE STARTING POINT. AND THE LAST TIME WE DID THE FEE SCHEDULE UPDATE WAS JULY OF 2023. AND SO OBVIOUSLY, SINCE THAT TIME, WE'VE BEEN, YOU KNOW, KEEPING A RUNNING, TALLY OF THINGS THAT NEED TO BE ADDED. AND WITH THIS TRIGGER, WE'VE IMPLEMENTED SOME OF THOSE. SO I FIGURED IT WOULD BE BEST TO JUST GO THROUGH CHANGES. AND I DID BREAK THEM DOWN INTO CATEGORIES OF CHANGES. I'VE GOT NEW FEE SCHEDULE ITEMS, FEE INCREASES, AND ORGANIZATIONAL CHANGES. SO FOR THE NEW FEE SCHEDULE ITEMS THE PLAN FOR TO REPLACE THE CLASS SYSTEM IS FOR IT TO EITHER BE AN EXEMPT OR A NONEXEMPT SUBDIVISION. AND SO THE NEW FEE SCHEDULE ITEM THAT IS NOT CURRENTLY ON THE FEE SCHEDULE IS THE NONEXEMPT SUBDIVISION ITEM. WE HAVE ALSO IDENTIFIED THAT THERE IS NOT A SPECIFIC FEE CURRENTLY FOR CLUSTER HOUSING DEVELOPMENT SUBDIVISIONS. WHICH IS A LOT MORE WORK AND A LOT MORE PROCESS AS FAR AS REVIEW GOES, AND THEREFORE WARRANTS A HIGHER FEE. WE'RE ADDING A MINOR SITE PLAN REVIEW FEE. SO THINK OF LIKE IF YOU'RE TRYING TO, YOU KNOW, REVISE AN EXISTING SITE PLAN. IF TESLA IS TRYING TO PUT UP CHARGERS IN ROYAL FARMS PARKING LOT, YOU COULD DO IT'S NOT INTRODUCING A NEW USE. IT'S BUILDING ON AN EXISTING SITE PLAN. AND SO THAT'S THE PURPOSE OF A MINOR SITE PLAN SO THAT YOU KNOW, THEY'RE NOT PAYING THE SAME FEE THAT WALMART DID WHEN THEY BUILT THEIR BIG SHOPPING CENTER THERE. WE'RE LOOKING TO ADD CONSERVATION EASEMENT REVIEW, WHICH CURRENTLY HAS NO FEE BOND FEES FOR THE ESTABLISHMENT OF A BOND REDUCTION, RELEASE OF A BOND AND REPLACEMENT OF A BOND. AND FOR THE AG FOREST DISTRICT FOR A FEE, FOR A NEW DISTRICT TO BE CREATIVE AND ADDITIONS OR WITHDRAWAL. AND THOSE WOULD ONLY APPLY IF WE ARE OUTSIDE OF THE TYPICAL TEN YEAR REVIEW PERIOD. BECAUSE YOU'LL HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY EVERY, EVERY TIME WE REVIEW IT TO BE ADDED OR REMOVED. AND SO FOR FEE INCREASES. THE EXEMPT SUBDIVISION FEE IS CURRENTLY 500 WITH $150 PER LOT. WITH AND WE'RE PROPOSING AN INCREASE TO 1000, WHICH MATCHES THE CURRENT CLASS A SUBDIVISION FEE. FEE INCREASE FOR BZA BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS, VARIANCE AND APPEALS. IT'S CURRENTLY $750, AND WE ARE PROPOSING $1,000 TO REFLECT THE COUNTY ATTORNEY AND STAFF TIME. AND BECAUSE A VARIANCE APPLICATION DOES ONLY APPLY IF THERE IS NO OTHER SOLUTION FOR THE ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT, WE ARE LOOKING TO INCREASE THIS FROM 500 TO 1000. DUE TO THE STAFF AND COUNTY ATTORNEY TIME INVOLVED IN DRAFTING AND REVIEWING A TEXT AMENDMENT AND A RIGHT AWAY VACATION. IT IS PROPOSED TO BE INCREASED FROM 250 TO 750. BECAUSE IT DOES NECESSITATE AN ORDINANCE TO BE DRAFTED BY THE COUNTY ATTORNEY'S OFFICE. AND SO 250 DOES NOT COVER THAT. SO A LOT OF THE ORGANIZATIONAL CHANGES WERE TWO THINGS LISTED THAT WERE THE SAME FEE AND CATEGORICALLY SIMILAR. SO COMMERCIAL SITE PLAN VERSUS INDUSTRIAL SITE PLAN WAS CHANGED TO COMMERCIAL SLASH INDUSTRIAL SITE PLAN WITH ONE FEE LISTED SINCE IT MATCHES FOR BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENTS. THE IT'S A BREAKDOWN OF FEES BASED ON THE NUMBER OF LOTS INVOLVED IN THE BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENTS AND THE CHANGE THAT WE'RE PROPOSING FOR THAT IS JUST TO MATCH THE THE NUMBER OF LOT I GUESS KIND OF LINE FOR THE DIFFERENT FEES AND LOT CONSOLIDATIONS. I THINK IT WAS IT'S CURRENTLY LIKE THREE AND FOUR LOTS IS 3 OR 4 LOTS IS THE DIFFERENCE IN THE FEE FOR BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENTS. [00:30:02] AND IT'S 4 OR 5 LOTS FOR LOT CONSOLIDATION. SO IT JUST MAKES SENSE TO MAKE THEM BE THE SAME. WHAT I JUST SAID FOR THE SITE PLAN IS ONE OF THEM. SAME FOR REZONING COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL COMBINED INTO ONE LINE ITEM. SAME FOR VARIANCE AND APPEAL. SAME FEE. SO COMBINING IT INTO ONE LINE ITEM INSTEAD OF TWO. AND SO ANOTHER THING THAT WE'RE LOOKING TO SPECIFY THAT JUST HASN'T BEEN CLEAR FOR APPLICANTS IS FOR THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR A NONPROFIT. IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN FOR A NONPROFIT, A REGISTERED NONPROFIT, AND IT HAS BEEN CONFUSED OVER WHETHER THE USE WILL GENERATE A PROFIT. AND SO, YOU KNOW, PRIVATE USE CAMPING, FOR EXAMPLE. WHEN REALLY YOU NEED TO BE SUBMITTING YOUR DOCUMENTATION AS A 501 C3 TO QUALIFY FOR THAT NONPROFIT FEE. AND SAME GOES FOR ZONING AND FLOODPLAIN DETERMINATION. JUST TO COMBINE INTO A SINGLE LINE ITEM, THE CODE OF VIRGINIA REQUIRES THE PLANNING COMMISSION TO HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING TO APPROVE THE PROPOSAL FOR ANY FEE SCHEDULE CHANGES RELATING TO THE ZONING AND SUBDIVISION ORDINANCES PRIOR TO THEM BEING FORWARDED TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS FOR FINAL PUBLIC HEARING AND DECISION. THE PUBLIC HEARING HAS BEEN PROPERLY ADVERTISED, ADJACENT PROPERTY OWNERS HAVE BEEN NOTIFIED AND I'M AVAILABLE IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. KELLY DID A LOT OF RESEARCH INTO LOCALS OR SURROUNDING JURISDICTION FEES. AND SO SHE'S A WEALTH OF KNOWLEDGE FOR THAT. AND OBVIOUSLY MATT'S BEEN HERE FOR FOREVER AND CAN TELL YOU ABOUT THE HISTORY OF HER FEE SCHEDULE AND HOW IT'S CHANGED A TOTAL OF TWO TIMES IN THE TIME HE'S BEEN HERE THE SECOND TIME. BUT YES, WE'RE AVAILABLE IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS. THANK YOU. I WOULD I WOULD ADD THAT THE COST OF ADVERTISEMENTS IN THE LOCAL MEDIA, PAPER MEDIA HAVE GONE UP JUST SIGNIFICANTLY. AND YOU KNOW, EVERY YEAR WE BUDGET SO MUCH AND IT JUST SEEMS LIKE WE'RE GOING OVER BUDGET ON THAT, I DON'T KNOW. YOU KNOW, WE'RE REQUIRED, I THINK, BY STATE LAW TO DO THAT. I DON'T KNOW IF THAT WILL EVER CHANGE WHERE WE COULD GO TO A DIGITAL ONLY WHERE IT MAYBE HAVING TO BE A LITTLE CHEAPER, WHERE WE COULD JUST PAY LIKE A YEARLY FEE AND NOT HAVE, YOU KNOW, $1,000 EVERY MONTH. YOU KNOW, FOR OUR, FOR OUR FEES. AND THAT THAT APPLIES TO OUR BOARD OF ZONING APPEAL AS AND THE PLANNING COMMISSION ADDS. SO AGAIN, WE'RE JUST TRYING TO KEEP UP WITH, YOU KNOW, THE COST OF DOING BUSINESS AND NOT HAVING TO CHARGE TAKE IT OUT OF OUR, OUR BUDGET, REGULAR BUDGET. YOU KNOW, IT'S A FEE BASED THING. SO JUST POINT THAT OUT. OKAY. WITH THAT, PUBLIC HEARING IS NOW OPEN. ANYONE CARE TO SPEAK? PUBLIC HEARING IS CLOSED. AND I PERSONALLY ON THE GOING TO, YOU KNOW, AN ONLINE TYPE ADVERTISEMENT. I WOULDN'T SEE THAT UNTIL WE'D HAVE COUNTY WIDE BROADBAND. YEAH. SO NOW I KNOW IT'S A DEAD EXPENSE AND CONSIDERABLE. YEAH. AND I DON'T SEE THEY MADE SOME CHANGES TO PUBLICATION REQUIREMENTS A FEW YEARS AGO, BUT IF ANYTHING, THEY JUST KIND OF BECOME MORE EXPANSIVE AND REQUIRING YOU TO PUBLISH MORE PLACES. I DON'T I DON'T SEE THAT CHANGE HAPPENING SOON. YEAH. YEAH. OKAY. THANK YOU. I KNOW THIS WASN'T ONE OF THE CHANGES, BUT ON THE GIS FEES I JUST LOOKING THROUGH ALL THE OTHER FEE SCHEDULES THAT YOU PROVIDED. WE ARE THE ONLY COUNTY THAT CHARGES FOR SHAPEFILES. AND I WAS WONDERING, YOU KNOW, WHAT KIND OF REVENUE DO WE ACTUALLY GET FROM THAT? AND IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE THAT WE NEED TO CHARGE FOR? SO I KNOW MATT MIGHT KNOW A LITTLE MORE, BUT I KNOW THAT HE DOES A THE POINT OF THE FEES FOR THE STAFF TIME INVOLVED. HE DOES HAVE TO PULL IT INTO A STORABLE FORMAT TO SEND TO THEM. OFTENTIMES IT COULD BE A LARGE FILE AND WE HAVE TO DO A USB OR SOMETHING INVOLVED WITH THAT. I KNOW A LOT OF COUNTIES WILL HAVE THEM JUST COUNTY WIDE DATA AVAILABLE FOR DOWNLOAD ON THEIR WEBSITE. SO IT'S NO, I MEAN, IT'S TIME TO SET IT UP AND THEN YOU'VE GOT TO PERIODICALLY UPDATE IT. SO SOME KIND OF DISCLAIMER, YOU KNOW, THIS IS EFFECTIVE AS OF I WILL I CAN I COULD TALK TO MISTER GRIFFITH, THE GIS COORDINATOR, ABOUT THAT. BUT I DO THINK THERE ARE LIMITATIONS WITH OUR WEBSITE AS FAR AS STORAGE CAPACITY GOES. BUT, YEAH, WE COULD TALK TO IT. I WOULD WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE THAT AVAILABLE BEFORE WE REMOVE THE FEE. AND SO, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD JUST TELL THEM, HERE'S WHERE IT IS ON THE WEBSITE. GO GET IT. YEAH, I'LL JUST PUT IT OUT THERE. I DON'T LIKE THAT WE CHARGE FOR SHAPEFILES. I IT IS VERY ANNOYING WHEN COUNTIES DO THAT. SO I ALSO NOTICED THAT. [00:35:03] SO CLARK COUNTY HAS A DIFFERENT FEES FOR CAST AND BLASTING REVIEW IS THAT I'M SORRY. WHAT? REVIEW CAST LIKE CARS, TOPOGRAPHY AND BLASTING. THOSE ARE TWO DIFFERENT CATEGORIES. IS THAT SOMETHING THAT WE SHOULD CONSIDER? YOU KNOW, HAVING SUBSTANTIAL CARS, TOPOGRAPHY AS WELL. YOU KNOW, DOES THAT WHERE WOULD THAT GET? I WOULD PROBABLY WANT TO TALK TO SOME OF THEIR STAFF TO SEE HOW IT'S USED. TO ME, IT SOUNDS LIKE IT MAY BE TO COVER A COST OF HAVING AN EXPERT EVALUATE A SITE TO PROVIDE A REPORT. THEY HAVE MORE TROUBLE. THEY HAVE. THEY HAVE A LOT OF UNDERGROUND CAVES. YEAH. IT'S UP THERE. SO MORE THAN. THAN WE DO. YEAH. OH, YEAH. THEY. THEY'VE GOT A WEIRD SOME WEIRD GROUND OVER THERE. YEAH. SOME OF MY FORMER EMPLOYERS, WE'VE DONE SOME PROJECTS OVER THERE WHERE THEY'RE REQUIRED BLASTING. AND THEN WHEN THE SHOCK GOES OFF, RATHER THAN HAVING THE HUMP COME UP, IT JUST DISAPPEARED. YEAH. YEAH. YEAH, IT'S. IT'S SOME WEIRD, WEIRD STUFF. OH, SHENANDOAH COUNTY'S GOT A POCKET, TOO. A REAL HEAVY SHRINK. SWELL. AND IT'S ACTUALLY LIKE, IF YOU GO INTO THEIR BUILDING INSPECTION OFFICE TO PERMIT AND YOU'RE IN THAT MAP, YOU GET A DIFFERENT SET OF RULES FOR FROST FOOT OR GOES FROM 2 FOOT TO 4 FOOT, YOU KNOW, SO THAT THAT'S KIND OF ANOTHER EXAMPLE WHERE THAT COUNTY, THEY KNOW THEY'VE GOT A, A GEOGRAPHIC AREA THAT'S GOT A PROBLEM. AND I THINK WHY YOU SEE IT IN CLARK IS BECAUSE THEY'VE GOT AREAS THAT HAVE A PROBLEM AND THAT WE TYPICALLY DON'T HAVE MUCH OF THAT. YEAH. THAT MAKES SENSE. YEAH. YEAH. WELL THAT'S ESPECIALLY PREVALENT AROUND MARYVILLE. ON THE CHANGES I, I DON'T HAVE ANY ANY INPUT OTHER THAN I THINK WE SHOULD DO. I THINK WE SHOULD MAKE ANOTHER CHANGE AND GET RID OF THE SHAPEFILE FEE. BUT SOMETHING TELLS ME YOU'RE A MAPPING PROFESSIONAL. NO, NO, I JUST USED TO PLAY AROUND WITH IT. WE CAN. I WANT TO SAY THERE'S PROBABLY LESS THAN TEN PEOPLE IN. WELL, THERE'S LESS THAN TEN PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM TO BEGIN WITH, BUT THERE'S AN ON AVERAGE, LESS THAN TEN PEOPLE IN THIS ROOM THAT KNOW WHAT A SHAPEFILE IS. YEAH. YEAH. WE CAN WE CAN RUN THIS BY COREY AND JUST KIND OF SEE WHAT KIND OF REVENUE WE GET. I DON'T THINK HE GETS A WHOLE LOT OF. WELL, I WOULD ARGUE WE PROBABLY HAVE MORE PEOPLE USE OUR GIS PRODUCTS. YEAH. OR THE SHAPEFILES THAT. YEAH. IF THEY DIDN'T HAVE TO PAY $125 PER. YEAH. PER. THE THING IS THOUGH, IS A PARCEL. THE PARCEL SHAPEFILE IS THE ONE THAT REALLY TAKES TIME, STAFF TIME. OKAY. AND THAT'D BE THE ONE THAT I WOULD BE KIND OF THINKING THAT SHOULD BE CHARGED FOR THE OTHER ONES, LIKE YOUR FLOODPLAIN STUFF AND THAT KIND OF THING. THAT'S PRETTY STATIC. IT STAYS THE SAME. DOESN'T CHANGE MUCH. YOU KNOW, I COULD SEE JUSTIFYING MAYBE SOMETHING LIKE THAT, BUT I THINK THERE ARE ONES THAT WE ARE CONSTANTLY HE'S CONSTANTLY WORKING ON THAT JUSTIFIES. BUT IS HE WORKING? I WOULD THINK THAT IT SHOULD BE CHARGED IF SOMEBODY'S MAKING A SPECIAL REQUEST. BUT IF HE IS JUST AS PART OF HIS JOB GOING THROUGH AND MODIFYING OUR UPDATE AND CLEANING UP THE FILE. THEN, YEAH, THEN I DON'T THINK SOMEBODY SHOULD BE CHARGED FOR THAT BECAUSE IT'S PART OF HIS JOB, AND WE COULD JUST MAKE THAT AVAILABLE ONCE OR TWICE A YEAR. AND IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE. YOU KNOW, HIS LATEST WORK IS ALWAYS UPLOADED. AND IF YOU WANT SOMETHING, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOW JULY. SORRY. FILES FROM JANUARY. IF YOU WANT SOMETHING MORE RECENT, THEN THAT'S SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, MAYBE WE CHARGE FOR. OKAY. DO YOU WANT TO TABLE THIS OR DO YOU WANT TO MAKE A MOTION TAKING IT OUT THERE? WELL, I WON'T BE HERE NEXT MONTH, SO I DON'T WANT TO HOLD THIS UP FOR TWO MONTHS. AND YEAH, I, I THINK, YOU KNOW, WE CAN ASSESS THAT AND KIND OF TAKE A LOOK AT IT AND THEN WE'LL DO ALL OF THE GIS FEES AND JUST KIND OF SEE IF THERE'S ANYTHING THAT WE NEED TO, YOU KNOW, IDENTIFY. IN ADDITION TO THAT, I WOULD SAY THAT THERE SHOULD BE A PRIORITY FOR PUSHING THE SUBDIVISION FEE CHANGES. YEAH. OUR CURRENT FEE SCHEDULE DOES NOT MATCH THE CODE. THAT'S OUR PRIMARY. THIS IS PROBABLY A MINOR THING THAT THAT SHOULDN'T HOLD UP THE REST OF THE SCHEDULE. SO YEAH, WE COULD DEFINITELY EVALUATE THAT FOR ANOTHER FEE. SCHEDULE UPDATE IN THE FUTURE. YEAH. ALL RIGHT. READY? READY. I MOVE THE PLANNING COMMISSION FOR THE PROPOSED PLANNING DEPARTMENT. FEE SCHEDULE CHANGES TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WITH THE RECOMMENDATION OF APPROVAL. SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? OBVIOUSLY. EYES HAVE IT. PUBLIC HEARINGS ARE CLOSED. NEXT ITEM. CONSENT AGENDA, AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE. [VII. Consent Agenda] AND I KNOW THERE'S GOING TO BE DISCUSSION ON ITEM F. MR. CHAIR, I MOVE THAT WE PULL ITEM F FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA FOR DISCUSSION AND ADD ITEM K 2020 57-02 ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT FOR SHORT TERM RENTAL. TOURISTS. OKAY. WE HAVE A PARTIAL MOTION BY TWO PEOPLE. [00:40:08] LEGALLY, WE NEED THAT ROLL IN FROM ONE PERSON. OKAY, COOL. OR I CAN DO IT IF YOU WANT. YEAH. YOU JUST. OKAY. THEN THEN PULL F OUT FOR DISCUSSION. RIGHT, MR. CHAIRMAN, AND MAKE THE MOTION THAT WE ACCEPT THE CONSENT AGENDA WITH THE CHANGES PULLING ITEM F Z 2025 0701 AND ADDING ITEM K, ITEM NUMBERS Z 2025 0702. ZONING TEXT AMENDMENT FOR SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTALS. IS THERE A SECOND? SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR THE CONSENT AGENDA, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? I HAVE IT. OKAY. I HAD HIM UP FIRST. MR. WENDLING, YOU'RE UP. WE'RE NOT GOING TO DISCUSS OR DISCUSS AT FIRST. I THINK WE NEED TO DISCUSS THAT FIRST. THAT'S WHY HE PULLED IT. [VII. F. Z2025-07-01 - Zoning Text Amendments for Building Service Establishment - An ordinance to amend Chapter 180 of the Warren County Code (zoning ordinance) to amend §180-8C to add a new definition for building service establishment, to enact §180-21D(51) to make building service establishment permissible only upon issuance of a conditional use permit in the Agricultural zoning district, and to enact §180-36.1 to add supplementary regulations for building service establishment. - Chase Lenz, Zoning Administrator] YOU KNOW, GIVEN THAT MATT WILL BE HERE NEXT MONTH, I THINK I CAN TAKE. ALL RIGHT. WE CAN. ALL RIGHT. OKAY. DID YOU WANT ME TO GIVE A BRIEF PRESENTATION, OR DID YOU WANT TO JUST GO INTO YOUR QUESTIONS? CONCERNS? I DON'T KNOW. I HAVEN'T STUDIED ON IT MUCH, THOUGH. OH, MR.. I'LL JUST GIVE IT A GLANCE, BECAUSE IT'S. WOULD YOU LIKE FOR ME TO SUMMARIZE, OR DO YOU WANT TO JUST DIVE IN? IT MIGHT BE HELPFUL FOR YOU TO SUMMARIZE, PLEASE. YES, PLEASE. YES. ATTACHED, YOU WILL FIND A DRAFT ORDINANCE TO AMEND CHAPTER 180 OF THE WARREN COUNTY CODE TO ADD A NEW DEFINITION FOR BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT TO ADD BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT AS A USE PERMITTED BY A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT IN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT AND TO ADD NEW SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS FOR BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT. TEXT AMENDMENTS ARE BEING REQUESTED BY RAY BRAMBLE OF BRAMBLE ENTERPRISES LLC, A LOCAL HVAC AND PLUMBING COMPANY LOCATED ON COMMERCE AVENUE IN FRONT ROYAL. THE APPLICANT IS INTERESTED IN ESTABLISHING A SECONDARY SUPPORT FACILITY FOR HIS BUSINESS AT 3812 GARDE HILL ROAD, PRIMARILY FOR THE STORAGE OF RESIDENTIAL, HVAC AND PLUMBING SUPPLIES, EQUIPMENT AND MATERIALS, AND FOR THE STAGING OF UNITS TO BE HAULED OFF SITES FOR INSTALLATION. UPON REVIEW OF THIS REQUEST, STAFF IDENTIFIED HOME SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT SUCH AS EXTERMINATOR, PLUMBER, DECORATOR OR APPLIANCE SERVICE AS A CURRENTLY UNDEFINED LAND USE PERMITTED BY RIGHT ONLY IN THE COMMERCIAL ZONING DISTRICT. SINCE THE PROPERTY IN QUESTION IS ZONED AGRICULTURAL TEXT, AMENDMENTS ARE NECESSARY FOR HOME BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENTS TO BE PERMISSIBLE IN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT. STAFF IS RECOMMENDING THE BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT LAND USE BE PERMISSIBLE ONLY BY CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT IN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT, WITH SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS TO REDUCE THE IMPACT ON ADJACENT PROPERTIES WITHIN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT. THE TEXT AMENDMENT APPLICATION WAS FILED CONCURRENTLY WITH THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT APPLICATION FOR TO ESTABLISH A BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT AT 3812 GUARD HILL ROAD. SO THAT ITEM WILL FOLLOW THIS ITEM EVERYWHERE IT GOES. FOR THE PROPOSED DEFINITION, WE'RE PROPOSING A FACILITY PROVIDING SERVICES FOR RESIDENTIAL, COMMERCIAL, INSTITUTIONAL OR LIGHT INDUSTRIAL STRUCTURES SUCH AS EXTERMINATOR, PLUMBER, DECORATOR, ELECTRICIAN OR HEATING, VENTILATION, VENTILATION AND AIR CONDITIONING, OR OTHER APPLIANCE SERVICE AND RELATED EQUIPMENT STORAGE, STAGING AND REPAIRS. THIS USE SHALL BE SHALL COMPLY WITH THE SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS SET FORTH IN SUBSECTION 180 36.1 OF THIS CHAPTER. PROPOSED SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS ARE INTENDED FOR BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENTS IN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT. ONLY. STAFF BELIEVES MANY OF THE PROPOSED SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS WOULD NOT BE APPLICABLE OR MAY NOT BE AS NECESSARY IN THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. PROPOSED SUPPLEMENTARY REGULATIONS INCLUDE A REQUIREMENT FOR THE ESTABLISHMENT TO FRONT UPON AND HAVE ACCESS TO A STATE MAINTAINED ROAD, WITH VDOT APPROVAL FOR THE ENTRANCE AND ILLUSTRATIVE DEVELOPMENT PLAN REQUIREMENTS. A RESTRICTION ON THE TOTAL NUMBER OF EMPLOYEES AND CUSTOMERS EXCEEDING THE MAXIMUM OCCUPANCY APPROVED BY THE CERTIFICATE OF OCCUPANCY OR OPERATION PERMIT FOR THE SEPTIC SYSTEM, WHICHEVER IS LESSER. A FULL SCREEN AND 25 FOOT SETBACK REQUIREMENT FOR OUTDOOR STORAGE AND STAGING AREA FROM PROPERTY LINES, OFF STREET PARKING, LANDSCAPING AND LIGHTING REQUIREMENTS. A REQUIREMENT FOR THE HOURS OF OPERATION TO BE SET BY CONDITION, PLACED ON THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT, AND A RESTRICTION ON THE USE OF THE PROPERTY FOR COMMERCIAL AUTO REPAIRS, UNLESS APPROVED SEPARATELY BY A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT FOR AUTO STAFF AND FOR AUTO SALVAGE, AND AS A JUNKYARD. WITH THAT, I AM OPEN FOR YOUR QUESTIONS AND CONCERNS. MY CONCERN IS ONE. WE DON'T KNOW WHAT THE SIZE OF THE LOT IS, AND TO ME, AGRICULTURAL MEANS YOU'RE FARMING IT. YOU'RE PRODUCING SOMETHING. FOOD. WE HAVE A PROPERTY JUST NORTH OF WHERE I LIVE. [00:45:04] THAT TWO YEARS AGO, THEY REZONED THE HOME. IT'S JUST ON THIS SIDE OF THE THE NATURAL GAS. I FORGET THE NAME OF THE COMPANY. STARTS WITH THE T. YES. THEY WENT THROUGH THE REZONING PROCESS FOR STORAGE FOR THEIR TRUCKS. THEY HAVE A WORKSHOP THERE FOR WORKING ON THEIR TRUCKS AND A COUPLE. THEY'RE USED IN THE HOUSE FOR A COUPLE OF OFFICES. WHEN I DRIVE PAST THERE, USUALLY THERE'S 2 OR 3 CARS THERE, BUT THEY WENT THROUGH THE REZONING. WISH I COULD GET THEM TO KEEP THEIR FENCE CLOSED, BUT. I DON'T THINK THEY HAVE SELF-DRIVING CARS. YOU HAVE TO COME OUT OF THERE. BUT ANYWAY, MY, MY ISSUE IS WE'VE LOOKED AT AGRICULTURAL AND WAYS TO PROTECT THE AGRICULTURAL, BUT HAVE WAYS WHERE THE FARMERS CAN MAKE MONEY, YOU KNOW. WE'VE ADDED WHERE THEY CAN DO AN AUXILIARY BUILDING ADDITIONAL TO THEIR BARN, STUFF LIKE THAT, FOR DIFFERENT PURPOSES THERE. THIS IS NOT AN AGRICULTURAL PURPOSE. THIS IS, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED, 100% INDUSTRIAL. THEY'RE WAREHOUSING. I COMPLETELY DISAGREE. WHAT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE CONTRACTOR STORAGE ORDINANCE THAT YOU WAS TALKING ABOUT A YEAR OR SO AGO THAT I HATED, LIKE FOR A HOME OPERATION? LIKE ME, I'VE GOT MY PIPING EQUIPMENT STORED ON MY YARD. DOES THAT MEAN THAT I WOULD NEED THIS TO DO THAT? WELL, IN IN THE AG AGRICULTURAL STORAGE YARD IS NOT APPROVED. IT'S NOT A USE. WE'VE BEEN DOING IT FOR 40 YEARS. NOBODY'S EVER BEEN DISCIPLINED FOR IT. I DISAGREE. WELL, IT'S NOT A RESTRICTED USE. YEAH. SO. SO THE PROPERTY IF I, IF I'M CORRECT, THE ONE THAT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS THAT ACROSS FROM THE STORAGE FACILITY. AND IT'S LIKE A SMALL BLUE WAREHOUSE BUILDING. IS THAT IT? IS IT THE ONE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT JUST SOUTH OF THE BILL LONG'S PLACE AND YEAH, THE GAS STATION. OKAY. SO THAT WAS REZONED TO INDUSTRIAL FROM AGRICULTURAL. PRIOR TO THOSE APPLICANTS, THEY DID NOT DO THE REZONING. THE PROPERTY OWNERS DID IT AND THEN MARKETED IT AS INDUSTRIAL. SO ONCE THEY BUILT THAT, IT WAS AN INDUSTRIAL USE FELL WITHIN THAT INDUSTRIAL USE. IT IS IN THE CORRIDOR, THE HIGHWAY CORRIDOR OVERLAY. IT WAS IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN TO DO EITHER INDUSTRIAL OR COMMERCIAL. THIS PARTICULAR PROPERTY HAS BEEN OWNED BY MR. LAKE AND HIS FAMILY FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS, AND ITS GOING THROUGH A NUMBER OF CONDITIONAL USE PERMITS. SOME WE'VE NOT HAD ISSUES WITH. AND ONE THE PROPERTY OWNER LEASED TO A DIESEL REPAIR MECHANIC WHO BASICALLY WOULD PULL OUT HIS BUSSES INTO GUARD HILL ROAD TO MOVE THEM AROUND. AND THAT WAS ABOUT THE ONLY TIME WE'VE EVER HAD ANY REAL ISSUES WITH THAT, THAT MR. LAKE HAS RUN A PRETTY TIGHT SHIP IN REGARD TO HIS PROPERTY THERE. IT'S BEEN I THINK A SELF-STORAGE FOR A NUMBER OF YEARS. I WANT TO SAY PROBABLY 30 YEARS. 35 YEARS. MR.. BRANTLEY, I'M SORRY. I DON'T KNOW THAT BRAMBLE. BRAMBLE HAS A PLACE DOWN HERE IN TOWN, AND THIS PROPERTY WOULD BE KIND OF AN OVERFLOW FOR HIM. AND HE RUNS A PRETTY TIGHT SHIP HERE IN TOWN. I DON'T THINK HE HAS THE TOWN HAS ANY ISSUES WITH HIM, YOU KNOW, COLLECTING DEBRIS OR TRASH OR ANYTHING. I KNOW WHERE THEIR OFFICES ARE. YEAH, BUT IT'S MORE THE. IT'S NOT HIS APPLICATION. IT'S THE WHAT WE'RE DOING TO THE AGRICULTURAL AREAS. YEAH. UNLIKE WHAT HUGH'S DOING. HUGHES. THAT'S YOUR RESIDENCE. THIS IS STRICTLY INDUSTRIAL. IS THIS WOULD THIS ALLOW FOR, LIKE, WALKING CUSTOMERS? BECAUSE I DON'T HAVE THAT EITHER. NO, IT'S IT'S ACTUALLY IT'S WAREHOUSING. NO, IT I, I BELIEVE THIS WOULD ALLOW FOR WALK IN CUSTOMERS. IT CERTAINLY DOESN'T RESTRICT IT. YEAH. THIS THIS IS THIS IS A COMMERCIAL USE. I MEAN, THIS IS A BUSINESS. WELL, NO, IF IT IF IT'S ALLOWING US TO SIT THERE AND THOUGHT ABOUT IT AS FAR AS, LIKE STORING EQUIPMENT IN AG, THERE IS NO WORKING PROFITABLE FARMS IN WARREN COUNTY. THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF AGRITOURISM TOURISM COMING, RIGHT. THERE'S A FEW LEFT IN BROWNTOWN. I'D SAY RICK MATTHEWS MIGHT BE SCRATCHING OUT A LIVING FARMING. OH, BY RIGHT KNACK DISTRICT, YOU CAN HAVE STUFF LIKE CHICKEN HOUSES AND THINGS LIKE THAT. I DO, OBVIOUSLY, BUT AG IS REALLY JUST OUR DEFAULT ZONING. WELL, BUT ALSO OUR STATEMENT OF INTENT FOR AG IS THE DISTRICT IS INTENDED FOR AREAS WITH GENERAL AGRICULTURAL PURSUITS OR PRACTICE LOW DENSITY RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENTS [00:50:08] MAY BE SITUATED ALONG MAY BE SITUATED WITHOUT DEGRADING THE ENVIRONMENT, WHERE EXPANSES OF OPEN SPACES BEST EXIST FOR PARKS, PLAYGROUNDS, GAME RESERVES AND SIMILAR USES. SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT NOW IS AN OFFICE. WELL, YEAH. NOW, IF THIS HAS GOT WORKING PEOPLE AND CUSTOMERS COMING IN AND OUT, I WOULD AGREE IT'S IT'S MORE INDUSTRIAL COMMERCIAL BECAUSE OF THAT. BUT IF IT'S JUST PURELY FOR STORAGE. BUT EVEN IF WE SAY IN THE COMP PLAN, WE, WE SAY THIS, THAT WE WANT TO PRESERVE THE RURAL NATURE OF THE COUNTY. ONLY HAVING LAY DOWN YARDS IS NOT. WE'VE GOT DOZENS OF THEM. DOES IT CHANGE THE LOOK OF THE COUNTY ESPECIALLY? WELL, I MEAN, YES IT DOES. AND IF WE HAVE MORE, IT WILL CHANGE THE LOOK OF THE COUNTY MORE. IT WOULD BE. NO. IF IT WAS TRULY AG, IT WOULD BE NO DIFFERENCE. LIKE, YOU KNOW, I'VE GOT A COUPLE PIECES OF EQUIPMENT AND SOME PIPES SITTING THERE IN A BUILDING WITH SOME STUFF STORED IN IT. IF I WAS FARMING, INSTEAD OF THE EQUIPMENT BEING YELLOW, IT'D BE GREEN OR RED, AND I'D HAVE THE SAME JUNK SITTING AROUND THE BUILDING INSTEAD OF PIPE BEING INSIDE THE BUILDING, IT'D BE HAY. I DON'T I DON'T SEE WHERE WE'VE CHANGED TO LOOK AT ANYTHING. I THINK THERE'S PROBABLY LEVELS WHERE IF YOU'RE DOING IT TO THE POINT THAT PEOPLE AREN'T COMPLAINING, IT'S ONE THING. BUT IF IF YOU MAKE IT A BY RIGHT USE AND NOW YOU HAVE WHAT SHOULD BE IN THE INDUSTRIAL STORAGE YARD. LOOK AT IS IT TIMBER WORKS? NEXT TO THEIR PROPERTY. AND THAT'S A STORAGE YARD. YEAH, WELL, THAT'D BE A LITTLE. I SEE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS SOMETHING THAT BIG WOULD BE A LITTLE BIG FOR OUT IN AG. SO MAYBE IT'S A BY PUTTING IT BY MAKING IT A I KNOW WE'RE KIND OF GETTING OFF TRACK NOW, BUT BY ALLOWING THAT IN THE CODE THEN, THEN WE OPEN OURSELVES UP TO SOMETHING LIKE THAT. AND YOU COULD HAVE SOMETHING LIKE THAT ON A 20 ACRE PROPERTY. IT WOULD BE IN A GOOD APPLICATION ON A 20 ACRE PROPERTY FOR A HOME OPERATION, YOU KNOW, LANDSCAPER, EXCAVATOR, TRUCK DRIVER, PLUMBER, ELECTRICIAN TO HAVE BE ABLE TO STORE HIS WORK TRUCKS AND HIS WORK EQUIPMENT ON HIS 20 ACRE LOT OUT IN AG. AND I DON'T THINK THAT CHANGES THE CHARACTER OF THE COUNTY. I WOULD ARGUE THAT IT DOES. THAT IS NOT, WE WOULD BE FAIR TO AGREE TO DISAGREE. IT IS NOT FITTING WITHIN OUR STATEMENT OF INTENT OF THE AG. CORRECT. SINCE WE DON'T KNOW THE SIZE OF THE LOT, I, I THINK IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE WE WERE LOOKING AT MORE IN THE SENSE OF A LIGHT INDUSTRIAL KIND OF THE SCOPE AND SCALE. MAYBE, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE A ELECTRICIANS OR PLUMBERS OR HVAC FOLKS WHO, YOU KNOW, THEIR GARAGE ISN'T BIG ENOUGH, THEIR HOME ISN'T BIG ENOUGH. THEY'D HAVE TO BUILD A LARGE GARAGE IF THEY DON'T HAVE THE ROOM. THIS IS A PLACE IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE, MR. BRAMBLE WAS ACTUALLY GOING TO BUY THE PROPERTY, I THINK. I BELIEVE SO. I WOULD ARGUE THAT THAT THEY HAVE AN OPTION NOW, AND THAT IS TO BUY A PROPERTY IN THE COMMERCIAL AREA AND THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. AND I WOULD BE TOTALLY FINE WITH MAKING IT A USE IN THE INDUSTRIAL. OR WOULD YOU REZONE IT? CAN YOU REZONE JUST A LIGHT INDUSTRIAL ZONE, GARDEN HILL ROAD? IT WOULD BE NICE IF YOU COULD SPOT ZONING. SO THAT WAS PART OF THE INITIAL DISCUSSION. YOU KNOW, I LAID OUT THEIR LEGAL OPTIONS. THEY COULD REZONE THE PROPERTY SINCE THE USE IS CURRENTLY IN THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. THE COMP PLAN DOESN'T SUPPORT A FUTURE LAND USE MAP IS TO REMAIN AGRICULTURAL. AND THERE'S NO SURROUNDING COMMERCIAL. SO YEAH, THE POINT WOULD BE THAT IT WOULD BE CREATING A NEW DISTRICT WITHIN A CLEARLY DEFINED TO OTHER DISTRICT WITHOUT HAVING ANYTHING AROUND IT TO SUPPORT IT. IF YOU DRIVE UP THE LONG HILL ROAD, WHAT'S THAT YOU WOULD SAY THAT IS AN INDUSTRIAL RETAIL AREA OR GARDEN HILL ROAD. GARDEN HILL IS ABOUT AS MIXED USE AS. YES. YEAH. SIGN OUT FRONT. HOW LONG HAS THAT BUILDING BEEN THERE? WHAT'S THAT? HOW LONG HAS THAT BUILDING BEEN THERE? 1953. 1953? YEAH. I WAS GOING TO SAY IT'S ALWAYS BEEN SOMETHING THERE. COMMERCIAL, INDUSTRIAL, SORT OF. AND I THINK MR. LAKE AND HIS, HIS MAYBE HIS FATHER, WHO OWNED LAKE PAVING, I THINK THEY MAY HAVE UTILIZED IT ALSO AS A LIKE A REPAIR SHOP FOR MAYBE FOREVER AND THAT. YEAH. SO YEAH. AND MR. LAKE AGAIN, HE'S, HE'S, YOU KNOW HE'S LEASED IT. HE'S BEEN A VERY GOOD CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT HOLDER. I'LL JUST SAY, YOU KNOW, HE'S ALWAYS BEEN RECEPTIVE. IF THERE WAS A VIOLATION, YOU KNOW, OF ONE OF HIS TENANTS, WE WOULD WE WOULD CONTACT HIM AND HE'D GET IT TAKEN CARE OF. AND AGAIN, YOU KNOW, I THINK MOST YOU LOOK AT THE, THE PROPERTY SHAPE AND WHATNOT MOST OF THE STORAGE, IT'S GOING TO BE ALL IN THE BACK. IT'S NOT GOING TO BE IN THE FRONT. WELL, I WOULD ARGUE WE'RE NOT. WE'RE NOT TALKING ABOUT A PROPERTY HERE. WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CODE. RIGHT? RIGHT. YEAH. [00:55:03] IS IT FOR JUST THIS PROPERTY? I MEAN, IS THIS A TEXT AMENDMENT FOR THE ENTIRE. YEAH, BUT HE'S ASKING FOR. RIGHT. BUT BUT THAT'S WHERE THE CUP COMES IN. THE CAP ALLOWS YOU TO LEGISLATIVELY EITHER DENY THAT CAP OR TO PUT CONDITIONS SPECIFIC TO THAT PROPERTY. RIGHT. SO BUT YOU SAY IF DRIVEN NO THIS IS APPLICANT. YES. RIGHT. THE APPLICANT SUBMITTED. JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE. YEAH OKAY. ONE. AND THAT'S WHY I'M TRYING TO YOU KNOW LOOK AT THE COUNTY AS A WHOLE. NOT NOT INDIVIDUALLY BECAUSE THIS IS NOT GOING TO BE A RESIDENCE WHERE THEY HAVE. OH, IT'S NEVER BEEN THIS BUSINESS RELATED SINCE I'VE BEEN ALIVE. BUT I CAN REMEMBER BECAUSE, LIKE YOU SAID, EVERY FARMER'S GOT EQUIPMENT SITTING OUT. YEAH. AND I GREW UP IN FARM COUNTRY, NORTHERN EAST INDIANA. AND LET ME TELL YOU, THEY GOT A LOT OF EQUIPMENT. HOW COME THIS IS NOT GRANDFATHERED IN IF IT'S BEEN THIS KIND OF USE HERE SINCE THE 50S? HE'S HAD WELL, HE'S HAD A C, LIKE I SAID, A NUMBER OF CUPS. ONE OF THE CUPS WAS FOR A AUTO REPAIR FACILITY IN CONJUNCTION WITH A SINGLE FAMILY DWELLING, BECAUSE THERE'S AN APARTMENT UPSTAIRS. SO IT IS A DWELLING UNIT UPSTAIRS THAT MR. LAKE WOULD LEASE. OR IF THERE WAS TYPICALLY WHAT HAPPENED WAS, I THINK LIKE SOME OF THE WORKERS WHO WORKED AT THAT, YOU KNOW, BUSINESS WOULD LIVE UP THERE AND, YOU KNOW, JUST PAY RENT OR WHATEVER THE CASE MIGHT BE. SO THAT THAT WAS ONE OF THE I THINK ANOTHER ONE WAS FOR A STAIR MANUFACTURING COMPANY OR THEY THEY DID STAIRS. AND THIS WAS, I MEAN, 20 YEARS AGO, YOU KNOW, 15, 20 YEARS AGO. SO IT'S IT'S HAD A NUMBER OF THEM. AND THEN AT THE SAME TIME HE'S HAD THE SELF-STORAGE. SO HE'S HAD ALL THAT SELF STORAGE. IT'S JUST IT'S A GOOD QUESTION ABOUT AND MAYBE, MAYBE JORDAN, IN ORDER FOR A USE TO BE WHEN WE USE THE TERM GRANDFATHERED, REALLY WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT ARE LEGAL NONCONFORMITY WHICH ARE USES THAT ARE LAWFUL. AND THEN A ZONING ORDINANCE IS ADOPTED OR CHANGED TO TO MAKE IT NOT ALLOWED UNDER THE ZONING ORDINANCE. AND THE USE IS ALLOWED TO CONTINUE. BUT IT CAN'T STOP FOR MORE THAN TWO YEARS. AND I DON'T KNOW THE SPECIFICS OF THIS PROPERTY. AND IT ALSO ISN'T REALLY ALLOWED TO CHANGE IN NATURE OR INCREASE IN INTENSITY. AND SO WHAT I'M HEARING FROM MR. WENDLING IS THAT ONE, THIS USE HAS CHANGED OVER THE YEARS IN CONNECTION WITH CUPS, WHICH MEANS THAT IT WOULD HAVE BEEN ALLOWED UNDER THOSE CUPS AND THEREFORE IT DOESN'T PREDATE, YOU KNOW, SOME ZONING REQUIREMENT THAT CHANGED. AND WHAT THEY WANT TO DO NOW IS KIND OF DIFFERENT THAN WHAT THEY'VE BEEN DOING, AND NOT JUST A CONTINUATION. SO IF THEY HAD BEEN OPERATING AUTOMOBILE REPAIR AND THEY WANTED TO DO AUTOMOBILE REPAIR AND THEY HADN'T STOPPED FOR TWO YEARS, MAYBE THEY WOULD BE GRANDFATHERED IN. BUT THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT. I UNDERSTAND. THAT MAKES PERFECT SENSE. YEAH. NOW, IF WE DECIDE NOT TO OR VOTE DOWN F, DOES THAT MEAN G CANNOT BE DONE? NOT TONIGHT. WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT WHEN WE CAN'T DO IT TONIGHT. BUT NO, I KNOW THAT CONSENT AGENDA. IS THIS A THAT CANNOT BE WHAT THEY'RE TRYING TO DO UP THERE CANNOT BE APPROVED ANY OTHER WAY THAN MAKING A CHANGE TO THE CODE. IT'S NOT ALLOWED UNDER OUR CURRENT ZONING ZONING ORDINANCE. BECAUSE LIKE I SAID, YOU DRIVE UP THERE. ONCE YOU GET PAST THE ELKS LODGE, IT'S EVERY SINGLE HOME. THERE'S GOT A BUSINESS JUST ABOUT ONE. AND YOU COULD FIND, I'M SURE. CASE BY CASE, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD GO FIND AN EXAMPLE FOR ALMOST ANYTHING WHERE IT WOULD BE OKAY IN THAT ONE LOCATION. BUT BY DOING A TEXT AMENDMENT, WE'RE WE'RE OPENING IT UP THAT IT COULD GO ANYWHERE. WELL, IT'S STILL BY KEEPING VOTED DOWN IF IT DOES FIT THE NEIGHBORHOOD, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT GOING TO BE HERE FOREVER. YOU KNOW SOMEBODY ELSE. SOMEBODY ELSE WILL BE HERE. YOU DON'T WANT TO RULE THE SEAT FROM YOUR GRAVE. YOU'RE ROOTING FOR SOMEBODY. MAYBE I DO. I THINK IT'S A GOOD PROPERTY. I WILL SAY THAT THIS PROPERTY HAS ALWAYS BEEN SOME KIND OF COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL IN FOR A STORAGE FACILITY. AND A COUPLE OFFICE SPACES WILL NOT BE SIGNIFICANTLY DIFFERENT. LEGALLY IT MAY BE DIFFERENT, BUT AS FAR AS AN IMPACT ON THE NEIGHBORHOOD, NOT REALLY CHANGING MUCH. GOT A FEW TRUCKS AND VANS COMING IN AND OUT. HAD THAT BEFORE. A COUPLE OF PEOPLE WORKING IN THE OFFICE HAD THAT BEFORE. OH, I DON'T THINK IT'S A BAD USE FOR THIS PROPERTY, BUT I GET WHAT YOU'RE SAYING WHEN YOU DO THE AMENDMENT. IT COULD OPEN UP OTHER APPLICATIONS, BUT THAT DOES NOT MEAN THAT THEY ARE APPROVED. I'LL MENTION, IF YOU THINK OF IT FROM A KIND OF AN ECONOMIC STANDPOINT FOR SMALL BUSINESSMEN WHO ARE TRYING TO GET THEIR FEET [01:00:02] ON THE GROUND, SOMETIMES PURCHASING COMMERCIAL PROPERTY CAN BE QUITE EXPENSIVE FOR THEM. AND I MEAN, AGAIN, THIS IS NOT SOMETHING YOU'RE GOING TO RULE ON ONE WAY OR ANOTHER. THAT'S NOT THAT'S NOT UP TO US TO HELP THEM FIGURE OUT. WELL SURE. RIGHT. BUT MY MY POINT IS, I DO WANT SMALL BUSINESS IN THE COMMERCIAL DISTRICT. AND IF WE NEED MORE COMMERCIAL DISTRICTS, THEN WE SHOULD NOT HAVE THIS BIG BUSINESS IN THE COMMERCIAL AND THEY SHOULD HAVE MORE COMMERCIAL ZONED AREAS IF THAT'S THE INTENT. YEAH, I WOULD SAY I WOULD AGREE WITH YOU TO A POINT, BECAUSE YES, IT WOULD BE NICE IF A DEVELOPER, IF SOMEBODY CAME IN AND PUT SOME FLEX WAREHOUSING, SMALLER WAREHOUSING TO SERVE THOSE PEOPLE ON THOSE PROPERTIES ALONG THE CORRIDOR. I DON'T KNOW WHAT WE COULD DO TO PROMOTE THAT. IT'D BE NICE IF WE HAD SOME DEVELOPERS WHO THOUGHT, OKAY, WE CAN DO THIS AND GET SOME DECENT LEASE MONEY OUT OF THESE, YOU KNOW, THESE TYPE OF BUSINESSES. AND CERTAINLY PLANNING WOULD DIRECT THEM TO THAT, THAT TYPE OF A PROPERTY. BUT THIS PROPERTY JUST HAPPENS TO BE AN ASSET, AND IT'S BEEN. YEAH. SO, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, IT'S A NEED. IT'S JUST THIS IS A VERY ISOLATED. WHEN I SAY ISOLATED, IT'S THERE. AND IT'S BEEN THERE FOR A WHILE. SO THAT'S WHY IT'S BEEN. THAT'S WHY THE PROPERTY OWNERS, THE PROPERTY OWNERS, ARE INTERESTED IN DIVESTING HIMSELF OF THE PROPERTY. AND WELL, SO SO MY INTENT, BY TAKING IT OFF THE CONSENT AGENDA SO WE COULD DISCUSS IT. YEAH. I WILL NOT BE HERE NEXT MONTH. WOULD EVERYBODY. I'D LIKE TO BE HERE FOR THE DISCUSSION. WHEN? WHEN WE GO TO PUBLIC HEARING. WOULD EVERYBODY BE OKAY IF WE SCHEDULE THE PUBLIC HEARING ADVERTISED SEPTEMBER MAIN FOR THE SEPTEMBER MEETING? I'M NOT DEAD AGAINST THAT. BUT IS THAT FAIR TO THE APPLICANT FOR US, THIS TIMELINE? I MEAN, IF THE APPLICANT HAD NO ISSUE WITH IT, I I'M I'M NOT OPPOSED TO DENYING YOUR VOICE HERE. YEAH. EVEN IF YOU DISAGREE, I WANT YOUR INPUT, BUT I I'M, I WOULD BE MORE UPSET THAT THE THERE WOULD BE UNFAIR, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE OF TIMES MONEY. OH, ESPECIALLY FOR SMALL BUSINESS OWNERS, SO. OH, I'M NOT AGAINST THE CONCEPT OF YOU HAVING A VOICE ON IT FOR SURE, BUT OH, I'D LEAVE IT ON UNLESS THE APPLICANT AGREED YOU COULD REACH OUT TO HIM AND WE COULD. WHEN IT CAME IN FOR NEXT MONTH, WE COULD SIMPLY TABLE IT TO THE FOLLOWING. BUT IF HE WANTED TO MOVE IT FORWARD NEXT MONTH, I THINK THAT WOULD BE HIS RIGHT. AS FAR AS A TIMELINE. YEAH, NOW THAT'S A FAIR POINT. FROM A LEGAL PERSPECTIVE, FOR A TEXT AMENDMENT, YOU HAVE 100 DAYS FROM THE FIRST MEETING AT WHICH THE MATTER IS REFERRED TO YOU. I'VE NEVER QUITE BEEN SURE WHAT THAT MEANS, BUT I'M PRETTY SURE IT'S THIS EVENING. SO THANK YOU. THAT WOULD. AND AND THAT 100 DAY TIMEFRAME IS, IS YOUR OBLIGATION TO VOTE, TO MAKE A RECOMMENDATION TO THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS. AND, AND TYPICALLY YOU VOTE FOLLOWING A PUBLIC HEARING. SO THAT WOULD ENABLE YOU TO COMPLY WITH THAT TIME FRAME IF YOU HAD IT IN AUGUST OR SEPTEMBER. OR IN OCTOBER. BUT IF YOU HAD IT IN OCTOBER, YOU WOULDN'T REALLY HAVE ANY WIGGLE ROOM TO TABLE IT, BECAUSE YOU'D BE 90 OR SO DAYS INTO YOUR 100 DAY CLOCK. BUMP UP YOUR TIMELINE. CAN WE DO THIS? HAVE THE PUBLIC HEARING NEXT MONTH. DELAY THE VOTE UNTIL SEPTEMBER. YOU HAVEN'T HELPED THE APPLICANT ANY? NO. THEN. THEN THAT'LL BE THE THING OF WHERE WE'RE PRE DETERMINING OUR VOTE. THAT WOULDN'T GO OVER WELL. EITHER EITHER. KICK IT DOWN THE ROAD A MONTH OR NOT. OH IT'S LEGAL. HE SAID IT'S LEGAL. IF YOU MAKE THE MOTION, I WOULDN'T BE DEAD AGAINST IT. WHAT'S LEGAL AND WHAT'S FAIR TO THE APPLICANT ARE TWO DIFFERENT THINGS. I'M TELLING YOU WHAT THE LAW IS. IT'S UP TO YOU TO DECIDE WHAT YOU WANT TO DO. WELL, A THOUGHT MIGHT BE, IS THAT AND THIS AGAIN, IS A THOUGHT. WE'LL HAVE THE APPLICANT HERE NEXT MONTH. IF YOU HAVE THE PUBLIC HEARING, POSTPONE THE CLOSING OF THE PUBLIC HEARING. BUT ALLOW THE APPLICANT TO SPEAK IF THE APPLICANT AGREES TO ONE MORE MONTH. THEN DON'T CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING. MR. GORDON CAN COME IN THE NEXT MONTH, IN SEPTEMBER. HERE. ANY BALANCE OF THE PUBLIC HEARING? HAVE TIME TO HAVE REVIEWED IT AND THEN. MR.. AND THEN CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND THEN MAKE YOUR VOTE. IF THE PROPERTY OWNER AND THE APPLICANT HAVE ISSUES WITH IT. THEN CLOSE THE PUBLIC HEARING AND EITHER TABLE IT OR MAKE A DECISION ONE WAY OR ANOTHER WITHOUT MR. GORDON. THAT WOULD BE KIND OF AN OPTION WITHOUT HAVING THE APPLICANT HERE TONIGHT, IT'S HARD FOR US TO TAKE ONE. [01:05:02] AND I LEFT MY CRYSTAL BALL BACK IN MY. SO JUST ONE MORE QUESTION TO COMPLICATE. SO BECAUSE THERE ARE KIND OF TWO THERE'S A TEXT AMENDMENT AND THEN A CP THAT'S TIED TO IT. AND WE ONLY TOOK ONE OFF THE CONSENT AGENDA. SO TECHNICALLY WE'VE ALREADY AUTHORIZED ADVERTISING THE CP. RCEP. HOW WOULD THAT WORK? WELL, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PULL THEM AS A SET IF YOU PULL THEM. YEAH. CAN WE RETROACTIVELY PULL THE SET OR VOTE SUBJECT TO APPROVAL OF F AMEND THE DEPENDING ON WHAT YOU WANT TO DO WITH THE TEXT AMENDMENT. WE CAN. FOR EXAMPLE, I COULD STEER YOU THROUGH A MOTION TO RECONSIDER AUTHORIZATION OF ADVERTISEMENT FOR THE CUP. WE CAN WHAT I NEED TO KNOW IS WHAT YOU WANT TO DO, AND THEN WE CAN FIGURE OUT THE PROCEDURAL RULES TO GET YOU THERE. WELL, IT SOUNDS LIKE WE BETTER LEAVE IT FOR ADVERTISING. OH, WE GOT IT. YEAH. WELL, WE GOT TO VOTE ON IT ANYWAY BECAUSE WE PULLED IT FROM APPROVING IT FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA. YEAH, WE'VE GOT A WE'VE GOT A VOTE. MODIFY THE CONSENT AGENDA OR LEAVE IT AS IT IS. BUT I GOT A QUESTION THAT'S PROBABLY GOING TO MUDDY THE WATER A WHOLE LOT. WE GOT INDUSTRIAL, YOU KNOW, OUR ZONING ELEMENTS WE HAVE, WHICH ALL HAVE TAXING CONSEQUENCES. HAVE WE EVER THOUGHT OF? OR DOES VIRGINIA ALLOW FOR LIGHT INDUSTRIAL WHERE IT'S TAXED AT A LOWER RATE THAN WHAT INDUSTRIAL IS? BECAUSE USUALLY IT IS A LOWER PROFIT OPERATION? LAND IS TAXED BASED ON ITS FAIR MARKET VALUE. AND SOME JURISDICTIONS DO HAVE MULTIPLE LEVELS OF INDUSTRIAL DISTRICTS. LIGHT INDUSTRIAL. HEAVY INDUSTRIAL. AND THEN THE QUESTION WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, WHAT USES ARE ALLOWED IN THOSE DISTRICTS AND THEN WHAT VALUE, YOU KNOW, ON THE MARKET. THERE'S A LOT THAT HAS THAT ZONING HOLD. I DON'T BUT YOU GUYS DON'T HAVE DISTRICTS THAT ARE BROKEN DOWN THAT WAY. AND SO THAT'S. SO FOR INSTANCE I OPENED LOUDON. THAT WOULD PROBABLY REQUIRE REWRITING OF. YEAH, THAT WOULD BE A WHOLE REWRITING OF THE ZONING DISTRICTS. WELL, I OPEN BOWLING OFFICE PARK AND ACROSS THE STREET WAS AIRBUS, AND THEY WERE TAXED AT A VERY DIFFERENT RATE BECAUSE THE COMPANY I WORKED FOR ALSO WAS THE DEVELOPER THAT AND BERMUDA OFFICE OR IT WAS INDUSTRIAL PARK WAS TAXED AT A DIFFERENT RATE AT A LOWER RATE BECAUSE IT WAS NOT THE SAME USE. THAT'S WHY I WAS GETTING TO IT, WHERE THE DEVELOPER DIDN'T NEED TO MAKE SURE HE'S MAKING, YOU KNOW, X NUMBER OF DOLLARS BECAUSE HE'S GOING TO HAVE A LESS OF EXPENSE. SO AIRBUS WAS PAYING LIKE BACK THEN, $30 A SQUARE FOOT. AND IN THE WAREHOUSE SPACES THEY WERE PAYING TEN, SEVEN, SEVEN, 50 TO 10 BUCKS. WELL, REALLY WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS BECAUSE ALL REAL PROPERTY IS TAXED AT THE SAME RATE. WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS VALUATION, BECAUSE THE COMMISSIONER OF REVENUE LOOKS AT REAL PROPERTY AS OF JANUARY 1ST OF EVERY YEAR AND SAYS, WELL, WHAT IS IT? WHAT AM I GOING TO ASSESS IT? WHAT'S ITS FAIR MARKET VALUE. AND THEN WE JUST MULTIPLY THE RATE TIMES THAT. WELL IF YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT IS IT'S IT'S ZONED AGRICULTURAL. SO THAT RIGHT GETS A DIFFERENT MULTIPLIER. INDUSTRIAL GETS A DIFFERENT. AND THEN YOU KNOW RESIDENTIAL. BUT WHAT I'M LOOKING WHAT I'M SUGGESTING IS IS THERE ONE IN BETWEEN LIGHT INDUSTRIAL WHERE IT ISN'T A PROFIT AS PROFITABLE AS INDUSTRIAL. YEAH. YOUR CURRENT DISTRICTS ARE AG AND YOU'VE GOT A VARIETY OF RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS, RIGHT? COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL. INDUSTRIAL. RIGHT. SO YOU JUST DON'T HAVE THAT MANY DIFFERENT DISTRICTS, RIGHT? YEAH. WE HAD DRAFTED A ORDINANCE TO ADOPT LIGHT INDUSTRIAL IN WHEN THE DATA CENTER APPLICATION CAME IN BECAUSE WE WERE LOOKING AT IF WE PUT DATA CENTERS IN LIGHT INDUSTRIAL, WE'D HAVE TO REZONE IT AND THEN REZONING IT WOULD WOULD REQUIRE THE PROPER, YOU KNOW, ALLOW US TO GET THE PROPER SUPPORT. THEY COULDN'T JUST COME IN TO AN INDUSTRIAL. THEY'RE NOT LIKE AN INDUSTRIAL WELL. WELL, IN ANY CASE, THAT WAS THE LOGIC. OKAY. AND THE BOARD AT THE TIME DID NOT WANT TO DO THAT. OKAY. SO WE DID DRAFT A LIGHT INDUSTRIAL ORDINANCE, OKAY. BUT IT NEVER WENT THROUGH. AND WE NEVER CONSIDERED THAT DURING THE COMP PLAN BECAUSE OF THAT, I THINK WHEN WE WERE REVIEWING THE COMP PLAN, WE DECIDED AGAINST THAT. SO I WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD ASSESS THE LAND USE. AND I SAY IT SAYS REVIEW THE LAND USE FOR ITS MERIT IN THE AGRICULTURAL ZONING DISTRICT AND COMPARE IT TO THE SCOPE AND SCALE OF WHAT YOU MIGHT SEE [01:10:07] AS WHAT WE CAME FOR EARLIER LAST YEAR WITH THE WITH THE WAREHOUSE, THE CONTRACTOR STORAGE YARDS. EXCUSE ME. OKAY. AND THEN JUST KIND OF LIKE, I MEAN THAT TO ME, THE SCALE OF THAT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE THAN WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE. AGAIN, IT IS, IT'S A IT'S IT'S A COMMERCIAL USE IN AN AGRICULTURAL DISTRICT. BUT THE SCALE OF IT MIGHT NOT BE AT THAT POINT WHERE YOU COULD CONSIDER IT AN INDUSTRIAL USE. SO I MEAN, IF I, IF I MIGHT JUST FRAME THE, YOU KNOW, BRING US BACK TO THE ISSUE BEFORE YOU, WHICH IS BECAUSE THIS IS A CITIZEN INITIATED TEXT AMENDMENT, EVEN IF YOU'RE AGAINST IT AS A BODY AND YOU VOTE NOT TO RECOMMEND IT, WE DO STILL WANT TO HAVE SOME ADVERTISEMENT AND PUBLIC HEARING. AND SO WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS WHEN IS THAT GOING TO OCCUR? IS IT GOING TO OCCUR AT THE NEXT MEETING WHEN MR. GORDON ISN'T HERE, OR DO YOU WANT TO SCHEDULE IT FOR THE SUBSEQUENT MEETING OUT WHEN HE WHEN HE WILL BE HERE AND I, I THINK THAT IT IS YOUR CUSTOM THAT I HAVE OBSERVED THAT WHEN YOU HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING, THE MATTERS THAT ARE LISTED ON YOUR AGENDA UNDER PUBLIC HEARINGS, YOU TAKE A VOTE AFTER EACH OF THEM DOESN'T EXPRESSLY SAY ACTION ITEMS, BUT THAT'S WHAT YOU DO. AND IF YOU HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING ON THAT MATTER AT YOUR NEXT MEETING, MY ADVICE WOULD BE TO TAKE A VOTE ON IT AND TO FOLLOW YOUR UNWRITTEN CUSTOM TO DO THAT. AND YOU COULD TABLE IT UNTIL MR. GORDON'S BACK AT THE YOU KNOW, BUT I IF I DO THINK WHENEVER YOU HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING THAT YOU SHOULD HAVE SOME, YOU KNOW, VOTE EITHER TO TABLE IT OR ACT ON IT, PERHAPS SOME SORT OF CLOSURE. YEAH. YEAH, I AGREE WITH THAT. A COUPLE UNRELATED TO THIS, BUT SO FOR CHASE. SO I THINK YOU MISSED IN THE VILLAGE RESIDENTIAL. IT'S WE SHOULD CHANGE THE HOME SERVICE BUSINESS. YEAH, IT'S LISTED THERE TOO. WE MISSED IT. WE MISSED IT IN VILLAGE, YOU SAID. OKAY. AND THEN AS I COVER THAT IN MY COVER SHEET SAYING IT'S ONLY IN COMMERCIAL, CLEARLY, I FULLY MISSED IT. HOW WOULD YOU ADD THAT BACK IN? HOW WOULD YOU GUYS FEEL ABOUT ADDING IT AS A USE IN THE INDUSTRIAL? I MEAN, RIGHT NOW IT IS A BUY RIGHT USE ON THE COMMERCIAL, WHICH TO ME MAKES TOTAL SENSE. SHOULD THIS BE A USE IN THE INDUSTRIAL? ALSO, SHOULD IT BE A SPECIAL USE PERMIT IN THE INDUSTRIAL? YEAH, I MEAN IT SHOULD BE JUST AUTOMATIC SOMETHING LIKE THIS IN INDUSTRIAL. ABSOLUTELY. BE MORE ALMOST MORE BUY RIGHT. YEAH. RIGHT. AND THE INDUSTRIAL IS FINE WITH THAT TOO. I MEAN, IT MAKES SENSE THAT THIS WOULD FIT IN THE INDUSTRIAL. OH AS FAR AS THE LANGUAGE IS CONCERNED, HOW DO I DIFFERENTIATE THIS STORAGE FACILITY WITH PAID EMPLOYEES ON SITE CAN WALK IN CUSTOMERS FROM ABC PAINT COMPANY THAT'S GOT ONE BAND AND HE'S WORKING OUT OF HIS BASEMENT. IN OTHER WORDS, I DON'T WANT YOU TO USE THIS AGAINST THAT GUY. TO TELL HIM HE'S GOT TO COME IN FOR A CUP. IS HE STILL. IS HE STILL PROTECTED UNDER THE HOME OCCUPATION THING? YEAH. IF THERE'S NO VISIBLE SIGN OF THE BUSINESS FROM THE OUTSIDE AND HE WANTS TO RUN IT, HE. HE CAN DO THAT UNDER A CERTIFICATE OF ZONING FOR THAT. AND THEN HE JUST I MEAN, HIS WORK TRUCK IS HIS WORK TRUCK. HE'S ALLOWED TO HAVE ONE. AND IF HE HAS EMPLOYEES, IT'S A DIFFERENT STORY. BUT IF THEY DON'T, HE CAN HAVE EMPLOYEES. THEY JUST CAN'T WORK. THEY MEET ON SITE. THEY MEET ON SITE THAT CAN'T BE AT THAT PROPERTY. RIGHT, RIGHT. RIGHT, RIGHT. SO, AND IF WE WERE TO PASS THIS, THEY SAY THIS GOES INTO EFFECT. WHY WOULD ANY OF THESE BUSINESSES REMAIN IN THE COMMERCIAL? SO, I MEAN, BACK TO MATT'S POINT OF A SMALL BUSINESS IS GOING TO GO OUT IN THE AG BECAUSE IT'S CHEAPER. WELL, WHY WOULDN'T EVERYBODY DO? YOU DON'T HAVE TO VOTE YES ON EVERYONE IF IT DOESN'T FIT THE NEIGHBORHOOD. BUT WHAT IF IT'S ALL THE BIGGER LOTS AND IT'S VERY RESIDENTIAL? YOU KNOW, IF IT'S A 20 ACRE LOT AND HE'S GOT PLENTY OF SETBACK, BUT IT'S NOT VISIBLE FROM THE ROAD, YOU BEST SMALL BUSINESSES ARE STARTING THEM DON'T FIT IN. AND THEN IT JUST I GUESS WE WE SEE THE AGRICULTURAL DISTRICT IS VERY DIFFERENT AND WELL IT'S I'M A SECOND GENERATION CONTRACTOR. WHEN MY DAD STARTED EXCAVATING COMPANY, I WAS IN WHEN HE GOT OUT OF VIETNAM, MY MOM PACKED HIM A SANDWICH AND FOLDED IT ON HALF A PIECE OF BREAD, AND HE HAD AN OLD PICKUP TRUCK, AND WE HAD A BUILDING OUTSIDE WITH HAND TOOLS IN IT, IN AN OLD DRUM. AND HE WENT TO WORK. AND WHEN HE COME HOME, THE OLD EQUIPMENT WE HAD, AND I'D FILL THOSE OLD JUGS UP AND PUT THEM BACK ON THE TRUCK AND PUMP FUEL ON BY HAND [01:15:03] AT DARK, AND HE'D BE GONE BEFORE THE SUN COULD COME UP THE NEXT DAY. SO WE STARTED RUNNING A BUSINESS. THE OFFICE WAS THIS CORNER OF THE KITCHEN TABLE, AND THAT'S HOW HE FED US. HE DIDN'T GO TO COLLEGE. THAT WASN'T AN OPTION FOR HIM. THE BEST BUSINESSES ARE STARTED THAT WAY. AND THEN THEY MOVED TO A BASEMENT AND THEY MADE IT INTO A HOME GARAGE. AND THEY CANNOT START A BUSINESS LIKE THAT IN THE COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL. YOU'LL NEVER GET OFF THE GROUND THAT WAY. IT IS SO HARD, YOU CAN'T EVEN FATHOM HOW MUCH MONEY IT WOULD TAKE TO GET THERE. WITH 1 OR 2 EMPLOYEES, IT WOULD BANKRUPT ME AND I'M MAKING DECENT MONEY. I'M NOT A RICH PERSON, BUT I'M MAKING A VERY GOOD, COMFORTABLE LIVING. I EARN IT, I FEEL LIKE BECAUSE I PUT IN A LOT OF HOURS, AND THE OTHER PART OF ME HAVING THAT BUSINESS AT HOME, PUTTING THOSE EXTRA HOURS IN AROUND THE HOUSE, LOADING THOSE TRUCKS AND STUFF. IT STILL GIVES ME THE OPPORTUNITY TO BE HOME, TO OVERLAP WITH MY FAMILY STUFF. MY KIDS AND GRANDKIDS CAN FOOL WITH ME OUT IN THE YARD WHILE I'M PUMPING THAT FUEL ON THE TRUCK AGAIN, OR LOADING THAT PIPE FOR THE NEXT DAY. BUT IF I WAS ANY BIGGER, YOU KNOW, IF I HAD TEN, 15 GUYS. YEAH, I'D NEED A LITTLE COMMERCIAL SITE, BUT I THAT'S THAT'S NOT GOING TO BE MY LONG TERM GOAL. I WON'T LIVE LONG ENOUGH TO SEE THAT. BUT FROM WHERE I STARTED AT, WE'VE MADE GOOD PROGRESS. BUT TO YOU KNOW AND IT'S AND I WON'T NAME THEM ALL JUST FOR FEAR THEY'D BE ATTACKED. BUT I CAN NAME ALL 20 CONTRACTORS THAT LIVE IN THE FORK DISTRICT THAT RUN THOSE BUSINESSES OUT OF THEIR HOME, AND WITHOUT THEM, THEY ARE A VERY IMPORTANT PART OF THIS COMMUNITY AND INDUSTRY. AND IF THEY WERE FORCED OUT OF THAT AREA INTO THE COMMERCIAL INDUSTRIAL, THEY SIMPLY WOULD NOT BE HERE AND WE WOULDN'T HAVE THEIR SERVICES. THEY'D HAVE TO GO TO WORK FOR A LARGER COMPANY. THEY'D BE COMMUTING BACK DOWN THE CITY. AND THAT'S WHAT THAT'S WHAT WE DID BEFORE WE WORKED AT HOME. I WOULD ARGUE THAT WHAT YOU'RE DESCRIBING IS DIFFERENT THAN THIS, THOUGH. IT IS. IT IS DIFFERENT THAN THIS ONE. BUT I WANT SOME DIFFERENTIATION IN THE LANGUAGE. IF IT'S NOT PROTECTED UNDER HOME OCCUPANCY, WE'RE YEAH, WE'RE WE'RE TALKING ABOUT AN OFFICE BUILDING THAT YOU CAN ALSO USE AS A STORAGE AREA. IT DOES NOT MEAN THIS IS NOT A LAY DOWN YARD. THIS COULD BE JUST A STRAIGHT OFFICE BUILDING WITH NO STORAGE. WELL, YEAH, THIS ONE. THIS ONE COULD BE. BUT I WAS JUST ASKING TO MAKE SURE THAT THAT THERE WERE, THAT THE HOME OCCUPANCY WAS STILL PROTECTED IN THIS. OKAY. THIS COULDN'T BE USED AS A TOOL TO PUT THEM UNDER A MORE STRINGENT REGULATION. SO HE SAID YEAH, YEAH. NO, HOME OCCUPANCY IS A BUY, RIGHT? OUR VIEW IS THAT THERE ARE DIFFERENT USES AND THEY STACK. SO IT DOESN'T AFFECT THE HOME OCCUPANCY USE. IT'S ANOTHER DIFFERENT TYPE OF USE THAT LAYERS ON TOP OF IT. CORRECT. AND ITEM F ALWAYS WILL REQUIRE A CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. SO YOU WILL STILL SEE EACH ONE. YOU GET A CHANCE TO EVALUATE IT. SO IT SOUNDS LIKE MAYBE PEOPLE WOULD LIKE TO SEE THE LANGUAGE REWORDED TO NOT HAVE A RETAIL SPACE. MAYBE WE SEND THIS BACK TO STAFF. STAFF WORKS REWORKS THE LANGUAGE AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE NEXT MONTH AND WE HEAR IT IN SEPTEMBER. DOES DOES THIS DOES THIS THIS WOULDN'T ALLOW A RETAIL SPACE. IT WOULD. SO I'M SORRY. SO YOU'RE BASICALLY SAYING TO CONVERT IT TO PURE STORAGE AND STAGING. WELL I DON'T I DON'T LIKE THAT EITHER. BUT AT LEAST IT'D BE BETTER THAN AN OFFER. I WOULD ARGUE THAT IT'S CLASSIFIED BY A CONTRACTOR STORAGE YARD. THEN I DON'T. WELL, I DON'T WANT THAT EITHER. BUT JUST TO INTERJECT, I MEAN, THIS IS A CITIZEN INITIATED TEXT APPLICATION. AND SO SOMETIMES WE DO TAKE A LITTLE BIT OF LIBERTY. AND, YOU KNOW, FOR EXAMPLE, THIS WAS HOME SERVICES AND I MADE THE SUGGESTION THAT IT SHOULD BE BUILDING SERVICES. BECAUSE IF YOU'RE DOING HVAC, DOES IT REALLY MATTER WHETHER YOU'RE DOING IT FOR A HOUSE OR A SMALL OFFICE BUILDING? AND IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE. BUT I THINK WE ARE IN LARGE PART DRIVEN BY WHAT THE APPLICANT IS ASKING US TO AMEND IT TO. AND DOES THE APPLICANT PROPOSE? THEY DIDN'T. I PULLED UP THE APPLICATION AND IT DOESN'T SPECIFICALLY SAY RETAIL. IT JUST SAYS ADD HOME SERVICES TO THE CURRENT CUP. BUT DO YOU KNOW WHETHER THEY WANT TO DO RETAIL? SO THEY WANT TO PRIMARILY HAVE IT AS A SUPPORT LOCATION FOR THEIR EXISTING BUSINESS. SO IT IS MAINLY FOR THE STORAGE AND STAGING. BUT YOU KNOW, IT'S NEVER INDICATED THAT IT WOULD NEVER HAVE THAT IN THE FUTURE. YOU KNOW, IF IT WERE EXPANDED INTO AN OFFICE TO ALLOW FOR SOME OF THAT AS WELL. SO I DON'T KNOW IF HE NECESSARILY WANTED TO SHUT THE DOOR ON THAT. HE HAS A STATEMENT OF JUSTIFICATION THAT HE GAVE ME EARLIER TODAY. ACTUALLY, AND I APOLOGIZE. I ACTUALLY DON'T THINK I MADE COPIES OF THAT. I'LL MAKE SURE YOU HAVE IT. IT'S IN THE CFP. IT IS? YEAH. IF YOU LOOK ON THE CFP AND THE CFP DOES STATE THAT THEIR PRINCIPAL OFFICE AND BASE OF OPERATIONS REMAIN AT 702 NORTH COMMERCE AVENUE [01:20:01] HERE IN TOWN, AND THAT THIS SITE WILL BE PRIMARILY FOR STORAGE AND SERVE AS A STAGING AREA FOR INSTALLATION. SO KIND OF GETTING EVERYTHING TOGETHER FOR THE WORK TRUCKS, GETTING READY TO GO OUT TO THE SITE. AND I THINK THAT THAT'S KIND OF THE INTENT. PLUS HE'S THIS PROPERTY DOES HAVE A LARGE GATE, A LITTLE BIT MORE SECURITY THAN MAYBE YOU WOULD HAVE RIGHT IN TOWN FOR YOUR YOUR WORK VEHICLES, THOUGH. AND IT DOES STATE HE'D BE PARKING BEHIND THE BUILDING, THE MAIN BUILDING. SO THEY THEY DON'T HAVE A SHOWROOM THEY DON'T NEED THEY DON'T HAVE A SHOWROOM. THINK ABOUT A PLUMBER, HVAC. WHAT ARE THEY GOING TO SHOW YOU? WELL, THERE'S YOUR AIR CONDITIONER, RIGHT? I MEAN, BASICALLY YOU'RE JUST SITTING DOWN AND YOU'RE PROBABLY LOOKING AT WHAT SIZE YOU'RE GOING TO NEED. WELL, THE LAST TIME I WAS IN THERE WAS LIKE THREE EMPLOYEES IN THERE, IN TWO PRIVATE OFFICES. SO. THAT'S RIGHT. OCCASIONALLY SOMEBODY MIGHT HAVE COME IN AND SIGN A CONTRACT OR SOMETHING OR. YEAH, BUT IT'S NOT A GIVE A PAYMENT DOWN PAYMENT. IT'S NOT A RETAIL. IT'S MORE OF AN OFFICE. IT'S NOT 7-ELEVEN. CONCERN WAS THAT WE MIGHT BE GOING AGAINST WHAT THE APPLICANT WAS ASKING FOR, BUT IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT'S NOT REALLY A VALID CONCERN. AND SO IF YOU GUYS WANT US TO TO GO BACK TO THE DRAWING BOARD AND CARVE OUT RETAIL, THAT I THINK THAT IS SOMETHING WE CAN DO WHILE REMAINING IN KEEPING WITH THE APPLICANT'S REQUEST. I'M NOT AGAINST TAKING RETAIL OUT EITHER, BECAUSE THAT'S NOT I'M IN FAVOR OF TAKING RETAIL OUT. I DON'T LIKE THE WHOLE THING. IF WE AT LEAST TAKE RETAIL OUT, WE'RE MAKING SOME PROGRESS. BUT LET'S LOOK AT THIS DIFFERENT WAY. HOW IS THAT GOING TO AFFECT THE FARMERS THAT ARE SELLING THEIR WINE THERE? THAT'LL BE THEY'LL BE EXEMPT UNDER AGRITOURISM. IT WON'T AFFECT THEM. EVEN THE FARMER THAT'S GOT SELMA'S APPLES AT THE HEIGHT OF HIS LOT, I DON'T THINK. I DON'T THINK A BUILDING SERVICES AMENDMENT WILL AFFECT THE FORM. OKAY. I'M JUST. YEAH. YEAH. I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THE AGRICULTURAL. IT DOESN'T. IT DOESN'T GROW INTO. IT DOESN'T ACTUALLY HURT. LIKE I WAS ON THE WHOLE MARKET. SO YOU'RE CHECKING IT FOR FARMING? I WAS CHECKING IT FOR A WHOLE MONTH. YEAH. OKAY. FAIR. OKAY. WOULD EVERYBODY BE AMENABLE TO STAFF BRINGING US BACK NEXT MONTH? HE COULD DO IT. AND WE COULD STILL ADVERTISE IT AND HAVE IT ON TIME FRAME FOR NEXT MONTH. OKAY. ME WITH THE WITH THE REMOVING THE RETAIL OUT OF IT. OR DO YOU NEED ANOTHER MONTH? WE'LL NEED TO KNOW WHAT WE'RE DRAFTING AND HAVE IT DRAFTED. TO PROPERLY ADVERTISE IT. SO I WOULD DELAY THE AUTHORIZATION IF WE WERE GOING TO CHANGE IT. OKAY. IF YOU WOULD SUPPORT THE SEPTEMBER MEETING. SEPTEMBER? WELL, YEAH. SO NEXT MONTH, WE'LL NEED TO NEED TO OFFER AUTHORIZED ADVERTISING. CORRECT. CORRECT. SEPTEMBER. SO. SO WE NEED TO RECONSIDER AS WELL, THEN. YEAH, WE NEED TO RECONSIDER. RECONSIDER AND THEN TABLE IT. YEAH. YES. SO IF YOU'RE LOOKING TO RECONSIDER THE ACCOMPANYING CUP APPLICATION, AND IF YOU WANT SUGGESTED LANGUAGE FOR THAT, MY SUGGEST WOULD BE THAT SOMEONE MAKE A MOTION TO RECONSIDER ITEM G FROM THE CONSENT AGENDA. MR. CHAIR, I MOVE THAT THE PLANNING COMMISSION RECONSIDER ITEM G UNDER THE CONSENT AGENDA. SECOND. ALL THOSE IN FAVOR? AYE. OPPOSED? SO MOVED. AND I THINK I THINK I DON'T HAVE ROBERT'S RULES IN FRONT OF ME, BUT I THINK WHAT THAT DOES NOW IS, IS PUT US BACK INTO A SITUATION WHERE WE STILL NEED A SUBSTANTIVE MOTION ON ITEM G. AND SO AT THIS POINT, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR WOULD BE TO A MOTION TO BRING IT FORWARD FOR AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE AT THE NEXT MEETING. SO DO WE. DO WE NEED F AND G? YEAH, JUST REMOVE F. F'S ALREADY OFF THE CONSENT AGENDA. NEED A MOTION TO REMOVE G ALSO. WELL, I WAS GOING TO SAY SO G. DO WE NEED A MOTION BECAUSE WE'VE TAKEN AN ACTION REGARDING IT ALREADY. AND THEREFORE WE NEED TO DO SOMETHING WITH IT. BECAUSE F WE'RE GOING TO JUST NOT DO ANYTHING WITH. WE WOULDN'T NEED TO MAKE A MOTION ON THAT. YEAH. WE CAN'T DO ANYTHING TO G ON THE LEFT BESIDE IT. SO WE NEED TO AMEND BOTH OF THEM TO MOVE BOTH OF THEM. FOR BOTH OF THEM THE NEXT MONTH. WELL, RIGHT. BUT BUT NORMALLY, IF STAFF IS GOING TO REWORK SOMETHING AND BRING IT BACK, YOU WOULDN'T YOU WOULDN'T NORMALLY MAKE A MOTION. NORMALLY MAKE A MOTION TO TO RECONSIDER AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE. I UNDERSTAND MR. GORDON'S POINT, AND I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT. BUT IN THIS CIRCUMSTANCE, GIVEN THAT THERE'S A LITTLE CONFUSION, I THINK MAYBE WE PROVIDE A LITTLE OVER DIRECTION TO STAFF, AND SOMEONE JUST MAKES A MOTION. THAT ITEM F AND G FROM TONIGHT'S CONSENT AGENDA BE PLACED ON NEXT MONTH'S CONSENT AGENDA FOR AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE. [01:25:01] DO WE DO WE NEED TO AMEND THE FIRST MOTION WE MADE OR DO WE HAVE? WELL, I THINK THAT YOU YOU HAVE MADE THERE'S BEEN A MOTION TO RECONSIDER. RIGHT. AND SO THIS NEW MOTION TO TO PUT IT ON THE CONSENT AGENDA FOR THE NEXT MEETING IS WHAT YOU HAVE, WHAT YOU PREVIOUSLY DID IN VOTING TO AUTHORIZE ADVERTISEMENT HAS NOW BEEN UNDONE. AND THE DIRECTION YOU'RE GIVING TO US TO PUT IT ON THE AGENDA FOR THE NEXT MEETING IS NOW THE NEW ACTION ONLY FOR ITEM G, THE REST OF THE CONSENT AGENDA IS STILL A MOTION TO APPROVE BEEN APPROVED. SO SHOULD THAT BE INCLUDED WITH G IN THE F F EXCESSIVE BUT IT DOESN'T HURT. F WAS REMOVED. WHAT? IT F WAS REMOVED AT THE END, BUT IT PUTS IT ON FOR NEXT MONTH. IT'S GIVING US DIRECTION TO TAKE F AND G AND PUT THEM ON THE CONSENT AGENDA FOR NEXT MONTH. WELL, WE DID THAT IN OUR FIRST WHEN WE DIDN'T ACCEPT THAT AS PART OF THE WE DID THAT ON F, WE DO THAT ON F O. YOU'VE ALREADY DONE IT FOR F, RIGHT? YES. YOU'RE RIGHT. SO WHAT WE NEED TO DO IS ALL YOU NEED TO DO IS DO A. OH YEAH. NO, I KNOW, NOT YOU. IT'S BEDTIME AT 830. I'M THE OLD FART HERE. AND I GOT THE GRADE HERE. OKAY. MR. CHAIRMAN, I MOVE THAT Q P 2020 576 BUILDING SERVICE ESTABLISHMENT ON 318 OR 3812 GUARD HILL ROAD BE APPROVED TO ADVERTISE FOR THE AUGUST PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING. AND IF I JUST APPOINT A CLARIFICATION, WE'RE NOT APPROVING IT TO ADVERTISE JUST YET. WE'RE WE'RE MAKING A MOTION TO PLACE IT ON THE CONSENT AGENDA AT THE NEXT MEETING FOR AUTHORIZATION TO ADVERTISE WHAT HE SAID. SECOND IS THAT IS THAT A VALID AMENDMENT? ALL THOSE IN FAVOR OF THE WORD SALAD, PLEASE SAY AYE. AYE. OPPOSED? I SAID IT. ANYBODY? I THINK IT WAS 30 MINUTES AGO. I ASKED FOR MR. WENDLING COMMENTS. DO WE NEED TO WAKE UP, ALLISON? NO. OH, NO. OH, NO. PLEASE LOOK AWAY. DID THEY PULL SOMETHING ELSE? NO. WE ADDED K TO THE ADVERTISEMENT. WE HAD A K. OH, WE ADDED K. OKAY. YEAH. YEAH. MY COMMENTS ARE THAT AFTER 20 YEARS OF WORKING WITH THE COUNTY. [VIII. Commission Matters] THIS IS MY LAST PLANNING COMMISSION MEETING. I'LL OFFICIALLY BE RETIRED AUGUST 1ST. THE 31ST IS THE LAST DAY AS AN EMPLOYEE HERE WITH THE COUNTY. IT HAS BEEN A VERY THE LIFE FULL TIME AT TIMES, AND OTHER TIMES IT'S BEEN A LITTLE CHALLENGING, BUT I'VE ALWAYS ENJOYED WORKING WITH YOU AS PLANNING COMMISSIONERS AND WORKING WITH MRS. MILLER AS A BUSINESS OWNER HERE IN THE COUNTY AND, AND YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN A VERY GOOD EXPERIENCE FOR ME. AND I WILL BE LOOKING AT THESE PERIODICALLY FOR MY LA-Z-BOY AND SHOUTING AT MR. JENKINS ABOUT WHAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SAY ABOUT THESE THINGS. I'M NOT SURE, BUT WHETHER I'M IN AGREEMENT OR NOT. BUT IN ANY CASE IT'S IT'S BEEN A REAL PLEASURE. AND ALSO TO WORK WITH THE GREAT STAFF THAT I HAVE WORKING WITH ME NOW. SO I LOOK FORWARD. I WISH THE BEST OF YOU. AND I'LL BE HERE PERIODICALLY. I'LL MAKE SURE THAT EVERYTHING IS HOPEFULLY YOU'RE COMING AND HECKLE AT HIS NEXT MEETING. YEAH. WELL, MR. JENKINS, I CAN SEE IT NOW. YEAH. I GOT THE HAIR. I'M GETTING THERE A LITTLE BIT, YOU KNOW. HE'S GOOD. I JUST NEED A COUPLE OF T SHIRTS FROM HIM, YOU KNOW? SO WE'LL WE'LL WE'LL COME UP HERE IN TANDEM AND AND DO IT. BUT ANY, ANY CASE AND YEAH. AND THAT'S REALLY ALL I HAVE THIS EVENING. BUT AGAIN, IT'S BEEN A REAL PLEASURE WORKING WITH ALL OF YOU. ON THAT HAPPY NOTE. YOU GOT ANYTHING FOR PHIL? MAN, IT'S BEEN GREAT WORKING WITH YOU. AND JUST AS I'VE MENTIONED BEFORE, I WON'T BE HERE NEXT MONTH. SO I'LL SEE YOU ALL IN SEPTEMBER. OKAY. SCOTT. WELL, MAN, OVER THE LAST SIX YEARS, THANK YOU FOR EVERYTHING. I'VE ENJOYED THE TIME I'VE WORKED WITH YOU ONE ON ONE. SO WE'LL MISS YOU. OH, YEAH, I'D SAY IS. IT HAS BEEN A PLEASURE. AND SPEAKING FROM THIS CHAIR AND ALSO FROM THE OTHER LAZY BOY OUT THE ROAD A LITTLE BIT, PLEASE DON'T BE A STRANGER. ARE YOU BUSY DOING YOUR DOGS OR SOMETHING? COME RIGHT ON. THANK YOU. WELL, I WISH YOU THE ABSOLUTE BEST. [01:30:02] YOU'VE BEEN. YOU'VE BEEN AN ASSET TO THE COMMUNITY IN THE COUNTY, AND YOU'RE JUST LUCKY I'M RUNNING UNOPPOSED BECAUSE I TOOK YOU UP ON THAT CAMPAIGN MANAGER OPTION. SO HOW DID YOU GET THAT? IT WAS A PLEASURE WORKING WITH YOU SO MANY YEARS AGO, WHEN WE FIRST CAME TO THE COUNTY AND WALKING US THROUGH THE PROCESS OF OBTAINING THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT. YOU KNOW, IT WAS VERY INUNDATING THEN, AND IT SOUNDS LIKE IT'S CONTINUING TO BE AN INUNDATING PROCESS NOW. BUT, YOU KNOW, I'M SORRY I DIDN'T GET TO WORK WITH YOU LONGER. BUT I HOPE THAT YOU ENJOY YOUR TIME AWAY. I THINK YOU WELL EARNED IT. THANK YOU. AND THE ACCOLADES KEEP COMING. CHASE ARE YOURS. COME A LITTLE LATER. KEYWORD LITTLE. SO I'LL HAVE MY OWN PERSONAL THANK YOU FOR MATT TO GIVE HIM THAT YOU GUYS WON'T BE PRIVY TO. SO I'LL JUST GIVE A GENERIC CONGRATULATIONS. I'LL GIVE HIM A GENERIC CONGRATULATIONS FOR NOW FROM, YOU KNOW, MY MY HEART. BUT I DID WANT TO GIVE YOU AN UPDATE. THE SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL APPLICATION WE HAD THAT HAD THE VARIANCE CASE. I HAD TO GO TO THE BCA. THE VARIANCE WAS THEY FAILED TO APPROVE THE VARIANCE. AND SO THEY'RE EVALUATING MOVING THE STRUCTURE TO A COMPLIANT LOCATION. I'M ASSUMING WHEN THEY GET THAT DONE, THEY WILL BE BACK TO YOU KNOW BRING THIS BACK FOR FOR THE SHORT TERM TOURIST RENTAL APPLICATION THAT IS YEAH, THAT'S ALL I HAVE. WE'LL SEE YOU NEXT MONTH. OKAY. KELLY, YOU'VE BEEN A STRANGER, SO WELCOME BACK. I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD OTHER THAN GODSPEED TO ALL OF YOU WHEN ALLISON DOES THE MINUTES. BEFORE I START. SPEAKING OF WHICH, ALLISON. YEAH, I WILL ECHO THAT SENTIMENT. IF ANYBODY'S EARS START BURNING IN THE NEXT WEEK, IT'S BECAUSE I'M CURSING YOU ALL FOR THAT WORD SALAD I'M GOING TO HAVE TO DECIPHER. I'M GONNA BE CHECKING IT. WORD. WE APPROVED THE WORD. SO I AM AWARE THAT YOU APPROVE THE WORD SALAD. IT LIKE THEY WILL PROBABLY REPORT BACK TO YOU NEXT MONTH ABOUT HOW MANY TIMES I WILL SAY THANK GOD FOR JORDAN BLAMING ME FOR THE WORDS OUT. NO NO NO NO, I, I THANK YOU. BECAUSE EVERY NOW AND AGAIN YOU'LL STEP IN AND I'M LIKE, OH, A COMPREHENSIBLE SENTENCE. GREAT. YEAH. FAIR ENOUGH. BUT AGAIN, I WILL BE WANDERING OFF WITH YOUR IPADS FOR UPDATING. BRIDGET. YOU'RE STILL GOOD. I WILL TAKE YOURS. I WILL TAKE YOURS UP WITH THE REST OF THEM THE NEXT TIME AROUND. I'LL SEND YOU ALL AN EMAIL WHEN IT IS DONE WITH THEM SO YOU CAN COME RETRIEVE THEM. AND OTHER THAN THAT, I HAVE NOTHING. ALL RIGHT. WELL, JORDAN, SEEING HOW THAT YOU HAD THE FINGERS POINTED AT YOU. YOU GOT ANYTHING ELSE TO ADD? OH, MATT KNOWS I LIKE WORKING WITH THEM, AND I'VE GOT. ALL RIGHT. ON THAT HAPPY NOTE, WE WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADJOURN. SO MOVED. SECOND. DONE. NO, I DON'T WANT TO, BUT I DO WANT TO HAVE ONE FOR. * This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.